Re: Stay Away

1

Google tells me Shalizi's middle name is Rohilla. The same as Khomeini's first name, Ruholla. Just saying.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 7:43 AM
horizontal rule
2

To be sure, Cosma has earned the longform length, but that is one long article.


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 7:52 AM
horizontal rule
3

You can just read the part at the top after "Attention Conservation Notice."


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 7:55 AM
horizontal rule
4

Anyway, I read a longer piece of his earlier this week, because learning R.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 7:55 AM
horizontal rule
5

When I looked for a guide to a particular topic, his class notes were the first hit. It was indeed helpful.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 7:57 AM
horizontal rule
6

2: You only really need to read the title.

And it's like ogged isn't even familiar with the archives over the last few years. (Actually, it is good to mention it and link to it as frequently as possible.)


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 7:57 AM
horizontal rule
7

The thread linked in 6.2, had this ogged-positive comment from Nick S: The thread linked in 5 makes me miss ogged and his particular mix of charm, provocation, and earnestness (despite the fact that the last is deprecated).


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 8:17 AM
horizontal rule
8

I'm one of the rare suckers who slogged the whole way through Wolfram's book. It's very puffed-up and overblown but makes some interesting points along the way. My one big takeaway from it, which maybe the physicists present could comment on or debunk is: maybe the reason string theory turns out to depend on 7+ dimensions "folded" in counterintuitive ways is because they're using the wrong damn model. He has a pseudo-theory that looks like a 3-D cellular automaton at Planck scale, but I'm not sure if anything concrete ever came from it (I'm pretty sure not).


Posted by: Yawnoc | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 8:40 AM
horizontal rule
9

8: I read the thing. It was amusing. I believe essaer has commented on the discretization issue--it breaks important invariants and is thus likely doooooomed.


Posted by: Turgid Jacobian | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 8:42 AM
horizontal rule
10

8: No, his "theory" of physics doesn't and can't make any sense. It isn't quantum mechanical and it doesn't obey the rules of special relativity, among other massive, obvious, glaring problems. String theory may not be right, but it's the only theory anyone has includes gravity and passes this sort of basic sanity check.


Posted by: essear | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 8:42 AM
horizontal rule
11

that


Posted by: essear | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 8:43 AM
horizontal rule
12

Oh, hi, comment 9.


Posted by: essear | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 8:43 AM
horizontal rule
13

That NickS projected his own earnestness onto ogged's rotten-to-the-very-core cynicism is either deeply misguided or very sweet. I can't figure out which.


Posted by: Von Wafer | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 9:03 AM
horizontal rule
14

Wait, it's both, isn't it?


Posted by: Von Wafer | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 9:04 AM
horizontal rule
15

13: It's a diabolical plot to destroy ogged!


Posted by: torrey pine | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 9:06 AM
horizontal rule
16

Wait, what does it mean when I get a "comment pending" error message?


Posted by: Unfoggetarian: "Pause endlessly, then go in" (9) | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 9:35 AM
horizontal rule
17

You ran afoul of Stephen Wolfram (aka "ogged"), apparently. I hope you have a good lawyer.


Posted by: Von Wafer | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 9:39 AM
horizontal rule
18

It's just a coda Cosma puts on most of his reviews, but I like to think that 1192 pp., many handsome black-and-white illustrations, index of names and subjects could also have served as the whole review.


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 9:50 AM
horizontal rule
19

15 to 16.

I can't figure out which.

Let me know if you decide.


Posted by: NickS | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 10:16 AM
horizontal rule
20

I read that book. And by "read that book", I mean "looked extensively at the handsome black-and-white illustrations."


Posted by: Spike | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 10:46 AM
horizontal rule
21

String theory may not be right, but it's the only theory anyone has includes gravity and passes this sort of basic sanity check.

To be fair, neither relativity nor quantum mechanics pass a basic sanity check.


Posted by: Ginger Yellow | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 11:05 AM
horizontal rule
22

Let me be the first to admit that despite all the past references in the pages of this august robust blog to Wolfram and his projects, this is the first time I actually read something of it. Just the OP's linked Slate article, mind.

So ... the guy claims to have codified the world? Is that it? Made it computable? I immediately wonder whether a person needs to delve into the particulars of Mathematica or whatever in order to know that this is hogwash. This used to be a philosophy blog!

I'm going to guess that that's what Cosma said. Maybe not the part about unfogged.

Right, from Cosma's takedown:

Wolfram has since retreated from normal scientific life, in to, on the one hand, tending the Mathematica empire, and, on the other, his peculiar scientific vision and method. The vision is of the universe as, if not exactly a CA, then a simple discrete program of some sort.

...

What, then, is the revelation Wolfram has been vouchsafed? What is this new kind of science? Briefly stated, it is the idea that we should give up trying on complicated, continuous models, using normal calculus or probability theory or the like, which try to represent the mechanisms by which interesting phenomena are produced, or at least to accurately reproduce the details of such phenomena. Instead we should look for simple, discrete models, like CAs ("simple programs", as he calls them) which qualitatively reproduce certain striking features of those phenomena. In addition to this methodological advice, there is the belief that the universe must in some sense be such a simple program -- as he has notoriously said, "four lines of Mathematica".

I'm pretty sure people have tried on those kinds of reductionist view before.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 11:35 AM
horizontal rule
23

Relativity really doesn't seem weird at all to me. The alternative is a world where you could send information instantaneously! Madness.

QM doesn't feel weird to me either but I'm just used to it.

Almost time to board my 12-hour flight, so I can't repeat my standard store of Wolfram anecdotes in this thread. And some bastard took the previously empty seat next to me.


Posted by: essear | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 11:37 AM
horizontal rule
24

Sorry to have gone on at length, but I'm just catching up to this.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 11:38 AM
horizontal rule
25

22, 24: Legend has it that if you repeat Stephen Wolfram's name 3 times, he'll appear and slap you with a lawsuit.


Posted by: AcademicLurker | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 11:47 AM
horizontal rule
26

||

Well, here

Falling Rate of Learning and the Neoliberal Endgame

Essentially the elite of capitalism have gotten themselves in a dilemma regarding where to go with Capitalism. To maintain the rate of profit they have grown accustomed to in increasingly short-lived booms, they really have to eliminate variable capital (labour). Of course to eliminate labour (via globalization, out sourcing, precarious employment, automation), you inherently eliminate the consumers that buy all the junk the global system can produce. I, for one, have realized I would rather be a creator than a consumer. So the goose has been killed, We live in this period of increasingly disposable people. Simultaneously, government support for the disposed people is withdrawn, as the elite demand increasing subsidy (bailouts, tax cuts, privatization, defence spending) just to stay elite.

|>


Posted by: bob mcmanus | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 11:47 AM
horizontal rule
27

"Can you give us the answer to life?", they asked the computer.
Deep Thought pondered their question.
"Yes," he said. "But it will be tricky. And first I have to write Mathematica."


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 12:11 PM
horizontal rule
28

25: So I hear, but I'm doubting that there's any lawsuit to be had over noting that, no, there are no simple forms.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 12:15 PM
horizontal rule
29

Stephen Wolfram shot my dog.


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 12:27 PM
horizontal rule
30

I'm going to take this as the most available open thread for political matters, since I don't see any recent political thing:

You all may recall that I'm concerned about ALEC, the American Legislative Exchange Council.

They're taking it local with something called the American City County Exchange (ACCE). The linked piece goes to a longer Guardian article. Please, folks, pay attention to this.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 1:06 PM
horizontal rule
31

I mean to say: please openly ask your local, county, regional, municipal representatives or candidates for such if they're affiliated with ALEC, or now, with ACCE.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 1:13 PM
horizontal rule
32

Apparently ALEC/ACCE have been poking around in Pittsburgh, PA. Just so you know.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 1:16 PM
horizontal rule
33

Also on the political, in this case socioeconomic front, this promises to be a very interesting nine part series on the origins and historical path that have led to our current state of income inequality.

h/t Billmoyers.com


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 1:32 PM
horizontal rule
34

We just finished the whole election thing. I think I don't need to vote for a while.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 1:50 PM
horizontal rule
35

Damnit Moby, ALEC is poking around. Make sure your bike is locked up.


Posted by: gswift | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 1:53 PM
horizontal rule
36

I don't even have an bicycle.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 1:55 PM
horizontal rule
37

34 -- Sorry Moby, it's on again. Filing for the primary closes here Monday. (I'm unopposed, so far, for Central Committee, but there are two more days for someone to toss a hat into the ring.) The big race that everyone's interested in is for County Attorney -- our current guy has made national headlines resisting USDOJ's investigation of his handling of rape cases -- and we have 3 going for the Dem nomination. No one has filed yet on the Rep side.


Posted by: CharleyCarp | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 2:02 PM
horizontal rule
38

I'd be voting for the woman candidate, even if I didn't have some knowledge of her -- her son is my son's housemate over in Bzmn -- because symbolism plus competence is a tough combination to beat.


Posted by: CharleyCarp | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 2:07 PM
horizontal rule
39

this woman


Posted by: CharleyCarp | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 2:11 PM
horizontal rule
40

39: With the name alone, she's got the hipster vote locked up.


Posted by: Stanley | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 2:14 PM
horizontal rule
41

I mostly drink cheap lager beer, but I don't get what people see in PBR.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 2:17 PM
horizontal rule
42

It's IC Light bad.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 2:26 PM
horizontal rule
43

I'm unopposed, so far, for Central Committee

Sounds vaguely Communist.


Posted by: Spike | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 2:48 PM
horizontal rule
44

And first I have to write Mathematica."

First they came to write Mathematica and I said nothing because I was afraid to get sued.


Posted by: fake accent | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 3:33 PM
horizontal rule
45

Per her site, she's prosecuted poaching? I didn't realise CC lived in 18th century England.


Posted by: Keir | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 3:42 PM
horizontal rule
46

I don't get what people see in PBR

It's a cheap way to keep drinking after you've gotten drunk on good beer.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 3:43 PM
horizontal rule
47

Poaching is a big damn deal here. There was a poaching ring in the next county north that included law enforcement people from county, county seat, and tribe.

Our little midtown grocery store is apparently tne number 3 retailer of PBR in the US. I've seen flyers for local events claiming to be hipster and family friendly.


Posted by: CCarp | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 3:52 PM
horizontal rule
48

A generally held view outside the county.


Posted by: CCarp | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 3:54 PM
horizontal rule
49

48 to 43.


Posted by: | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 3:54 PM
horizontal rule
50

What does Shalizi have against Of Grammatology?


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 4:08 PM
horizontal rule
51

Did you like how he slipped that in there? Hitler, Stalin, Of Grammatology.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 5:05 PM
horizontal rule
52

I just noticed there's Wi-Fi available even though I'm somewhere out over the northern Pacific. I hope reading these threads is worth $16.99.


Posted by: essear | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 5:53 PM
horizontal rule
53

No pressure or anything.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 5:54 PM
horizontal rule
54

Moby first in with a questionable Malaysia Airlines joke.


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 6:00 PM
horizontal rule
55

I've just spotted that headline. What a day to be flying to Beijing.


Posted by: essear | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 6:03 PM
horizontal rule
56

I heard a good guitarist joke recently:

Q: How many guitar players does it take to cover a Stevie Ray Vaughan tune?

A: Evidently all of them.


Posted by: Stanley | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 6:03 PM
horizontal rule
57

the northern Pacific

It seems like you were just boarding the plane.

Hmm...that was a few hours ago.


Posted by: md 20/400 | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 6:21 PM
horizontal rule
58

Weirdest part of the Malaysian Airlines story is the stolen passport angle. Apparently media in several countries have been calling nationals on the passenger list, and in several cases have found that the person is still alive at home, and their passport was stolen years ago.

So who were these people on the plane?


Posted by: idp | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 6:27 PM
horizontal rule
59

Woody Allen.


Posted by: Stanley | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 6:30 PM
horizontal rule
60

57: I was leaving from SF.


Posted by: essear | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 6:32 PM
horizontal rule
61

The report I read said there were two people with stolen passports. Did you see a report with more?


Posted by: Unfoggetarian: "Pause endlessly, then go in" (9) | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 6:35 PM
horizontal rule
62

You're fine if you brought your own stolen passport.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 6:36 PM
horizontal rule
63

54: I didn't have that in mind at all.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 6:37 PM
horizontal rule
64

As for things Cosma has written, this recent post is thought-provoking. Plus, I forget if I've somewhere congratulated him on tenure, so: hooray for tenure, Cosma.


Posted by: essear | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 6:44 PM
horizontal rule
65

63: Now you did.


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 6:50 PM
horizontal rule
66

I was once offered two grand for my passport by a gypsy mobster. I wasn't quite broke enough to take him up on it, but I was tempted. He said he was fine with me immediately reporting it as stolen. Ever since, whenever I read a story about 'stolen' passports I get suspicious.


Posted by: teraz kurwa my | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 7:31 PM
horizontal rule
67

I'm savoring 59: references Zelig on the one hand, but is also by now a Kobe! style interjection. And has a trace of the mischief reminiscent of Marty Feldman's whisper of "Blucher" just to make the horses react.


Posted by: idp | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 7:33 PM
horizontal rule
68

fyi for the ptb. just tried to post and got:

Movable Type

An error occurred

Rebuild failed: Renaming tempfile '/var/www/unfogged/html/archives/comments_13572.html.new' failed: Renaming '/var/www/unfogged/html/archives/comments_13572.html.new' to '/var/www/unfogged/html/archives/comments_13572.html' failed: No such file or directory


Posted by: md 20/400 | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 7:44 PM
horizontal rule
69

Sort of cool that Moby is liveblogging a raid.

So what was the offense?


Posted by: md 20/400 | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 7:44 PM
horizontal rule
70

69 should be in the OTHER thread. Dang.


Posted by: md 20/400 | Link to this comment | 03- 8-14 7:45 PM
horizontal rule
71

||

Bleg: I am trying to help the prisoner I mentor do some research for one of his college classes. (He doesn't have access to a library.) He is taking a nutrition class and has to lead class for 10 minutes along with another classmate. They are covering vitamins, and he is doing the water soluble ones. I think he is looking for information showing that real food is a better source of vitamins than supplements.

Does anyone know of places to look for simple articles? I've found info on different vitamins but nothing about the bioavailability.

|>


Posted by: Bostoniangirl | Link to this comment | 03- 9-14 7:02 PM
horizontal rule
72

That's kind of hard, actually. A decent summary about whether taking supplements is useful was published in the Atlantic last summer (similar in NYT as well) that might be an OK starting point. Wikipedia articles for both Vitamin C and Vitamin B are pretty reasonable, although the more technical info is first, so you have to scroll down a bit to get to what might be relevant.

Water-soluble vitamins have extremely high bioavailability. For Vitamin C, the Linus Pauling Institute is pretty good. They are overselling (for obvious reasons), but they have good references to track down further info. It does cover bioavailability.

For B vitamins, this article from Harvard School of Public Health is pretty good.

The reason it's better to get vitamins from food is really that food has other beneficial compounds, not just vitamins. The water-soluble vitamins are pretty bioavailable and also won't generally become toxic (if you consume too much, it just gets cleared as urine). Minerals (like calcium) depend on other factors (like their counterion) for effective absorption, which means that some supplements are basically useless (ever been told to take Tums for extra calcium?). For water-solubles, you miss things like fiber and small molecule plant metabolites that aren't classed as vitamins (for example, lycopene in tomatoes).

If this isn't what you're looking for, I can probably get at more or different material if you clarify what he might want.


Posted by: ydnew | Link to this comment | 03- 9-14 7:36 PM
horizontal rule
73

No, that's probably good. I don't want it to be too complicated. If you have any other interesting articles, then that would be great. I'd love to have something to send him that is more than a web site.

I was thinking about trying to find him something on folate and how what we get from food is not the same as OTC folic acid, but the only thing I found was something from a psychiatrist who espouses paleo eating.


Posted by: Bostoniangirl | Link to this comment | 03- 9-14 8:13 PM
horizontal rule
74

NIH fact sheet on folates. Explains the difference between naturally occurring folates and supplement, but lots of our food is currently supplemented. Also, all forms end up metabolized to the same thing, although I don't know whether they give identical serum levels.


Posted by: ydnew | Link to this comment | 03- 9-14 8:24 PM
horizontal rule
75

||

So apparently Ezra Klein's new site is going to be called... Vox. Still not a whole lot of detail on what it will actually be.

|>


Posted by: teofilo | Link to this comment | 03- 9-14 11:16 PM
horizontal rule
76

74: I read that somewhere some people have trouble with folate conversion.


Posted by: Bostoniangirl | Link to this comment | 03-10-14 5:01 AM
horizontal rule
77

Wait, yes, I have been told to take Tums for calcium! I haven't gotten around to actually doing so because I'm too lazy even to take vitamins, but is that not a good idea? A quick google isn't telling me much, so I'd be grateful, ydnew, if you'd tell elaborate.


Posted by: Mme. Merle | Link to this comment | 03-10-14 5:28 AM
horizontal rule
78

77: Tums is calcium carbonate, which requires acid to be bioavailable, so must be taken with (or immediately after) meals or else it's not absorbed. Calcium citrate is soluble without acid, so highly bioavailable regardless of gut pH (important, to for people who take proton pump inhibitors). In general, my understanding is that the citrate is a better choice for most people.

76: Looking around, will respond in a few minutes. I'm mostly seeing malabsorption problems, not conversion.


Posted by: ydnew | Link to this comment | 03-10-14 6:30 AM
horizontal rule
79

+o in 78.

76: OK, I think I see what you're seeing. So, folates are made up of a core molecule, called a pterin (pronounced "taren" like the name Karen), which is attached to one or more of the amino acid glutamate. In food, the pterin core will have a mix of one, two, or three glutamates (or more, but those aren't absorbed). Supplements have only one glutamate. When folates are consumed, the first thing to happen is that the extra glutamates are removed to give only one. The monoglutamated folate is then taken up into cells for processing. People who have malabsorption disorders have a defect in the protein that helps transport folates to the inside of the cell. Once inside the cell, there are many enzymatic processes that happen, and I'm seeing that several of these may be associated with disease. Basically, though, I can't find anything in the literature doing a quick search that would suggest that supplements are distinguishable from food source folates in terms of bioavailability or metabolism. Here is an overview in known defects in folate uptake and metabolism. (I'm linking the abstract, which shouldn't be paywalled.)


Posted by: ydnew | Link to this comment | 03-10-14 6:52 AM
horizontal rule