Re: Piketty Reading Group Setup

1

Ooh. Orange.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 6:21 AM
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It's supposed to be red.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 6:28 AM
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Orange is for ineffective attempts to organize political action. Red is for reading left wing economics. And teal was for Montaigne, if that ever comes up again.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 6:29 AM
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Who ever heard of a red title?


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 6:30 AM
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On my monitor it's more a red* colour.

* and I cheated, and looked at the rgb values.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 6:31 AM
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After holding up a Swiss Army knife to the screen, I see that it is indeed red, even if not Swiss Army red.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 6:31 AM
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7

Argh. Pwned.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 6:31 AM
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I would like to, but don't have a copy yet, and you shouldn't wait around on my account.


Posted by: ajay | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 6:32 AM
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re: 8

Various branches of Waterstone's have copies:

Postcode in here:

http://www.waterstones.com/waterstonesweb/displayStockAvailability.do?sku=10217184&excludeProductfromRC=false&reserveForCollection=false


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 6:33 AM
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Holy crap that title color is annoying in the sidebar.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 6:34 AM
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10 Tricolour.


Posted by: Barry Freed | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 6:36 AM
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Aux armes! Citoyens!


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 6:38 AM
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My e-copy showed up DAYS ago. I don't find the graphs a problem. Plus I don't feel like I'm defacing the book if I put little e-notes all over it.


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 6:45 AM
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9: aha. I did not know that was a thing. Done, and hopefully I'll be able to pick it up today. Thanks very much.


Posted by: ajay | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 6:47 AM
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re: 14

With the caveat that you may need to ring the shop if you don't hear after an hour or two, because sometimes they sell the copies between you placing the request, and someone going and picking it from the shelf. But yeah, it's dead handy. I've used it a few times.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 6:48 AM
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15: duly noted.


Posted by: ajay | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 6:51 AM
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I'll have mine tomorrow.


Posted by: Thorn | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 6:54 AM
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I have my e-copy and have even made e-notes all over the e-text. But I'm reluctant to kick the thing off because I'm not very economically literate and most of my notes are questions for somebody who is. I feel the first one up ought to be by somebody who has a firm grasp of what's going on, to set the tone.


Posted by: chris y | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 7:03 AM
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I'm not economically literate at all, and I've not even read the introduction, even though I've had the book for a few days. So I'm starting the way I will probably continue.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 7:17 AM
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I'll pick up a copy soonish. I dunno if I want to commit to a chapter though.


Posted by: Natilo Paennim | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 7:39 AM
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I'll pick up an e-copy by Monday.


Posted by: dalriata | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 7:41 AM
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No one should worry about economic literacy -- I'm certainly reading this as a layperson, and I think most of us are. Nor should you worry about committing to a chapter if you're not ready -- there are twelve more to come after the first five.

But is there anyone ready to go on the introduction? Halford? You've had the book longer than the rest of us.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 7:47 AM
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If no one's claimed the introduction by the end of the day, I'll take it.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 7:53 AM
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You can then nobly set the bar very low in order to encourage volunteers.


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 7:56 AM
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You have exposed my fiendish plan.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 7:57 AM
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I'm helping you save face.


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 7:58 AM
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Amazon says that I should get my copy on Friday.


Posted by: NickS | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 8:01 AM
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I have my copy, but haven't cracked it open yet. Though it being in the house has already elicited a comment from a relative about me reading communist books, so that's something.


Posted by: widget | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 8:03 AM
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I've got the Kindle preview, which should be enough to get me stated. The thing is priced too damn high for an e-book, I'm hoping it drops a bit by the time I've finished the parts in the preview. Because, you know, its important to save a couple bucks. And to stand up for the principal of cheep e-books.


Posted by: Spike | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 8:03 AM
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I'm happy to do the summary for the intro. The intro really is an overview of the whole book, though, so it will be hard to limit the discussion. Maybe I'll also include a few discussion questions to get things rolling.


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 8:05 AM
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And I will set the bar really really low. It seems to me the summaries should just be starting points for discussion, not exhaustive Cliffs Notes. Think of the most folk post of all folk posts.


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 8:08 AM
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There are easily obtainable e-book files on shared online libraries for those waiting. Or someone here could give you login credentials to access their kindle version on a cloud reader (I don't have a kindle version).


Posted by: Criminally Bulgur | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 8:08 AM
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27: I have an name.


Posted by: Opinionated Hippolyta | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 8:09 AM
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And I will set the bar really really low.

"As Piketty helpfully reminds us, the baleful influence of grain on the world economy cannot be overstated."


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 8:12 AM
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I can take chapter two.


Posted by: Minivet | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 8:18 AM
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<font color=red>The tyranny of the FPPblogarchy revealed through sleective support of html tags. </font>


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 8:18 AM
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35: As could 30 5-year olds.


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 8:19 AM
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I should note to any lurkers that you're welcome to participate either by volunteering to post or just commenting, and that anyone who's read the part of the book under discussion is welcome to join in on any comment thread even if they haven't been participating all along.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 8:31 AM
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No one has asked my opinion, but I will offer it anyway. Having received my copy of the book and read the introduction, including most particularly the outline of the remainder of the book that is at the end of the introduction, I think that Part One of the book may be signifcantly less fruitful ground for group discussion than Parts Two through Four will be. Starting our discussion with Part One may get the group off the a rough start. (There is especially nothing to discuss about the introduction--it's just an overview of the book.) Therefore, I'd propose that the reading group should actually start with Part Two. Give the people who just got the book extra time--one full week?--to read the introduction and Part One on their own (if they want--Piketty notes in the intro that this part of the book can be skipped at the reader's option), and then officially lauch the discussion group with the first chapter of Part Two.


Posted by: urple | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 8:37 AM
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Even if you're right, by fiat I declare that too confusing.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 8:40 AM
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39 -- Nah, there's tons to discuss in Part 1. I kind of agree with you about the introduction, we could just have everyone read the intro and start on the first chapter. But maybe discussing the intro is fine too.


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 8:42 AM
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I just got the book. I have a presentation to do on Tuesday though so probably won't have time to fully dig in until next week. Happy to help out however.


Posted by: PGD | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 8:43 AM
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You want to take the first chapter instead? Come to think, that does make more sense. And then Minivet's on for Chapter 2.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 8:44 AM
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I'm happy to start on Chapter 1. But everybody should definitely read the intro too.


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 8:46 AM
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43 to 41.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 8:47 AM
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46

Amazon was supposed to get me my copy yesterday. Capitalism has clearly failed.


Posted by: Eggplant | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 8:47 AM
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As could 30 5-year olds.

Could 30 5-year olds take 5 30-year olds? For what values of x and y would x y-year-olds and y x-year olds be evenly matched? What does the graph of these values look like when plotted on a cartesian coordinate system?


Posted by: Spike | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 9:03 AM
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If you guys are actually going to take this seriously, maybe I will feel left out enough to force myself to read an economics book. It is amazing what peer pressure can accomplish.


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 9:19 AM
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Honestly? This is all me pressuring myself into actually reading, rather than skimming, it. Lately, anything dense I find myself flipping through.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 9:22 AM
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Heebie seems best prepared to answer that, for both professional and personal reasons. It's symmetric about the diagonal, there's an asymptote at each of the axes, and it's undefined at the axes. This is just some scaled version of 1/x, right? Or at least something shaped like that.


Posted by: Eggplant | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 9:23 AM
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47: Somebody needs to make that a web quiz & widget or app or something. I bet someone has


Posted by: Annelid Gustator | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 9:23 AM
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Oh wait, it's not a single-valued function at all, because of course N N year olds are evenly matched by N N year olds for all N.


Posted by: Eggplant | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 9:27 AM
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50: I don't think it's that simple but I'd have to try plotting it out.


Posted by: ajay | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 9:27 AM
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52: and you might decide that, say, 3 30 year olds could take 30 3 year olds, and 2 30 year olds could take 30 2 year olds.


Posted by: ajay | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 9:30 AM
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Piketty notes in the intro that this part of the book can be skipped at the reader's option

Didn't he say it can be skipped by readers who are already versed in the definitions and historical record of various economic quantities? I, for one, found chapter one to be interesting and full of things I didn't know before. And given that it defines things like "r" and "g" and explains a bit about their historical trajectories, it seems like it probably shouldn't be skipped.

I haven't gone past chapter one yet.


Posted by: essear | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 9:32 AM
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Yeah. Also, fighting ability isn't monotonic with age.


Posted by: Eggplant | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 9:34 AM
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I think we've already hit the highlights of the introduction in various other threads, namely, his trashing of the economics profession and his referring to MIT as "a university located near Boston" or something like that in the context of his casually mentioning that he had a faculty job there at age 22.


Posted by: essear | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 9:34 AM
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We're trying to have a serious discussion here, essear.


Posted by: Eggplant | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 9:36 AM
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I still don't have a copy so I went to the remainder bin at the bookstore and got a book about the role of espionage in the d day landings.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 9:37 AM
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57: It really did do the heart good reading the introduction on the ills of the economics prevention generally. Having a reputable insider agree with all my favorite cranks is a lovely thing.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 9:38 AM
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there's an asymptote at each of the axes

Postulating infinite newborns seems kind of nutty, even at the rate heebie produces children. I think the question should probably stick with integer points.


Posted by: essear | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 9:39 AM
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Well, sure. At the very least, 5 30-year olds are the fighting equivalent of 5.x 30-year olds, but if, for the sake of argument, 5 30-year olds are evenly matched with 30 5-year olds, they would likely lose to 30 5.x-year olds.


Posted by: Eggplant | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 9:44 AM
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59: Just follow along chapter by chapter, and interject with anything from your book that seems relevant. If you run out of chapters, grab another book.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 9:56 AM
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Positive integers it is, then. Fighting ability is ideally linearly increasing with numbers (ignoring the possiblity that the combatants interfere with each other and that they work together well) but reaches a maximum at some age (let's say 30) and then starts to decline. Using the positive reals for visualization purposes, if we plot age and numbers on the x and y axes respectively, and fighting ability on the z axis we can then look for contour lines. The points, if any, that intersect the x-y diagonal and fall on integer values are the ones that satisfy Spikian conditions.


Posted by: Eggplant | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 10:00 AM
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God, I have so much work to do today.


Posted by: Eggplant | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 10:00 AM
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65: I know, right? You were only at 3 good qualities last I saw. Do you have to find a girlfriend before the reading group starts or not until the book's over?


Posted by: Thorn | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 10:02 AM
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66: Maybe I could get LB to deploy the orange post titles on my behalf.
Also, I did not intend 62 as a slight against the amputee community. Science is a messy and error-filled process, and whatever it is I'm doing doubly so.


Posted by: Eggplant | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 10:06 AM
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I should just get a Kindle copy, but I can't make myself do that when it's only $2.24 less than a hard-cover copy.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 10:08 AM
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80 1 year olds vs 1 80 year old would be an interesting match. It really all depends on the agility of the 80 year old.


Posted by: Spike | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 10:16 AM
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Thank you, Thorn.


Posted by: Megan | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 10:17 AM
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57, 60: Spoilers!

This thread inspired me to check out the nearby Barnes & Noble, which had copies, one of which is now in my possession.


Posted by: politicalfootball | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 10:21 AM
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I second the 'everyone read intro + chapter 1' approach. Then beginning the discussion at ch. 1.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 10:33 AM
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By when do I have to submit my summary/folk thoughts/rambling plea for attention on Chapter 1?


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 10:40 AM
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Email it to me by late Sunday night (early Monday morning is good too, but the idea is to get it to me before I need to leave for work), and I'll post it.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 10:43 AM
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Under some reasonable conditions I think one can prove that over the reals for any N there is an M not equal to N such that N M-year olds are the fighting equivalent of M N-year olds, so for any N, (N,M) and (N,N) are valid points. The main assumption is that peak fighting ability with age is broad.


Posted by: Eggplant | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 10:44 AM
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I got an old-fashioned real book, so I can do the dust jacket.


Posted by: politicalfootball | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 10:48 AM
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I'm now number 30 of 52 in the hold line at the library, which still only has one copy but has ordered 7 more.


Posted by: fake accent | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 10:54 AM
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This does not sound like a good situation in which to be holding your breath.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 10:55 AM
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I'm not sure if the case of the 80+ 1-year-olds vs the 1 80+-year-old can be adequately resolved. I don't think that any number of 1-year-olds would be able to physically overpower any >1-year-old simply due to mobility and coordination (both types) issues, but at a certain age and number of children to be punched, the adult will simply collapse of fatigue. Do you score that as a win for the babies?


Posted by: Tom Scudder | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 11:00 AM
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What are you all, professional economists who can't possibly countenance looking at a slightly blurry Kindle image of a chart?


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 11:01 AM
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Flipping back and forth to the charts is much more of a PITA on a Kindle than in a regular book.


Posted by: Tom Scudder | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 11:04 AM
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I don't think that any number of 1-year-olds would be able to physically overpower any >1-year-old simply due to mobility and coordination (both types) issues

It sort of depends on the situation. If we begin with the giant heap of 1-year-olds positioned directly above the N-year-old, the gravity will be enough for them to overpower the older person.


Posted by: essear | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 11:04 AM
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the s/b then


Posted by: essear | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 11:04 AM
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Which makes me slightly regret having bought the Kindle version, but not having to lug a big thick book around is nice.


Posted by: Tom Scudder | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 11:04 AM
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I would buy a Nook version, actually, but I don't buy ebooks if I actually think I want to "own" the book into the future and the ebook isn't DRM free.


Posted by: fake accent | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 11:06 AM
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68 to 80.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 11:07 AM
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Did anyone volunteer for chapter 3 yet? If not, I'll volunteer. Despite being almost totally ignorant of economics.


Posted by: essear | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 11:10 AM
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79: Yes. That was one of my assumptions, anyway. The final graph of allowed values includes the diagonal and some line symmetrical about the diagonal.


Posted by: Eggplant | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 11:11 AM
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I don't think it would take more than a handful of 1 year-olds to overpower my 82 year old father. Sure, they aren't coordinated, but neither is he.


Posted by: Spike | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 11:24 AM
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81 1 year olds wouldn't stand a chance against my mom, though.


Posted by: Spike | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 11:26 AM
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So, to be clear. We're not discussing the Introduction at all; or discussing it around essear's masterly summary at 57 above; or discussing it in tandem with chapter 1? Because there are a few points in there I wouldn't mind having a second or subsequent opinion on.


Posted by: chris y | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 11:36 AM
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The last of the three options -- talk about it in next Monday's thread on Chapter 1.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 11:39 AM
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I just went to see if the book could be gotten at the bookstore near my office. Answer: no, and the clerk said that everyone was after it, which I wasn't really expecting for a smallish shop in downtown SF.


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 11:57 AM
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(I also wasn't expecting it to be in stock.)


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 12:00 PM
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Is it one chapter per week, with summaries posted on Mondays? If it is, I can take Chapter 3 to post on June 2.


Posted by: unimaginative | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 12:21 PM
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Is it one chapter per week, with summaries posted on Mondays? If it is, I can take Chapter 3 to post on June 2.


Posted by: unimaginative | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 12:21 PM
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Essear claimed 3 already, but if you wanted 4 for 6/9, that's open.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 12:25 PM
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I am looking forward to enriching my understanding of this book from your comments. I read a Carl Hiassen this weekend, that was nice.

(Can we do David Harvey next?)


Posted by: k-sky | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 12:48 PM
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OK, I will take chapter 4.


Posted by: unimaginative | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 1:10 PM
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I volunteer for whatever seems like the dullest, most technical chapter. Is there one?


Posted by: Walt Someguy | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 1:24 PM
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We've got 1-4 claimed; I figure it makes sense not to plan too far ahead in case people's circumstances change.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 1:26 PM
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OK, then, back to business. Do you think 17 22-year olds could take 22 17-year olds?


Posted by: Spike | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 1:59 PM
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What weapons are they carrying?


Posted by: chris y | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 2:01 PM
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What state is it in?


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 2:05 PM
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Glass bottles with the ends broken off.


Posted by: Spike | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 2:05 PM
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Florida.


Posted by: Spike | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 2:06 PM
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My money's on the 17 year olds.

Many 80 year old men I know golf. Does the guy get to use a golf club against the one year olds? Maybe not a wood because that would be overkill but at least a putter.


Posted by: Barry Freed | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 2:10 PM
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Yeah, I think I'd go with the 17 year olds too. What I'm trying to figure out is where the line is between age and numerical advantage. I was thinking late-teens, early 20s, but it might actually be earlier than that.

Would 12 16-year olds beat 16 12-year olds?


Posted by: Spike | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 2:16 PM
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108 - I'd definitely put my money on the 16-year-olds in that one.


Posted by: Tom Scudder | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 2:18 PM
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Those 12 year olds are going to get stomped. I'd think the line is around puberty or about a year or so after - 13-14. Too bad this would never pass an IRB.


Posted by: Barry Freed | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 2:19 PM
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I feel a sudden sense of shame that this will constitute my sole contribution to the Piketty reading group.


Posted by: Barry Freed | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 2:21 PM
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I think I'd take 15 13 year olds over 13 15 year olds. 13-14 might be the toss up.

But yeah, this is all just speculation. There needs to be some empirical research done.


Posted by: Spike | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 2:26 PM
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Fencing version of uneven conflict


Posted by: lw | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 3:00 PM
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81: I got the Nook version of the book, and haven't noticed a problem with the charts. Flipping back and forth to the endnotes is considerably easier than in a paper edition (hyperlinks both ways). Only had a problem with getting it to not auto-rotate one table that was printed landscape rather than portrait (there's a setting to lock out the auto-rotate, but I didn't remember how to get to it on my old Nook that got stolen Saturday. New Nook has that control much more obvious.)


Posted by: Dave W. | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 6:04 PM
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A certain online retailer has 38 minutes left to get me the book by the promised deadline. Bastards. I blame capitalism.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 05-13-14 7:22 PM
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The campus bookstore wants $40 for it, but they now have a copy. Kindle seems like a better idea.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 05-14-14 10:05 AM
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Interesting Salon commentary on Piketty:

http://www.salon.com/2014/05/11/the_problem_with_thomas_piketty_capital_destroys_right_wing_lies_but_theres_one_solution_it_forgets/


Posted by: Dave W. | Link to this comment | 05-14-14 6:15 PM
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God, that's a terrible article, and Thomas Frank is kind of a stupid person. But it's useful for discussing the book.


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 05-14-14 6:40 PM
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I am starting a new job on Monday, which will make my participation in this reading group difficult and unlikely, at least for the first few weeks (maybe longer). I would like to believe this timing is pure coincidence, and not an intentional effort to exclude me. But it's a pretty amazing coincidence.


Posted by: urple | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 5:35 AM
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I liked the article in 117 and I think Thomas Frank is a smart person. So there!


Posted by: PGD | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 5:49 AM
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119: Is it a puppy or a wolf cub? Also, congratulations.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 5:58 AM
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God, that's a terrible article, and Thomas Frank is kind of a stupid person.

Is there any point in my learning to distinguish between Thomas Frank and Tommy Franks if I am just going to end up dismissing both as imbeciles?


Posted by: ajay | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 6:04 AM
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I don't understand any part of 121.


Posted by: urple | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 6:59 AM
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124

I don't understand it either, but it's a thing people ask around here so I figured I'd try it.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 7:00 AM
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And congratulations part was pretty clear though. As in, "You've talked to people and convinced them to pay you money. Good job."


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 7:01 AM
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Neither, it is genuinely novel.

Also, congratulations!


Posted by: Barry Freed | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 7:03 AM
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Is it a puppy or a wolf cub?

Neither, it is genuinely novel.

Also, congratulations!


Posted by: Barry Freed | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 7:03 AM
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Congrats, urple!

What's wrong with the review in 117?


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 7:08 AM
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As in, "You've talked to people and convinced them to pay you money. Good job."

But it's not an unconditional commitment on their part to pay me the money (which would be real cause for congratulations). I'm still going to have to work at a job (that presumably will be unpleasant, or they wouldn't pay people to do it).


Posted by: urple | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 7:09 AM
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My condolences on your continued lack of capital and thus the requirement that you must exchange your labor for money to survive.

I wonder if somebody has written has written a book on how hard it is to accumulate wealth just from working and if there are recent trends in the matter.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 7:12 AM
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130: thank you.


Posted by: urple | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 7:13 AM
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121: I think that "wolf cub" was defined as "perfect and amazing but dies after a year" but the fact that a) this isn't an obvious characteristic of a wolf cub, at least not more than any other sort of small animal, and b) I can't remember clearly shows the wisdom of the analogy ban.


Posted by: ajay | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 7:20 AM
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Oh, in that case it's definitely a stray puppy. Mutt. Ugly. No papers. Some mange. But my last puppy was even uglier, and was dying, so a new puppy is welcome.


Posted by: urple | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 7:29 AM
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Congratulations on your mangy puppy, urple. Here's hoping it grows up to be a terrifying hound of the Baskervilles.


Posted by: togolosh | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 7:34 AM
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Not that I want you to be terrified, rather you should do the terrifying.


Posted by: togolosh | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 7:35 AM
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In the book, that guy dies (probably) and while guy who was terrified lives on as a very rich man.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 7:39 AM
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137

SPOILER ALERT


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 7:39 AM
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Yay, urple!


Posted by: Thorn | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 7:40 AM
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I thought urple actually adopted a stray puppy. The truth is less interesting. The deeper truth -- that the puppy/wolf cub/etc. thing is insanely maddening -- remains one of unfogged's signal features.


Posted by: Ray Cyst | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 7:42 AM
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Oh my god, urple, you can't abandon your poor dying puppy.


Posted by: Eggplant | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 7:42 AM
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127 It's a Black-tailed Antechinus.


Posted by: chris y | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 7:42 AM
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Still, congratulations are in order, I suppose.


Posted by: Ray Cyst | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 7:42 AM
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132: I lobbied for referring to jobs like that as gazelles, which are notoriously shortlived but affectionate, but nobody went for it.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 7:56 AM
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I got my copy of the book, I will try to do the reading for the first post -- by Monday, correct?


Posted by: NickS | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 8:00 AM
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Yep.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 8:08 AM
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Kindle copy resorted to. 2% of treatise read. This ebook stuff is new to me. Do I get an intellectual decoder ring now?

Or maybe you could get those badges like in Steam games. "Economic History For the Impatient achieved!"


Posted by: conflated | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 9:01 AM
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Right at this minute, reading the first couple of pages with a cup of tea and some Debussy playing. If I still smoked, I'd be smoking.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 9:04 AM
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Smoking a pipe, obviously. I suggest that ttaM deliver his chapter summary in video form from a fireside armchair.


Posted by: ajay | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 9:05 AM
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A pipe, or some variety of stinky French unfiltered fag. Or something Bond-like, maybe. Hand-made with a gold ring around them, in a tiny boutique tobacconists off the Strand.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 9:08 AM
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Pipe, definitely. You're an Oxford academic, remember. Inhabit the role. LB can deliver hers while walking very fast down a corridor followed by a gaggle or coterie of junior lawyers.


Posted by: ajay | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 9:10 AM
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We do have a very long hallway here.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 9:11 AM
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bob mcmanus can deliver his half-concealed in the shadows in a bamboo hut.


Posted by: ajay | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 9:14 AM
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Sharpening something where it's not quite visible below the frame.

For Urple, we've already seen circus pictures -- I think that's a theme that could profitably be explored further.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 9:16 AM
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I slightly spoiled the effect by switching to Ahmad Jamal, as the Debussy was getting annoying in a tinkly French way.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 9:26 AM
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I swear I read the whole thread, but I'm not entirely clear on what I need to have read by when.

Is it Intro + Chapter 1 by Monday?

Kthxbye.


Posted by: Parenthetical | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 11:28 AM
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That's right.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 11:30 AM
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And I'll put up a post tonight with the schedule and responsible posters for the first four chapters, because you're right that it hasn't been made properly explicit.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 11:31 AM
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149-152 are all wonderful. ♥


Posted by: NickS | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 11:34 AM
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Perfect! Wasn't meant to be criticism - I read the thread well after it happened and I'm in holiday mode so I just wasn't sure if I had picked up on the particulars correctly. Thanks, LB!


Posted by: Parenthetical | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 11:35 AM
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147-48: Good to know that the 1970s "Masterpiece Theatre" opening sequence wasn't hiding the truth about how British people live.


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 11:40 AM
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Re:160

Between that and the lyrics of Geezer Butler, all bases covered.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 12:17 PM
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I am now 29 on the hold list. Someone ahead of me must have given up.


Posted by: fake accent | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 12:24 PM
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Or been bought off by someone with inherited wealth.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 12:25 PM
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152: did anyone ever figure out what happened to bob?


Posted by: K-sky | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 1:07 PM
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Ah I see he was in the previous thread setting up the reading group. Macho niches.


Posted by: | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 1:14 PM
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How is lw doing? I haven't seen him here since he posted about his accident.


Posted by: Eggplant | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 1:20 PM
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Ironically, people in the thread were complaining about being ignored.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 1:22 PM
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I think I disagree about the sentiment expressed in 167. I'm impressed by those who make longer arguments here. And I don't do it myself but I think my writing would improve if I made the effort.


Posted by: Barry Freed | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 1:29 PM
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Lord, it took me a minute to figure out why you linked to that comment. "Lw isn't complaining about being ignored."


Posted by: Eggplant | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 1:31 PM
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59: that sounds like a book I might want to read, in case you want to share the title---perhaps after you surprise us with random injections from it.

Thanks for including the intro, there things in it I wanted to discuss.


Posted by: Saheli | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 2:14 PM
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By this Monday? Can I have an extension?


Posted by: Walt Someguy | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 2:42 PM
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170: It's "Double Cross: The True Story of the D-Day Spies." I'm not far enough in to know if I like it or not yet.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 3:03 PM
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171: It'll affect your grade.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 3:12 PM
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The deeper truth -- that the puppy/wolf cub/etc. thing is insanely maddening

Yes.


Posted by: Megan | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 3:17 PM
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Just because something is insanely maddening, we don't need to stop doing it.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 3:18 PM
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I liked the wolf cub thing, but that's most likely a residual effect from feeling proud that I had correctly guessed AWB's school based on little but a hunch.

Does the Kindle version of the book have page numbers?


Posted by: J, Robot | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 3:33 PM
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Nope. Percents, and meaningless location numbers in the thousands which track your progress against no unit whatsoever. That is the one thing I find pretty irritating.


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 3:35 PM
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Got my Piketty yesterday. I personally hate reading endnotes on my regular-flavor Kindle, so prefer paper copies of nonfiction. Piketty has a lot of endnotes.


Posted by: Bave | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 3:54 PM
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Endnotes do suck on Kindle. But I love being able to instantly look up any phrase or word on the internet.


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 05-15-14 4:06 PM
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Seconding 174, et al. I found it utterly incomprehensible to the point of annoyance at the time. No offence intended to the devious obfuscators, obviously.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 05-16-14 3:46 AM
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I was all prepared to hate on Summers' review of Piketty, but he
raises points that I think require a response.

I'm just into the first chapter, but I've been surprised at how much of the criticism I've seen has been anticipated and addressed by Piketty in the book.


Posted by: politicalfootball | Link to this comment | 05-16-14 8:28 AM
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I've been away for a couple of days, so I don't know if I've missed anything in other threads, but I gather that we're on for intro and chapter 1 this Monday, right? And we'll be on the disused reading group page?


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 05-16-14 9:32 AM
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I hadn't thought about moving back to the reading group page, I was just planning to color-code the titles. Any good reasons to do it either way?

And yes, introduction and chapter 1 for Monday.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 05-16-14 9:38 AM
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166. Basically well, thanks. Healing, no pain. Rigid neck brace for at least another week, consequently underslept and in a bad mood due to lack of exercise and inconvenience of not being able to drive at all.

Ordered Piketty, hasn't come yet. Someone, I think Walt, mentioned Kaldor's facts in an earlier thread, looking at those convinced me that the book would be worth reading.


Posted by: lw | Link to this comment | 05-16-14 9:43 AM
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I'm made of sterner stuff than politicalfootball because I can find a lot to hate in that review.


Posted by: Eggplant | Link to this comment | 05-16-14 11:04 AM
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Are you still making your list? Because that seems a little too specific.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 05-16-14 11:07 AM
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4) Not as softhearted as pf.
5) Possessed of a hatred for Summers that is rarely surpassed.


Posted by: Eggplant | Link to this comment | 05-16-14 11:13 AM
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6) More testicles than average.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 05-16-14 11:15 AM
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183: well, the color-coded post titles are terrible, so there's that.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 05-16-14 11:39 AM
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189: I don't really care, but is there any reason for them to be color-coded? Is the different color supposed to indicate that we are supposed to be serious?


Posted by: peep | Link to this comment | 05-16-14 11:45 AM
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189: I don't really care, but is there any reason for them to be color-coded? Is the different color supposed to indicate that we are supposed to be serious?


Posted by: peep | Link to this comment | 05-16-14 11:45 AM
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Does it really annoy people? I was sort of hoping to keep the book discussion threads, while not entirely free of chatter, less likely to go completely irrelevantly frivolous, and setting them off visually seemed like it'd help. If a couple more people beyond Sifu hate the color coding too, I'll quit it. But if it's just Sifu, they stay red because who cares what that guy thinks?


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 05-16-14 11:50 AM
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We can also keep the threads on topic by sending deviationists to reeducation camps.


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 05-16-14 11:54 AM
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Just as another option.


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 05-16-14 11:54 AM
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Actually I'm kind of thinking that identification of deviationists for future reeducation will be the point of this "discussion group."


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 05-16-14 11:57 AM
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I'm in favour of keeping them red, because it's easier to see if there's been any activity lately. It's easy to miss something if most of the sidebar is one thread and there's the odd comment in among it all.


Posted by: chris y | Link to this comment | 05-16-14 11:58 AM
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We should use red for book threads and green for other threads. Make it easier to figure out who is color blind.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 05-16-14 12:01 PM
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I'm just going to leave these pictures of cats on Capital here.


Posted by: Nathan Williams | Link to this comment | 05-16-14 12:05 PM
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because who cares what that guy thinks?

Ain't that the truth.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 05-16-14 12:08 PM
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||

[Money, so, meh, maybe this thread?]

So, here's some odd shit.

1) I paid an electric bill a few weeks back. Via the electricity company's on-line payment system. I checked at the time that I'd done so.

2) A few days later, I logged into my internet banking, and, wondering why I had less money than expected, spotted the electricity payment, and all was well.

3) Anyway, three or four weeks later, I get a final demand and threatening letter from the electricity company.

4) Hah, fuck you, I think. And login and check my internet banking to gather proof, and the transaction isn't there.

WTF? I can't see how that could happen. 1) and 2) aren't confabulated memories. I had a conversation with my wife, 'I'm paying the electric bill now', and I definitely remember counting through and checking my transactions, and seeing the electricity payment.

So, let's say the electricity companies online system fucked up, and rejected the payment [some days later], surely I should see it being re-credited to my account? Rather than the transaction never having happened in the first place?

Also, spookily, my online account with electricity company now shows no payment history, and no previous bills, other than the current one. And yet, there have been several previous bills, and all paid.

>


Posted by: Alex Salmond | Link to this comment | 05-16-14 12:25 PM
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I'd guess your account got reset, restarted at the electric company. Ask them to find the old info. Is the account number the same?


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 05-16-14 12:27 PM
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The current color makes me think a wiki entry needs to be created at the link.


Posted by: fake accent | Link to this comment | 05-16-14 12:54 PM
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Piketty procured! It's flying off the shelves at my local bookstore -- there was a big hole in the new releases section, and they had to go in the back to open a new shipment of 'em.


Posted by: Natilo Paennim | Link to this comment | 05-16-14 3:36 PM
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200 is indeed super weird.


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 05-16-14 3:42 PM
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200: I know that credit holds will show up as debits and then disappear without showing a credit back. (If you use a card to pay at the gas station, you'll usually see a small charge on your account - like $1 - for a couple of days, then the full amount later.)


Posted by: Josh | Link to this comment | 05-16-14 3:47 PM
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