Derailing from the start, Lee and I will be in NYC for a meetup December 14, and that's probably our only option. We're flying in Thursday afternoon and out Saturday morning, which is not my preference but what we've got to work with now.

Let me be the first to suggest Fresh Salt.

A friend says it may take them a month to rebuild Fresh Salt as the high water mark was 6' and they've gutted the place. I'm not just saying this to machinate for something farther uptown.

And I can't make the 30th, am seeing some production of The Trojan Women at BAM that will doubtless involve jello and surprising gender revelations or something. Anyway I told a friend I'd go months ago.

About the 6' line, the salt isn't as fresh.

"About" s/b "Above". Also, I shouldn't mock flooding.

Let's say 28th just to pick a specific date. I am upset to hear that Fresh Salt has been submerged... sure there will be a replacement somewhere.

The 28th works for me.

I will be in California that week, unfortunately.

The 28th works but I'll be there around/after 8. The 26th is good as is the 29th and possibly the 30th but the 27th is straight out no way not gonna happen (unless folks is there after 9:30 and still planning on hanging out for a while). So I guess that's another OK for the 28th then. Sucks about Fresh Salt. It's almost like Mutombo died.

1. I'm also up for a meetup on the 14th of December with Thorn and Lee.

9: West Coast meetup! Probably with a smaller chance of hurricane!

I might be in NJ on the 14th. I'll try to make it to NYC for the meetup if I can.

Does anybody have good ideas for non-soggy venues?

The Upper West Side makes the most sense as a neighborhood, but I'd be picking a venue out of the phone book there. Blandings? Jackm? Smearcase?

UF-east: I am thinking perhaps the Plough on Museum Street, which is 10 mins walk either from Tottenham Court Road or Holborn.

The Plough sounds good to me.

For the record, this post is still future-dated for another 20 hours from now. When LB bumps it up, she really bumps it up.

I resent this post's privilege.

"Plough" is, of course, pronounced as "fresh salt".

17. I'm intrigued to learn that posts are bumped by future dating them rather than using a pin function as with various other software.

sometimes posts were bumped the old-fashioned way.

sometimes it was a la mode.

I have a philosophic type question. Let's assume a universe in which not all posts were bumped. Is that necessarily a universe in which no posts were bumped?

I'll go wherever, but I'm not a huge fan of the Campbell Apartment. It's a great space, but the drinks and the service leave something to be desired. If we want to do fancy cocktails in the Grand Central area, this place is not bad.

I suggested the CA mostly because it sprang to mind; you're right that it's not ideal. Actually, if you could think of someplace quiet in your neighborhood, that would be perfect. I'd have suggested someplace, but I never go drinking on the UWS.

I essentially don't either, but I'll give it some thought.

This time it's really going to work.

I want to say I did really like those hair extensions. It was a very nice valentine's day.

The plough sounds great to me, but I am lost for dates. I'm trying to scribble libels in the ocuntryside all this week (that typo will have to stand) and the 28th is oh shit tomorrow. Well consider me drunk in spirit at your elbows

I think the subject is more properly discussed here, without all that Lincoln talk to muck things up.

Hey, what gives? My valentines memories got erased.

they came back, right where I left them. anyway, I had a nice time. extensions are sexy.

How about Dive Bar?

I wanted to try that place out once but it was flooded.

Dive Bar sounds good to me -- I'll update the post when I get home.

I might well make it to the Plough. What sort of time will you be there from?

Talk of the London and New York meet-ups are, for the first time in I don't know how long, making me wish that I lived somewhere other than were I live, which is, both metaphorically and geographically, about as far away from both New York and London as one can get while still residing in the continental* United States. And yes, I do know that my wistfulness for the road not taken is of great interest to all of you.

* Added for teo's benefit.

Does anyone still read Von Wafer's comments?

7ish? I'm "working from home" tomorrow so I could actually be in the pub at like 3 but this would probably be a poor idea

Isn't there also an upcoming east bay meetup? I guess I'd try to make a southern California meetup, just so I could place a bet on the Halford-text doomsday fight.

It's funny how this thread jumps directly from 37 to 39. Must be a bug in the code.

37: If only there were an awesome and vibrant metropolitan area within an easy drive of you!

re: 36 and 39

7-ish suits me. I'm working from home tomorrow, I expect (floods). So if I leave the house around 6'ish, that should get me there for 7.

42: Sacramento isn't that vibrant.

||
FB has taken, in the past couple of days, to suggesting that I may know Ma/rtha Nu/ssbaum. I find this particularly perplexing given that she appears to have a single FB friend.
|>

45: I just searched for her and got some kind of page which doesn't appear to be a personal page, but something where people can "like" her. Anyway, I'm amused that it lists her profession as "Professor," and illustrates this with a photo of a white-haired balding man.

45: Me too. And everyone else I know. Is she paying for promotion or something???

45: you're all part of the same conspiracy?

48: Not me, though! And I am not sure she had a proper orthodox conversion.

Damnit, I always manage to leave NYC a day ahead of these meetups. Definitely sorry to miss ajay. I will probably miss Thorn, too, as I expect to be in one of our great midwestern cities that day.

Coincidentally, I was passing the planned venue for the 28th at the very moment I posted the comment.

There isn't a Boston meetup by any chance this week, is there?

Location-wise, Dive Bar is pretty much ideal, from my perspective.

||

No more hurricanes

Daughter 'Devastated' After Family Swept Away Saving Dog

Olivia Kuljian, 18, watched from the northern California beach Saturday as her brother, 16-year-old Gregory Kuljian, went into the rough surf after their dog was swept away by a 10-foot-wave. The Kuljian's parents then went in after Gregory, and all three were pulled out into the ocean by the rough surf. ... ... ... The dog survived the incident.

Sometimes I think I must be the worst person ever.

|>

46: Me too. I haven't mentioned her in any emails or anything. I had a similar thing recently--FB kept suggesting that I know the subject of one of my research projects, who died like 200 years ago. I don't think I've ever mentioned him by name on FB. He has six "friends."

38 -- Yes.

37 -- What continent do you think he's on? It's the same one I'm on. Not sure about you.

52: I think that was last week or the one before.

Er, mine was to 45. It recommends her as a friend, and she has one friend. Poor Martha Nussbaum.

52: I think something could probably be arranged. When are you in town? Do you know how to get in touch with me offblog?

56: I was under the impression that "Continental US" referred to the 48 contiguous states. Now I'm sure that I'm going to be embarrassed when it turns out I was wrong.

Charley, you totally freaked me out for nothing. That was very cruel.

56: do you want to change your answer?

52: Not that I know of, but if you're ever in NY I'm sure we could cobble one together.

63: hey! He's ours!

64: Is this going to get ugly? I mean, no reason why it shouldn't, everything else does lately.

I go to the northeast next week for a couple days but not to any meetup-near location, unfortunately.

Everybody hates it when mom and dad fight over polymath economists.

Fuck you, LB.

Brad, Friday is good for me, or perhaps later Thursday. I can tell you all about Steve Marg/lin trying to explain Keynes's General Theory to a smallish room of law students just this week. It is a fascinating story as you might imagine.

I'd totally go to a DeLong meetup. I can tell him a funny Larry Summers story I can't post in public. (Ok, it's not that funny, and I think I actually have posted it somewhere in the archives, but it's the only time I met Summers so it's the only story I have.)

Whenever works for me.

Some people also bristle at anointing oneself "dad" of a blog.

Ok, Oedipus.

Just getting "anoint" and "dad" in the same sentence is enough to creep me out, honestly.

People up here don't really say "Continental US" much; generally it's either "Lower 48" or "Outside."

I'll sign up for a DeLong meetup. Bave, I'll see your Steve Marglin story and raise you a Marty Feldstein story. (SP, I have to fold on a Larry Summers story. But I have a Bob Rubin story!)

Just getting "anoint" and "dad" in the same sentence is enough to creep me out, honestly

Put the heretic in the Box!

What time are you all planning on staying as I won't be able to make it there till close to 8.

The venue has been decided upon but for future meetups how does everyone feel about The Ginger Man on E 36th between 5th and Madison? I was there earlier today and it seemed like it might be a good place.

I'm jealous of this Boston meetup that has so abruptly taken over this NY meetup thread.

The venue has been decided upon but for future meetups how does everyone feel about The Ginger Man on E 36th between 5th and Madison? I was there earlier today and it seemed like it might be a good place.

We've had a couple there in the past, and the general consensus has been that it's too loud.

Lemieux used to do Ginger Man on Monday nights and it was fine. Later in the week it gets crowded and loud, and the clientele generally douchy.

77: I don't think I've ever left a bar before nine or so, so you should be fine.

Ginger Man also absolutely does not allow kids, which was an issue at one of the early meetups.

I'm jealous of this Boston meetup that has so abruptly taken over this NY meetup thread.

I can tell Dani Rod/rik and Jeff Sa/chs stories if that helps.

80: Ha! You left Fresh Salt about 7:30 when *I* was there. Not that I actually took notice or held a grudge all this time.

And retroactively we had a P'burgh mini-meetup this past Saturday night. Not that anyone is jealous. Nor does this comment sanctify the violation of off-blog communication.

Kind of one.

96th Street! I don't think I've ever been that far north in NY before. It will be an adventure. Thanks very much for organising, LB and Blandings.

Notice that the UF-East lot wait until I am out of the country before arranging a meetup. VERY WISE.

If anyone in DC wants to have a meetup, I'd be up for that. My table manners have improved!

[I sense furiously earnest off-blog communication going on as I type this comment.]

[Nah, everyone's busy reading the latest literary sensation.]

Hey, Stormcrow, how was your Thanksgiving?

[Felix Gilman's newest? (Which just came out.)]

89: No, you're wrong about that.

61 -- Sorry. I'm old. I still use 'contiguous.'

Oops, 92 -> 88.

88: [It's true. Lee and I are talking as I write this. Bum bum bum!]

My wife will be in NYC all next week. No, I'm not inflicting any of you on her.

90: Pretty good, Not bad; I can't complain. But actually all those Thanksgivings are about the same*.

Got done what we needed to do. Looting my father's tools at his insistence was a bit unnerving, though.

*Actually that was a topic of conversation, how most individual Thanksgivings all sort of blur together.

92: I was born with second sight into digital communications. (95: Talking is so ... meat-ish.) Also I rented my spare room to the NSA.

I am in Comunicado, a small California town founded by monks who took a vow of silence.

90, 97: Oh wait, you actually don't care do you? Damn, I always fall for that one--pretend to be interested in the person who you think needs it the most.

No, I actually do care (pathetic though that may be). The tool thing sounds like a nice set piece for a short story. Anyway, sorry it took me a minute to respond. I'm considering totally humiliating myself by writing a comment as an open letter to the front page posters.

On blog off blog communication. Cool.

You mean y'alls fathers didn't anoint? I was able to overlook the extensions, so I hope I can get a pass on dad's oil.

WINK ;)

101: "Take the shovel."
"We don't need another shovel."
"Take the shovel."
"We already have five shovels!"
"Well I don't need it."
"Neither do we."
...
"Did you take the shovel?"
...
...
"Why is there a shovel back here, we have about five of them?"
"Shut up and get in the car."

Dear FPPs,

Sorry to bug you with this, but I'd like to put in a request that you ban text about three weeks ago. I get that people think mcmanus is some kind of cute and radical pet to have around. And I get that he provides links. And I super-duper get that LB doesn't want to ban anyone, which is her prerogative. And I'm not threatening to go away if you don't heed what follows, but here's the thing: it's one thing to set up the blog as a giant troll-feeding mechanism, as has been the case lately, but tolerating these accusations of domestic violence is another thing entirely. Really, it's taken me a very long time to understand that the kewl kidz on the internets always play it kewl about everything. Fine and dandy, daddy-o. But this other thing, this thing about one commenter beating another commenter, that was horrible and despicable the first time it was uttered, and that text has toted it back out a few times lately is beyond the pale.

Anyway, feel free to ignore me. It's your blog to do with what you want. You've kept it alive and healthy for a very long time without my meddling, so I don't know where I get off butting in now. But I do hope you'll at least make some gesture to right this wrong, because I feel kind of sick about the whole thing. Yeah, as if it wasn't already apparent, I'm just not that kewl. Sorry to let you down, daddy-o.

All the best,

Von Wafer

Take the shovel, leave the canoli.

104 is good. I remember when my grandfather started trying to give me all of his shoes. I got off easy, though, because he wore something like an 8.5 while I'm closer to an 11. "Sorry, grandpa, but they don't fit."

Your short story is better than mine.

107.2: I find it flat and affectless.

Beat me daddy, eight to the bar.

...too soon?

108: and a really much too tight in the toes.

One almost gets the impression that 105 isn't addressed solely to its formal addressees.

111: yeah, I didn't feel like taking the time to send it out as an e-mail to all of you, and it felt important, while simultaneously stupid, to make it public. Like I said, this particular issue really gets under my skin.

Also, Vicodin probably. Plus a couple glasses of wine.

I thought one was not supposed to take alcohol while taking Vicodin?

You shouldn't make alcohol while taking Vicodin. First rule of home brewing.

Fine and dandy, daddy-o

Von Wafer is banned!

WINK ;)

I'm not putting those winks up there, but I'm cool with them though.

WINK ;)

114: when you have a fetching limp like mine, the rules don't apply.

If I have to wear the wink of shame, I think Von Wafer should have to take more Vicodin tonight.

WINK ;)

WTF has it been, four fucking years til the Waif can not take it anymore, this great injustice? How many years?

I was just thinking that their might some issues, considering recent setbacks so to speak, that would cause cosmic rage in many of us, with no appropriate or logical target? Rage that might be displaced or misplaced.

But an easy target is available. So easy.

Fuck you, Wafer, I have never hurt you, save by existing. And ST remains scum, even if you found in him a sympathetic shoulder from which to lean while you wax bilious and grumble maliciously. That guy is a serpent. You are just in pain.

halford, sifu and vw are gone? Hurray, i won! and text is my hero, now if JE and stras will be back i'll never show up here too, so that just peace and harmony will reign around here
seriously though their complaints sound soo, i dont know, pitiful, i dont know what would have happened to them if they were treated like i am treated through all the deletions
if to suppose they would get deleted which will never happen of course, that might be perceived like seriously the end of the world for them perhaps

119, 120, (soon to be deleted)121: Seldon Crisis!

This is the best unfogged day ever.

WINK ;)

Oh, good, that all went well.

120: bob, that you made that accusation, and that you then were so gutless as to claim that you were joking (and then that you weren't joking, because you were sure that it was true), isn't really the point. It's that someone else has chosen to drag that garbage out of the dumpster and throw it in all of our faces again.

Like a careless fregan behind the Whole Foods.

Look, all I have to say about the whole goddamn thing is that someone had better have brought cake.

And I'd threaten to sell the damn blog to the gypsies if dsquared wouldn't come out of the woodwork and call me a racist for it. (I mean, justifiably, of course.)

I know some gypsies who are looking to buy blogs and stuff.

WINK ;)

This is like the complete antithesis of THAT THREAD. #PrurienceFail 2012.

I love my life.

WINK ;)

After careful consideration I've decided that the problem with the blog is not enough swimming posts.

I'm just a lurker, but count me as another person who is sick of text. I don't know if he's having some sort of nervous breakdown or if this is all performance art, but it is really fucking tiresome.

As a compromise, maybe he can be allowed to ruin every other thread instead of every single one?

I think it's just swell that people decided to continue talking about that shit in this thread after that other one was closed.

I did not know that the other one was closed.

134: Anastamosis considered harmful.

133: 'Lurker' isn't a name.

"anastamosis" is a great word.

Off to swim read the next bit of Anna Karenina. It's good!

137: I'm not the poster of 133, but I'll co-sign it if it helps.

yeah, soon to be deleted which does not hurt btw if the people whom i addressed what i wanted to say read it that's enough for me, wouldnt want my comments with possibly many mistakes in english to be out there forever
sifu routinely abused BMcM but when he once allowed the same tactic towards sifu it becomes such a tragedy, darling sifu is fragile, hope he learns a little empathy and be back a little less bully

The thing about mcmanus is that he has genuine intellectual interests and substance, & when not provoked adds a lot to my experience of this place. "Vanity novelist" and "would-be chaos magician" seem to me much less vital, & I'd be happy to see text go the way of read.

I started reading AK once, but it made me depressed because I realized how much I resemble Karenin. I'm kind of bummed out about life in general right now. Partly because I seem to have said "it could always be worse" once too often and my life has turned into that story. Also work sucks, and I've been feeling poorly for awhile, and I want to be healthy but I can't make myself be. Speaking of which, how is alameida? I hope she is not super sick again.

I'd be happy to see text go the way of read.

I would be very unhappy if text unexpectedly showed up at my door, as read once did.

as read once did

No shit? And you didn't post about it? You dick!

Fuck, there went another hour of my life. I'm going to sleep now.

It was pretty weird.

so what? is it such a crime to like people to want to meet them if in the same town, meetups are i see all that, rage around here
and not unexpectedly, i think i wrote an email too, so i wonder what's the difference between me and say jms to shower her with pies

147 isn't really that great a post. But I'm not one to judge.

Honestly read, please go away.

oh, wow.

Let's all post our income level of self-awareness and ability to create a plausible conception of how others might view the affective content of our written communication.

if more than three people, i am not good at parties though, but esteemed mr pie refuses to see me as a person eligible to meetups which i think is some kind of subconscious racism perhaps on his behalf
but it's okay cz i am not going to meet any of you any time

good night, you may delete now whatever, i'll see whether to go away or not, maybe i'll consider that it was said with please
not just fuck off
but to think sifu was such a valuable member around here that his defence should be such dramatique

Text, this place is important to me and I value the community. You are damaging it with this self-centered asshole persona. You can be funny, but it needs to be dialed way down. I realize this is unlikely to get through to you (I have a pretty good idea how you're going to respond), but I thought I'd give it a try.

Cosigning with Eggplant and that lurker.

Why is it that every time I travel to this city, this blog explodes?

I may be interested in the DeLong meetup if I'm back home and not completely overwhelmed by jetlag. Is it happening?

!? !? !?

Just to reiterate, if London UFers have missed it in all this and are interested, that Ttam, asilon and I are meeting tonight (28 Nov) at the Plough in Museum Street, at around 7pm. All welcome!

text is ruining the blog* -- especially now that it's gone far beyond his absurdist performance art/public breakdown nonsense. As a human, I didn't feel particularly noble watching that, but now that text has moved on to grotesque** accusations against specific commenters I'd feel implicated if I didn't say something. Sometimes "not feeding the troll" seems an awful lot like "condoning the troll's bullshit."

*text wants to ruin the blog and will no doubt welcome this testament to his success. That's fine.

**Yet still pathetic and transparent, mind you.

138: "anastamosis" is a great word.

Indeed. Last time it came up here persistently visible came up with a nice bit of doggerel.

My name is Anastomosis, Network of Networks,
Look upon my Networks ye Mighty, and despair!

Sign me on for 161. It is really small of you, text, to ruin something a lot of people enjoy, for sport. And it pains me to read gratuitous shots taken at my friends that nobody will respond to because they are trying terribly hard not to engage you.

Let me endorse 161 and 163.

On the other hand: It is really small of you, text, to ruin something a lot of people enjoy, for sport. Isn't this what trolling is all about - getting your jollies by distressing people from a position in which there can be no repercussions? It's just another form of vandalism, really, like pulling up the flowers in a public park.

Ah Mister Smearcase, in reading some of the linguistic atlas material, I was gratified to see that "smearcase" is used as a defining word for the North Midland dialect (maybe we've discussed that here?). It was part of an interesting discussion of Erie PA. Erie holds a unique place in the dialectology of North America, since it is the only city to have switched its regional affiliation from the North to the Midland The shift took place (is taking place) over the last 50 years or so. I seriously hypothesize that this due to the success and appeal of the Pittsburgh Steelers which has led Erie more into the Pittsburgh orbit than equidistant Buffalo and Cleveland. (Well, probably also the completion of the shift from rail/water transport axes to roads.)

It's Pennsylvania Dutch, I had read.

165: I was also pleased to see the one map show the real "Pittsburgh/Western PA" dialect adhere to my personal observations of the extent of "yunz/yinz"--an ellipse extended ENE from Pittsburgh and environs to about State College.

166: It does come from the German and its origin seems to be generally associated with Pennsylvania, but it seems to have been adopted somewhat more broadly.

What 161, 163 and 164 said.

Right.

Can somebody link to the text comments in question? I missed them.

171: No.

What 161, 163, 164, and 169 said.

174 gets exactly right.

I am in the Plough, reading a book -- in ajay-esque fashion -- about Shackleton. Except it's actually about Franklin.

"I am going outdoors, and may be struck by lightning."

Cannibal Franklin, not kite&key Franklin. It's about what the Inuit saw and said.

what the Inuit saw and said.

One of James' lesser efforts.

I should get there around seven or so

My apologies for the lack of live blogging. No knife fights, but an otherwise pleasant evening.

That was me.

What happened at the Plough stays at the Plough.

The horror ... the horror.

[I did stand up and knock my chair over, like a prat.]

I didn't go, having been out with D^2 the night before and feeling distinctly queasy. It's that American-style craft beer he complains about so much - he has to keep checking it's as bad as he says.

177: "I am going outdoors. Feel free to start eating without me"

As the (paging H.M.Bateman) "person who praised Stella on a D^2 thread ext(r)olling Budweiser", I feel an intervention is in order. Unscaleable pleasures are the enemy. Our goal: the visible mouse-orgasm of a million minds.

Our goal: the visible mouse-orgasm of a million minds.

Some sort of waterproof clothing is probably in order, then.

Mickey: How come I never notice when you have an orgasm?
Minnie: Because you're never there.

Although.

waterproof clothing: always advisable when you drink with me...

The link at 190 has a lovely piece of Alice's Restaurantism on the subsequent pages.

161

text wants to ruin the blog ...

This ascribes a degree of rational planning to text's actions which is not obviously present.

158: Seems to happening Thursday @9 @Boathouse, and if not Boathouse Daedalus, and if not Daedalus Charlie's downstairs...

God damn it. I saw this post on Tuesday night and thought I had missed it. Now I look again on Thursday and I really did miss it.

I wonder if Yawnoc saw this post.