Re: You know sometimes words have two meanings

1

We're all about the Voltron and various Power Rangers iterations, but so far we've stayed away from He Man.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 8:36 PM
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Skeletor himself, you will recall, usurped his power from Hordak, who is manifestly the proper heir to Castle Greyskull.


Posted by: essear | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 8:37 PM
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This is the most I've ever known about He-Man.


Posted by: fake accent | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 8:40 PM
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Now I've forgotten already.


Posted by: fake accent | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 8:41 PM
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Indeed, Skeletor triumphed over Hordak through extensive use of magic to further his own ends. As Durkheim says, "between the magician and the individuals who consult him, there are no durable ties that make them members of a single moral body." The magician, Skeletor, is always acting as an individual, and cannot rightfully take charge of the wisdom of the Elders.


Posted by: essear | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 8:43 PM
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Stupid principal/agent problem.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 8:47 PM
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Come on, essear, that clearly doesn't follow. Surely a magician can act as a member of a corporate body even if he isn't part of such a body with those who consult him.


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 8:49 PM
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I don't recall the rest of the book bearing out that argument, though.


Posted by: essear | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 8:50 PM
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Wasn't there an actual king who was shown to be the father of Adam/He-Man? And where does Orko fit into your scheme, brainiac?


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 8:50 PM
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Indeed, if we take your quotation from Durkheim at its word, both the magician and the one who consults him are figured as isolated individuals, so it is, again, conceivable that there should be durable ties between the magician and another person who consults him, provided that person isn't acting as an individual in making the consultation.


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 8:50 PM
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11

Damn, you nerds know way more about this than me.


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 8:51 PM
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When I was a kid, She-Ra was on TV but we never got He-Man for some reason. I remember being really excited to catch it on TV while visiting my uncle in Virginia.


Posted by: essear | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 8:52 PM
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Damn, you nerds

Speaking of nerds, yesterday I was trying to explain Scavhunt to my girlfriend, so I dug out my DVD of The Hunt and showed her part of it. I'm pretty sure I spotted you in one early scene.


Posted by: essear | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 9:00 PM
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Not impossible! I only saw it when the screened it at Doc and think I may have spotted myself. Wasn't there another scavhunt documentary made just a year or two later?


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 9:04 PM
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When I was in second grade, He-Man was the show the first graders were into. Those stupid, young, ignorant first graders, they didn't know that Voltron was so much cooler.


Posted by: Spike | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 9:05 PM
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I'm pretty sure I saw the first ever He Man tv show episode. I had the toys first and then there was a new TV show. I haven't looked at the doubtless encyclopedia-length Wikipedia page, so I could be wrong about this and maybe the show preceded the toys. I think even as a kid my reaction was holy fuck is this stupid, but it was somehow compelling.


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 9:08 PM
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I loved the little tiny comic books that came with the toys. I must have read some of those things fifty times. I think this was before I had any real comic books, so it might have been my first exposure to the medium.


Posted by: essear | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 9:09 PM
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I remember seeing ads for He-Man and She-Ra all the time, but I'm not sure what shows I was actually watching when I saw those ads.


Posted by: fake accent | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 9:09 PM
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Shows about five fighting-things that join to form a big fight-thing are where you get the sophisticated audience.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 9:09 PM
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14: I didn't know about another documentary, but it wouldn't surprise me.


Posted by: essear | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 9:10 PM
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One might just as well argue that The Smurfs sought to prepare young children for the advent of Kṛṣṇa, or that Scooby-Doo inculcates a respect for the practice of bribery.


Posted by: Natilo Paennim | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 9:10 PM
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22

Mekaneck!


Posted by: Stranded in Lubbock | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 9:14 PM
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Have you seen the new version? Velma really stretches the turtle neck now.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 9:15 PM
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21: so what are you waiting for?


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 9:16 PM
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That argument has already been made adequately, I believe.

What I did want to advance was the question of homosexual subtexts in the animated children's television programs of the 1980s. Rarely has there been an era so starkly redolent of William Gibson's memorable phrase "all the sinister fruitiness of Hitler Youth propaganda." Certainly, when we examine these texts, it is hard to escape the fact that the major plotlines and characterizations are ridiculously jingoistic, promote American Exceptionalism, and serve primarily to provide a fig leaf of narrative over the naked desire on the part of toy companies to promote their products. And yet, the signifiers chosen to obscure the crass commercialism of the underlying economic motivations were, repeatedly and continuously, celebrations of homoeroticism and homosocial bonding. The very discomfort that the zeitgeist manifested as a denial or refusal of basic human reproductive realities paved the way for depictions which strained the boundaries of ostensibly heteronormative discourse even as He-Man's bulging musculature strained his armored harness and bikini bottom.


Posted by: Natilo Paennim | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 9:28 PM
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25: Rarely has there been an era
In fact, only once before, in Germany of the 1930s and early 1940s.


Posted by: Natilo Paennim | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 9:30 PM
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Indeed, He-Man's very cognomen vividly encapsulates the homosexual subtext of his character. Purged of all the effeminate (or at least non-masculine) characteristics of his closeted Prince Adam persona, (which occurs when he grips his sword and claims power), He-Man is doubly masculine, eliminating the desirability and even the possibility of feminine influence. The trope of the double is again referenced in the name of his primary ally, Man-At-Arms. Like Castor and Pollux or other heroic duos of antiquity, martial virtues and homosocial bonds are sanctified in the blood and sweat of shared danger in combat.


Posted by: Natilo Paennim | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 9:42 PM
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28

I get Skeletor mixed up with Klingsor from Parsifal.


Posted by: Mister Smearcase | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 9:53 PM
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21: I went to UT in '91 and you can not get that one by me, mister.


Posted by: Mister Smearcase | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 9:55 PM
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30

This thread mostly fills me with just the warmest fellow-feeling.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 10:04 PM
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Nerds, he typed, rearranging his Bat-paraphernalia.


Posted by: Flippanter | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 10:13 PM
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32

Blazons klaxing!


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 10:16 PM
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33

I knew two three year olds, Thomas and Adam, who when they met were very disappointed that the other wasn't Thomas the Tank Engine or Prince Adam.


Posted by: asilon | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 10:43 PM
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34

3, 4: Yeah, me too.


Posted by: teofilo | Link to this comment | 05- 9-13 10:48 PM
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35

This is the kind of thing you miss out on completely when the only TV programme you are allowed to watch is "Blue Peter".


Posted by: ajay | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 1:31 AM
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25: also, for that matter, popular movies. "Top Gun" being a case in point.


Posted by: ajay | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 3:22 AM
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I watched a lot of He-Man with the kids I babysat after school -- they were allowed to watch one TV show, and then it had to be turned off. Until now, I'd forgotten pretty much all the details.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 4:01 AM
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Some friends had the most adorable little kitten named Grayskull. That is one seriously bad-ass name for a fuzzy little cat.


Posted by: Stanley | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 4:05 AM
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Screw your five fighting things coming together, the real shit was twenty spaceships. It was much more logical, and Star Wars-like too.
I used to pull the arms off my toy and call him Man Without Arms.
Gummy bears was a decent show, but the best was D&D.


Posted by: SP | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 4:13 AM
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Oops, 15, not 20.
What does He-Man have to do with Stairway to Heaven?


Posted by: SP | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 4:34 AM
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41

The obvious He-Man name for a cat is "Battlecat". I assume they had already used that one when little Grayskull came along.


Posted by: Cryptic ned | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 4:57 AM
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42

I have a brother who is ten years younger than I am. When he was little I had him convinced that I wrote the He-Man theme song.


Posted by: Barry Freed | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 5:05 AM
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43

||

What do Tom Hanks, Sandra Bullock and Denzil Washington have in common? Apart from the fact that they all make their living by dressing up and pretending?

|>


Posted by: chris y | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 5:29 AM
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44

15 spaceships is lame. That's three times as many fighting things as the real Voltron needed. Plus, lions are cool.


Posted by: Spike | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 5:31 AM
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45

Also, that princess who drove the blue lion..... yowza!


Posted by: Spike | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 5:32 AM
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This talk about magicians rings true to me. However, the magician often serves merely as part of a court, not having such power that he can choose where or how to live his life. In the less well-thought-out stories he does not even have the power to refuse requests from his ruler.

This is distinct from the oracle, who has such power that he never carries out a task for simply monetary reward or because he is forced to. The oracle is exemplified by the Moochick in the My Little Pony universe. I don't know if he still exists in the new show, but he was in the movie based on the original series. Played by Tony Randall.


Posted by: Cryptic ned | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 5:45 AM
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Perhaps Skeletor was, like Prince Adam, not always as we see him in the series, nor so named: perhaps pride and avarice -- in the magic-enriched atmosphere of Eternia -- deformed his countenance around the image of his obsession, in an Aesop-like object lesson on the ironic fate of those who pursue knowledge of things beyond death! Beware and repent!


Posted by: Flippanter | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 5:51 AM
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The Secrets of Nimh movie was on tv this evening. Weird layer of music and schmaltzy moralizing on top of the substrate of smart rats. Am I misremembering when I think oh the original book as better?


Posted by: conflated | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 5:53 AM
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49

The original book is MUCH MUCH better.


Posted by: redfoxtailshrub | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 5:56 AM
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50

Relieved.


Posted by: conflated | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 6:03 AM
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51

Yes. There was a completely out-of-place layer of pointless magic in the movie that made no sense and annoyed me.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 6:04 AM
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I don't like pointless magic in movies, but I was more annoyed by pointless, half-assed explanations for magic in movies that I was previously willing to take on willing suspension of disbelief (i.e. midi-chlorians).


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 6:09 AM
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53

I weep for the generation that came of cartoon age in the '70s and '80s. Thank God for Bugs Bunny re-runs.


Posted by: politicalfootball | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 7:05 AM
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54

What do Tom Hanks, Sandra Bullock and Denzil Washington have in common? Apart from the fact that they all make their living by dressing up and pretending?

More trusted than Alex Trebek? what is wrong with people?


Posted by: mcmc | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 8:01 AM
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55

save your tears for mum-ra, pf.


Posted by: text | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 8:18 AM
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56

Is that She-Ra's mother or something?


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 8:20 AM
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57

duh, it's the Thundercats' mortal enemy, Mum-ra the ever-living.


Posted by: text | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 8:23 AM
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58

That sounds like the Thundercats' immortal enemy.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 8:24 AM
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59

was there a decade when more pagan universes were created?


Posted by: text | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 8:24 AM
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60

maybe it's like a pun or something.


Posted by: text | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 8:25 AM
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61

53. Looking in the wrong place, but Fat Albert. Banana Splits yo. Ark II. Electric Company, even Space 1999. HR Pufnstuf, the Lids.


Posted by: lw | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 8:36 AM
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62

drugs made cartoons better.


Posted by: text | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 8:51 AM
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63

I don't understand the post title.


Posted by: x.trapnel | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 10:07 AM
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It's in reference to the frequency of double or hidden meanings in prophecies. OBVIOUSLY.


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 10:08 AM
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61 has it right. Also Land of the Lost, Get Smart reruns, etc.


Posted by: Barry Freed | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 10:12 AM
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66

I briefly had a case that involved Sid and Marty Krofft deals from the early 70s. The case didn't get very far but I was sort of surprised that the original contracts weren't written in bizarre day-glo paint and that there weren't visible amounts of ash from hash pipes covering them.


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 10:18 AM
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61 and 63: I rest my case.

(To 63: Get Smart wasn't a cartoon and had its entire run in the '60s. I'll allow the non-cartoons of 61 into evidence on the grounds that they are, at least, children's programming, and because they sucked.)


Posted by: politicalfootball | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 10:31 AM
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My lord, you guys, the Masters of the Universe history wikipedia page is all you could ask for and more. The legal and factual battle over He-Man's real world origins and relation or non relation to Conan is intense. Sample extract:

This book gives the only true, factual, honest account of Sweet's origination and development of the He-Man concept in the form of the He-Man Trio known to Sweet. The reason is that the book's account is substantiated by actual pertinent Mattel documents and events explained truthfully and clearly, and with correct significance. At the time that the Mastering the Universe book was written and published, the book did not include either Taylor's Unnamed Later-To-Be-Named Vikor or Taylor's Torak Hero of Pre-history. That is because at that time both of those Taylor characters were unknown to Sweet and Wecker. Further, at that time, those Taylor characters also were unknown to anyone who had been at Mattel in upper management, Marketing, or Preliminary Design before, during, and directly after Sweet originated and developed the He-Man concept in the form of the He-Man Trio.

Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 10:35 AM
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all you could ask for and more

Most of us aren't asking for gory details of intellectual property cases, most of the time.


Posted by: essear | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 10:37 AM
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What he said.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 10:38 AM
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Well, we had AWESOME reruns!

I was going to add stuff like Johnny Quest but that was done in the mid-60's too.

Still, it was awesome in reruns.


Posted by: Barry Freed | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 10:39 AM
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I just watched the last episode of Land of the Lost on youtube a couple of days ago, because I'm so burned out that's basically all I do at work. We loved Land of the Lost when I was a kid. We sort of LARPed it, actually, though not as much as Star Trek. Anyway oh my god. I know stuff like that has famously not aged well but it's just day-glo awful, beyond what I would have imagined.

I bet G-Force is also not the masterpiece I recall it as being, huh?


Posted by: Mister Smearcase | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 10:44 AM
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I have random snippets of odd shows in the 80s that ran for a season but had some catchphrase I remember completely devoid of any other context. There was some show with maybe midget aliens and when they agreed on something they would say, "Ten-ten" kind of like 10-4 but not the same?


Posted by: SP | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 10:59 AM
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67. Throw down then. The predecessor programming, Jetsons, Flintstones, Hannah-Barbera, is all schlock, is even worse. There were bursts of real genius at WB animation through the 60s, but the best work there was in the 50s, similarly Fleischer studios and Disney.

ALl of this is tinged with nostalgia-- television for kids can be both part of what makes a life happy, an escape from problems, both of these at the same time. The past is another country yadda yadda.


Posted by: lw | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 11:37 AM
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We sort of LARPed it, actually, though not as much as Star Trek

Did you do the bizarre Commander Riker seat-mount thing? I can't believe I only just discovered this (and the Riker Lean).


Posted by: x.trapnel | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 11:59 AM
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No, we were tiny hipsters, apparently: we never got into derivative, watered-down later Star Treks; just the original series. Well ok also the others didn't exist yet.


Posted by: Mister Smearcase | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 12:11 PM
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Was He-Man on weekday afternoons, or Saturday mornings?

I had He-Man toys I liked, but I remember little or nothing of the TV show. The childrens' cartoons that have stayed with me longest are the "Disney Afternoon" block of programming. Darkwing Duck and Gargoyles particularly, but I'm pretty sure those were post-80s.


Posted by: Cyrus | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 12:23 PM
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We LARPed the hell out of that one with the Gorn.


Posted by: Barry Freed | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 12:24 PM
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77: Late '80s or early '90s is about right. Darkwing Duck was introduced in the exact years that I was coming home from elementary school and turning on the block of afternoon cartoons.

(From that block, though, I think the show that my sisters and friends and I used most in pretending games was Chip 'n Dale Rescue Rangers - maybe for its larger ensemble and slight gender diversity?)


Posted by: joyslinger | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 12:34 PM
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Rodents have much smaller penises than ducks, if that's what you are getting at.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 12:36 PM
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75: Am I the only one who noticed and was bothered by that move during the original run of the show? I thought it was part of the writer's lame efforts to make him seem like a bad-ass, like the whole "I'm from Alaska! I'm a pioneer!" thing.

Someone on Takei's feed described it as "I'm so tough I don't sit in a chair; I mount it."


Posted by: rob helpy-chalk | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 12:41 PM
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DuckTales was great, largely because so much of it was taken directly from Carl Barks.


Posted by: snarkout | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 12:43 PM
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72.last: Holy crap I loved G-Force. I had a crush on Jason.


Posted by: oudemia | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 12:48 PM
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We sort of LARPed it, actually, though not as much as Star Trek

LARP Trek.


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 1:01 PM
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53: Au contraire, we had Star Blazers, which clearly led to every narrative-arc-heavy sci-fi show of the last 40 years. I still know all of the words to the theme song.


Posted by: Walt Someguy | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 1:13 PM
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Apparently Frakes had a significant back injury, which may be related to both the mount and the lean.


Posted by: Minivet | Link to this comment | 05-10-13 2:25 PM
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How have we had an He-Man thread without any links to this?


Posted by: Spike | Link to this comment | 05-13-13 5:50 AM
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