Isn't Jayne Mansfield's daughter Mariska Hargitay, multi-year star of L&O:SVU?
the sexy next-door neighbor, in the 1995 sitcom Can't Hurry Love, which starred Nancy McKeon.
There was a 1995 sitcom starring Nancy McKeon?!
KK is no different now than a bunch of pointless celebrities, both male and female. But she got her start with a degrading sex tape, which her kid is going to hear about in school, and which is immortalized in millions of web pages and jokes.
I thought that Jayne M's reputation was also widely reported as being unsuitable for kids, though before my day so who knows.
The issue is a widely propagated bad reputation more than pointless fame. The parenting problem is that the fame which feeds the family amplifies the bad reputation. (family support neglecting Kanye's collection of jewel-studded low mileage cars, won't speculate on coparenting stability)
Yes re: Mariska, but she was a baby when Jayne died, so not a relevant analogy. The older daughter is a better example, Wikipedia explains that she was a child while Jayne was publicly denying being married.
Also, Kanye is a lot of things, but he's talented surely and not "pointless."
Yes, I am talking about Kim rather than Kanye, whose music I enjoy.
Britney was pretty ill-suited to have two babies within two years and had a pretty rough couple years there.
The Gabor sisters were mostly famous for being famous (and Green Acres and getting married). Despite the fact that they were in nineteen marriages to eighteen man, they only had one child between them. Zsa Zsa's had a daughter Francesca from her marriage to Conrad Hilton.
Zsa Zsa is still alive and married to Frédéric Prinz von Anhalt, whose wikipedia page contains various surprises.
The question is almost "Which celebrity's PR person has let their image run wild, even while they had a baby?" Because I can think of plenty of nutty celebrities who (tried to) reinvent themselves as loving stability-seekers upon announcing their pregnancy. (ie Jessica Simpson, off the top of my head.)
The new thing it seems to me is that the Kardashians are committed to living their entire lives in public. Will the various TV series documenting their lives continue for generations of Kardashians?
Maybe Mariska is a test-case for Anna Nicole Smith's baby, then.
Talullah Bankhead was something like the Paris Hilton (naughty sexxxytimes socialite who ran with a famous crowd) of her time before gaining any sort of fame or notice as an actress.
What about Snooki and her baby?
Right, I see that I should have written shameful rather than pointless. If Bettie Page or some male porn star now legitimately famous had kids maybe, or the heir to a fortune based on sex toys, that's what I'm getting at.
Heebie points out that this could potentially all be recast as a matter of PR, and loving parents will know how to change the subject and make the past seem unimportant. I doubt it though, there are going to be some particular problems for kids of people this publicly blemished. I'm reluctant to judge a stranger, but KK does not seem like she's got the strongest foundation, so I hope the money helps the kid.
16. Exactly, but no kids.
Porn star has been a category of human since at least the 70's, and most of them presumably had children at some point in their lives, whether before during or after their porn careers. There's a fair amount of "vintage porn" on the web, which presumably stars YOUR MOM (or anyone, someone's mom). Also many decades of Playboy centerfolds etc.
Of course, few were as famous as Kim Kardashian, and most didn't use their real names. This raises an important corollary to the "no more masturbating to" rule: Avoid vintage porn that was created in the decade after your mother turned 18.
20: Right. I was thinking more about the "famous for being famous" category, which is an old one, and a largely female one, I think. For example, women who were the wives and mistresses of various famous men (you know, like Alma Mahler Gropius Werfel).
I'm really not familiar with the details of the Kardashians, but I don't understand the issue at all. The kid's going to grow up with her mother having been famous for not much, including some sexually explicit stuff. While that's not ideal, is it going to be any different from the kid's point of view from any kid who's parent was, e.g., an actress who did nude scenes? If the sex stuff is a problem, it's a problem independently, and depends on the kid's peer group and how the parents handle it. The fact that KK is also famous for no good reason doesn't seem as if it should be a problem at all (separable from the problems of being famous).
At this point, I don't know that Kim Kardashian is seen as particularly tawdry/sex-tape-ful. It's been years, and she's been heavily out and about as a...uh...wealthy reality TV star.
I'd be genuinely concerned if Lindsey Lohan turned up pregnant.
I'm actually quite pleased by this pregnancy because I love the Kim-Kanye linking.
Doesn't (didn't?) a royal family fulfill some of this position? The media exposure of Prince Albert (Victoria's son) was less than now (partially because it was hushed up I'm sure) but he was still known for partying and hanging out with a questionable crowd.
I've been reading too much about tiaras lately.
I was thinking that Kim needs to hurry up and actually get divorced from that other dude, otherwise his name ends up on the birth certificate. (At least in NYS, where she doesn't live, so.)
Really? The spouse is always on the birth certificate, even if it's known that they're not the father?
The kid is going to be filthy rich and the other kids in his entourage are going to know better than to bring up the your-mom's-in-a-sex-tape thing.
Apparently it holds in California, too.
Yep. (Presumably there are ways of sorting this out, but I recall the form stating very clearly that if you are married your husband's name *has* to be entered as the father's name.)
Well, I'm sure once she's aware of that technicality, this divorce will be hastily and quietly resolved.
(If you are *not* married, the father's name gets entered in the "Putative Fathers Registry." I heart that "putative.")
29: No. They'll be bringing it up all the time, because they know the subsequent fights, tears, and reconciliation will make good television.
Definitely not in Texas! I just listed Jammies as the father. Or maybe he did. I don't think it asked if we were married.
33: Oh, they go on the bc, too! But they have to sign an "Acknowledgment of Paternity," which has to be witnessed, and they are legally entitled to free DNA testing!
I think I'm super exhausted today because I got a flu shot yesterday. Should I go work out, as planned, because I'll feel virtuous and energized? Or should I take a nap because exercising will make me feel rundown and awful?
In other words, how awful will I feel if I exercise? Enough to regret it?
Actually, 35 cont, we did visit a justice of the peace and get legally married ahead of time. I just remembered. But we were secretive about it and would have had our antenna out to anything asking about marital status on the birth certificate.
(My parents were hectoring us to do so, basically on the grounds that gay parents can get royally screwed in the hospital if something goes wrong, for not being legally married, and we should CYA. I argued with them at length and didn't tell them that we did in fact follow their wishes, because the miniature mom lecturing me from my conscience is more powerful than the actual mom on the other end of the phone call.)
Does this post spring from a comment from another thread? Because it seems to start in the middle of a conversation about how many 6-year-olds with iPads it takes to beat up Kanye or something.
You lied to your mom so she wouldn't know that you were married when you had a baby?
This post sprang fully formed from Kim's forehead.
That's some non-standard deception.
I was going to say, Detective Olivia Benson did pretty well for herself, but I see that everyone beat me to it.
A little googling reveals that Evelyn Nesbit's child with Harry Thaw seems to have turned out okay. He beat Amelia Earhart in a cross-country aviation race.
43: I told them at some point over the next 6 months.
28: At least in the past it was certainly the law in Texas. That's why legally Colton is white even though in reality he's biracial, which I suppose could happen in Kardashianland except that her husband is himself biracial so maybe not.
Detective Olivia Benson did pretty well for herself
Including endless Emmy nominations and winning a few awards (once beating Edie Falco for chrissakes). Not that awards mean terribly much, but in what universe is she a good actor?
Huh. Maybe I just don't remember then. It was a busy day.
I certainly can't imagine Texas having changed it in the past 15 years.
42 is the greatest fact ever.
Also, completely agreed with HB about the awesomeness of iPad apps (pushing it: new tech in general) for children. Best anecdote: the beautiful five-year old walks into the electronic aisle at the big-box, starts touching the tv's, exclaiming "these are all broken", as they don't respond like the tablet.
Best iPad app for kids? From what I've seen, SuperWhy is pretty good.
HB is HG, of course. I'd blame that on my iPad, but it would be a lie.
Nonchalance, i guess. But being famous for being pissed on seems like a step beyond. I guess I'm a prude. Also, listing the failings of family members happens in fights.
But if you all say no bigs, maybe.
The entire toca boca series is amazeballs for preschoolers.
KK was in a water games sex tape? I am learning so much.
Surely not with R. Kelly.
With Ray J. Johnson.
56: He had a reality show too.
The young actor Tyger Drew-Honey's parents are an ex-page 3 girl/Penthouse editor and porn star 'Ben Dover'. I quite regularly wonder how weird that would be.
I just remember the beer commercial.
59 to 57.
Thora Birch's parents met in Deep Throat
Link for those who understandably refuse to believe any of my comments.
62: Actually that was just his first reality show. He had a second one with his even more famous sister, Brandy.
The young actor Tyger Drew-Honey's parents are an ex-page 3 girl/Penthouse editor and porn star 'Ben Dover'.
I've never heard of this fellow, but from Tyger's wiki page:
"According to the star's Twitter account these were 5A* grades, 5A grades and one B grade. As stated by Drew-Honey's Twitter user he is currently studying his AS levels which include Spanish and French."
For this uninformed American, what does this mean? Is he about to be elected to the Royal Society or sent to a youth custody centre?
56: But that's not his name. He's William Ray Norwood Jr, and Ray J is his nickname.
64 - um, that's good, I guess. I'll be happy with that for Kid A this summer - I think she could do better, but she's lazy as hell. It's not genius level, but decent solid stuff.
He's been in one of the biggest sitcoms of the last few years here - a family thing, with the kids mostly improvising.
54: surely it's "water sports" not "water games." Google
I don't understand this post at all, but I particularly don't understand "that kid's not getting an ipad at 6 years old". Why not? What would it matter?
There was a time* that would have been stratospherically good. I'm guess it's still quite a bit better than average?
* I'm assuming, based on my memories of the Scottish equivalent.
Nonchalance, i guess. But being famous for being pissed on seems like a step beyond.
Heebie basically said this already, but wow! you know a lot more about the KK sex tape than I do. (And I had also forgotten its existence until this thread reminded me.)
With Ray J. Johnson.
Oh right. Brandy's brother!
Front pager- please bump the Boston meet up post. Saturday 8pm mead hall.
AS levels cover about half the material in an A level. At least that's what they did when my sister took one a little over 10 years ago. Then around the same time they had to come up with A star grades, because too many people got As. Didn't Winchesyer (and maybe Eton) decide to drop A levels in favor of some other exam they considered more challenging?
Nobody who will be in the city of Austin tomorrow allowed!
I feel so pounced upon. Not in a bad way.
Bianca Jagger was a pretty pointless celebrity. Pretty sure she would have a reality show if they had them back then.
Kanye West is pretty talented. And so is mick jagger!
Live fast, die young and leave a beautiful cenotaph.
Anna Nicole Smith was such a roller coaster ride that her fame seems hard-earned and justified
I hope so, since it accounts for one of my best brushes with it. (yes, my drag name was "sylvia krappstein." ill-advised.)
I am in concordant confusion with 69, and full agreement with 49. ALERT THE MEDIA
70 - that is true - I got 7 A's and 4 B's and that was great back then. Now you have to get twelve A*'s for anyone to be super-impressed. But yes, Tyger's grades are well above average.
Kid A has gcse's this summer. We now have summer exams (sometimes two kids at once, fortunately never 3) every year up till and including 2021. Fuck my life.
Not counting any university education they might choose.
81 is awesome.
In 78, are those stretch marks you can see on the top of Mansfield's left tit?
I think so. Or claw marks.
49. Kid would google to find out if what he heard in the schoolyard/ from grandma West was true.
85-86: it was a super-fun night. I played selections from Les Miz on the accordion for the talent portion and rode a hobbyhorse wearing a PVC mini-dress. and the resultant photo album later came into use as "my etchings", IYKWIM.
89: Grandma West is dead, you monster. (Botched plastic surgery.)
Porn star has been a category of human since at least the 70's, and most of them presumably had children at some point in their lives
Aside from your being pwned, 93 is why it was super ludicrous that her character was saving up for breast implants in that annoying movie with the extended footage of the plastic bag in the wind.
Because she would have inherited them, you mean?
Yes, she is stacked.
I had no idea Kim Kardashian got started with a sex tape. I feel so pure.
ah, 61, but I added value! Although not that much -- if you follow the links it appears that porn stars' children go up to strip, do porn, or do monologues about how they were traumatized by their parents being in porn.
I've heard KK is legally separated, and that means she doesn't husband's name has to be on the birth certificate, since any actions taken after legal separation are not considered part of the marriage. Right, lawyers?
The lawyers all appear to care more about platinum coins than celebrity divorces. Curious, that.
My grandmother lied on the birth certificate in NYS in the 1940s. She was not married but invented a husband and said she was a housewife or something like that. It seems one effect of this was to keep her last name in the family.
Talking of slebs and porn, can someone in the states do me a favour and run a google query? I can't believe that the Daily Mail is responsible for a quarter of all the soft porn on the web, yet it surely does publish a shitload.
If I run this query:
"shows off her"|"displays her"|"wardrobe malfunction"|"all grown *" inurl:dailymail
I get around 47m hits. When I remove the site restriction, there are about 180m. I reckon this query is a pretty good proxy for leering while looking smug and respectable (the huffpo yields around 15m hits while a straight up rank site like tmz has much fewer). But it is such an odd figure that I'd love to know if it's not some wacky artefact of google.co.uk
Google.co.nz gives 47.9m vs 270m.
Now all we have to do is figure out a way to monetize all that drool
Don't trust the number of results reported from a google search, even for comparison with one another. They're estimates, and can be grossly wrong.
I don't trust them too much, but just how gross is "grossly wrong"? And what other measure is available?
102: 47M vs 227M here in US via my us google machine.
100: we haven't heard from will on either matter, have we?
106 -- How wrong is grossly wrong? 144x
I'm not sure if hydrobatidae is still reading this thread, but re: 26, I present A Tiara a Day.
I get around 47m hits. When I remove the site restriction, there are about 180m. I reckon this query is a pretty good proxy for leering while looking smug and respectable (the huffpo yields around 15m hits while a straight up rank site like tmz has much fewer).
I'm not going to dispute the "leering while looking smug and respectable" characterisation, of course, but ghits break down pretty badly at high numbers. They just extrapolate and the numbers get very noisy.
111: Yes, I've had a few instance where adding a restriction increased "hits".
A couple of months before she died, Jayne Mansfield was scheduled to do some kind of cabaret show at a hotel in Tralee, County Kerry. This scandalized the local clergy (this was rural Ireland in the 1960s) so much that the Bishop ordered a letter to be read at all masses the Sunday before the event. This caused the event to be cancelled. The joke afterwards was that the local priest had claimed people might as well be struck blind if they looked upon such filth, and while everyone took this threat seriously, all the same a few of the local lads had been prepared maybe to risk one eye.
110: Thanks! Kind of. I already spent too long looking at the other site.
111: This is probably true, and a great shame. It would have made a wonderful piece