Re: Miles

1

They did the stats for rugby, too.

http://www.rfu.com/news/2011/april/news%20articles/140411_gps_premiership

http://www.sport24.co.za/Rugby/Super14/Physiological-demands-of-rugby-20100302

Looks to be about 4.5 miles per game, for the players who do the most running, and about 3 for the players who do the least. Lots of that is sprinting, though. And there's a lot of impacts per game. Up to 300 per game, for the forwards.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:06 AM
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Oh, nice. I was just mentally griping that this was no use for Sally's purposes.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:09 AM
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If she ever gets into an argument about it with an American Football fan, there's no contest. Much more running, and many more minutes physically active.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:14 AM
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I've heard NFL players say publicly that they wouldn't play Rugby: too hard and too fast.


Posted by: chris y | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:16 AM
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I think by the time they're in the NFL, they're so specialized that transitioning would be hard. At the level where Sally's meeting other players, most (not all, but probably more than half) of the boys and men have an American football history and didn't find the switch too hard, other than remembering not to throw forward.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:18 AM
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If baseball is the least strenuous of the listed activities because it has the least running, then swimming must be really easy.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:19 AM
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Lots of that is sprinting

I guess it depends on how you define "lots," and I'm happy to define "lots of sprinting" as "any sprinting," but the first link says that the players who sprint most sprint about 1/3 of a mile, and the second link says players spend about 5% of their time sprinting.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:21 AM
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re: 7

I suppose it depends how you count sprinting. They are running 'fast' whether that's a fast jog or a fast sprint 100+ times a match. 5% of an 80 minute match sprinting is quite a 'lot' for me.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:24 AM
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You know what sport has crazy amounts of running?

Ultramarathoners. Seriously those guys spend like the whole time running. Wild!


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:24 AM
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I want to know what sport people spend the most time 1. throwing or 2. punching.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:25 AM
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The sport that's most impressive if you care about people running the most is distance running. Or, if you care about fitness, you can come watch this with me in a few weeks, which will test who actually is the fittest. But as Kenny Powers says, real athletes play real sports, they're not trying to be the best at exercising.


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:25 AM
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Fitness is pulling weights across astroturf?


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:26 AM
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Crossfit Games


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:27 AM
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5:other than remembering not to throw forward.

I found that it was the staying behind the ball and not blocking out front that seemed to be hardest for US football folks to adjust to (not me personally as I never played a down of organized football). But I suspect your line was but a throwaway as it is only the QB who ever (and at most once per play) throws forward.


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:29 AM
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You know what sport has really kinda disappeared? That sport where a super badass guys with a sword tries to see how many hapless flunkies he can kill while they run at him one at a time armed with axes or whatever. Too bad, but I have to assume it was always hard to recruit those hapless flunkies for anything but the highest-profile events. Jai Alai too, not much of that around anymore.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:30 AM
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I confess I've watched some of the Crossfit Games in the past. It's kind of cool and kind of ridiculous, and some of those folks are very impressive, although obviously the "fittest" claim is just PR/trolling.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:32 AM
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This was another impressive test of pure fitness. With insufficient attention to strength, but just the right amount of Alan Thicke.


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:33 AM
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We all know what the ultimate test of cerebral fitness is.


Posted by: Opinionated Murray Head | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:34 AM
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13 to 17, but I admit 17 added a lot of value.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:35 AM
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I'm also friends with a few people involved in this, which has some overlap with the Crossfit world. We'll see if it takes off, but if it does it will be a way better test of fitness than just who does the most distance running.


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:36 AM
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16: The most hilarious part of the Crossfit Games I've seen was the on/off-road cycling. Most of the competitors couldn't even wear their helmets properly, let alone handle a bike.


Posted by: Josh | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:37 AM
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That's because they don't have time for some triathalon bullshit. Also I'd like to see the road cyclists do clean and jerks.


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:39 AM
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I do appreciate that the link in 20 provides no information whatsoever about what the "races" actually consist of. I'm glad to know it's easy to find information about how the league is structured, though.


Posted by: Josh | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:40 AM
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24

I share the sentiment behind 23. I can't figure what it is.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:41 AM
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22: Look, it's not my fault you chose a "sport" that has no skill component to it.


Posted by: Josh | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:42 AM
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At this point I have to assume that Halford is an unemployed yoga instructor looking to discredit other forms of fitness.


Posted by: Walt Someguy | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:43 AM
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15: Here you go!


Posted by: Eggplant | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:45 AM
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Look at "highlights" under the profitness page (or don't). It's basically co-ed team crossfit.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:45 AM
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I think I may be missing what the point of a test of fitness per se is supposed to actually accomplish. Fitness for what?

Anyhow I've always thought the athletes with the most intimidating combination of usable strength and endurance are found in MMA. They probably can't run very fast, though.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:46 AM
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Shouldn't have to.


Posted by: clew | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:48 AM
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The decathlon, although it too de-emphasizes cardiac endurance, is still the best test we have for "fitness," defined as cardiac endurance/strength/coordination.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:48 AM
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Profitness, successfulship, dynamicity.


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:49 AM
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33

Grappling was the most anaerobically exhausting activity I've ever done. Not many miles traversed, though.


Posted by: Eggplant | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:49 AM
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34

Re: 22

You might be surprised. Maybe not cycling, but I remember reading that skinny white triple jumper (and record holder) Jonathan Edwards had the highest one-rep squat in the whole GB track and field team (excluding the hammer and discus guys, I assume).


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:49 AM
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35

Triple jump I'd definitely believe. It's a very similar skill set.


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:51 AM
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They probably can't run very fast, though.

I don't know about the MMA/boxing difference, but aren't boxers generally pretty impressive as runners? (Oh, I guess boxers stay on their feet all bout, while MMA gets into wrestling more.)


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:52 AM
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They should switch the decathlon mile to a 5k and up the point share for the event. These guys are impressive as hell, and then they lumber around the track for a mile, looking like clods.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:52 AM
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38

I thought everyone knew this was the way the greatest overall athlete was determined. I had no idea it went on for so long -- I just remember it from the 1970s.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superstars#List_of_American_National_Superstars_Champions


Posted by: peep | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:52 AM
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39

If I wasn't at work, I'd find the Gymkata fight scene for 15.


Posted by: Tom Scudder | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:53 AM
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36: I'm sure they have fantastic endurance, but whenever I've seen serious martial artists trying to run fast, they look ridiculous. Maybe they're overdeveloped in ways that hinder running? I dunno. I don't know about boxers.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:55 AM
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Boxers do a lot of roadwork, but it's not really fast, I don't think. They are building a good aerobic base to add to all the fast anaerobic type work they do in the gym.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:58 AM
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42

Your stereotypical boxer runs up to, but not into, an art museum.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:59 AM
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43

Re: 35

He could clean 330lbs for reps, too, based on some old interviews.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:59 AM
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44

39: I was actually thinking of a recent scene in HBO's Hobbit Murder Orgy where a dude was "training" by disemboweling hapless opponents who run at him, swords ineffectively flailing, one after the other. How does that work? How did that ever work? Okay, I get it, you use prisoners or slaves, but is that really an efficient or remotely effective way to get yourself in shape for anything? I'm thinking anybody hapless or desperate enough to run at you (instead of, like, away) after ten of his pals have been serially sent to their gory deaths is just not going to challenge you.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 10:59 AM
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45

I agree that because of the talent pool for the decathlon, the top decathletes are probably currently the best generally physically fit athletes on earth. Still, the decathlon only tests against a relatively small domain of fitness, including but not limited to endurance and pure strength.


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 11:01 AM
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46

44: Ha. I thought that very thing.


Posted by: oudemia | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 11:02 AM
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47

tests against a relatively small domain of fitness

It depends on how you're defining a domain--if you're looking for very specific tests, then sure, but the the ten events cover a lot of abilities--you have to be strong to shot put, agile to throw a discus, coordinated to pole vault, explosive to long jump, etc. What are you thinking of?


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 11:06 AM
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48

Top level big wall climbers have a pretty crazy combination of pure strength, long term endurance, and athleticism.


Posted by: teraz kurwa my | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 11:07 AM
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49

47: swordin' hapless dudes.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 11:09 AM
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50

The Superstars was first broadcast by ABC Sports as a two-hour special in 1973. Bob Seagren, an Olympic pole vault gold medalist, was the first winner. However, it was heavyweight champion boxer Joe Frazier who nearly stole the show. In the very first event, the 50 meter swimming heats, Frazier nearly drowned, and only after he was retrieved from the pool did he admit to commentators that he didn't know how to swim. When a reporter asked him why he tried the race, Frazier replied, "How was I to know I couldn't unless I tried it?" He also famously opined, "That Mark Spitz," (who had won several gold medals for swimming at the 1972 Olympics) "is a tough muthafucker!


Posted by: peep | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 11:10 AM
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47 -- oh, I think it does a good job of testing a lot of stuff, but I'd add in (a) more endurance (b) more max lifting (max strength is different than what you need for e.g. a shotput throw) and (c) add in some randomness to test relatively untrained reactions.


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 11:14 AM
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51 c - so that could include attacks by ninjas at random intervals (during other events)?


Posted by: Tom Scudder | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 11:17 AM
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53

I don't think the kill small dudes who run at you for sport method shown in Game of Thrones has much basis in medieval swordsmanship training, just as the 1000 whores per non-whore female occupation ratio isn't a totally accurate statement of medieval social or women's history.


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 11:17 AM
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The video in 27 suggests an answer to 44. There is an endurance component.


Posted by: Eggplant | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 11:18 AM
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Grappling was the most anaerobically exhausting activity I've ever done.

Yeah, this is actually the part of soccer that wears me out the most. I can go up and down the field all day long, and keep sprinting to make a run even late in the game, but trying to hold off a defender and turn them just kills me.

Actually, what I realized the other day is that what holds me back more than anything is willpower. I'm more spent at the end of a training session than I ever am at the end of a game, because I have other people encouraging me to keep pushing myself in a way I just don't in a game.


Posted by: Josh | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 11:21 AM
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55: Are you sure you're not subconsciously saving yourself more in the game? I find it pretty easy to tell myself that the uncertainty in sport means I should hold back early, and then I end up not having given my all.


Posted by: Eggplant | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 11:24 AM
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Have you tried giving 110%?


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 11:29 AM
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58

Woo soccer we win everything!


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 11:30 AM
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I've left parts of my teeth on the mat on a couple of occasions. Is that what you mean?


Posted by: Eggplant | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 11:31 AM
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Which parts?


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 11:32 AM
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Jai Alai too, not much of that around anymore.

Except in Wednesday NYT crosswords.


Posted by: Mister Smearcase | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 11:33 AM
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56: Right, that's what I mean. Well, that and that it's kind of hard to keep up the motivation to try as hard as possible when you make a run only to not get the pass at the end of it, because the guy with the ball decided he'd rather take on three defenders or try to lob the keeper from 25 yards.


Posted by: Josh | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 11:33 AM
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59: You know they make mouthguards, right?


Posted by: Josh | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 11:34 AM
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The tip of a canine, and some chunks of my front incisors. Always wear a properly fitted mouth guard, kids.


Posted by: Eggplant | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 11:35 AM
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Maybe I should try wrestling. Can you learn that as an adult? It could be a good way of venting the endless well of anger within my soul. Also it's hot. You know what, probably never mind.


Posted by: Mister Smearcase | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 11:36 AM
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because the guy with the ball decided

Team sports, I do not miss you.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 11:37 AM
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44: it seems to work ok in A Funny Thing Happened on the Way to the Forum.


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 11:40 AM
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Smearcase, you should totally try BJJ. There are lots of adult beginners, it's a great workout, and it's incredibly fun. I do have to say that even when I've rolled with women (and there were some amazingly attractive Brazilian women at the gym I used to go to) I didn't find it at all sexy. Too much focus on survival.


Posted by: Eggplant | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 11:41 AM
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The sport statistic that always freaked me out was how much water weight a player lost during play. A hockey player can shed 5-7 pounds in a single game. What is that for soccer players?


Posted by: calico | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 11:41 AM
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I get way more tired in a game than in practices, because I can't ever care very much in practice, but in games I can't hold back at all. (Also, your adult leagues hold practices?) God, pre-kids I played 3-5 games of soccer every week. I was in such great shape.


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 11:41 AM
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Team sports, I do not miss you.

This is why I prefer small-sided games. With only 5 players a side, that sort of thing doesn't happen nearly as often.

And it's so great when your team clicks and you move the ball around and rip the other team apart.


Posted by: Josh | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 11:48 AM
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Yeah, I lied; sometimes I really do miss playing a team sport, but my ankles are done with me, even if I wasn't quite done with my ankles.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 11:52 AM
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I skied a 10K nordic race once when I was a fairly fit runner and found it exhausting. Undoubtedly I had poor form and was on waxless (i.e., slow) skis but geez there were a lot of moving parts to keep track of compared to running. I finished toward the back of the pack and wince to recall being beaten at the finish line by a woman whom I had punkishly written off as a "grandma."


Posted by: bill | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 11:54 AM
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74

My ankles don't like it when I go down stairs.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 11:57 AM
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a woman whom I had punkishly written off as a "grandma."

Dude, if a grandma shows up to a 10K ski race, you can count on her being nails.

As I suppose you discovered.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 11:57 AM
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Did you meet my mom? (Under 3hr nordic marathons in her sixties - not that she would be caught dead with waxless skis)


Posted by: teraz kurwa my | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 12:08 PM
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If the post title is in Latin: "Now cased in armour, he would practise leaping on to the back of a horse; anon, to accustom himself to become long-winded and enduring, he would walk and run long distances on foot, or he would practise striking numerous and forcible blows with a battle-axe or mallet. In order to accustom himself to the weight of his armour, he would turn somersaults whilst clad in a complete suit of mail, with the exception of his helmet, or would dance vigorously in a shirt of steel; he would place one hand on the saddle-bow of a tall charger, and the other on his neck, and vault over him...He would climb up between two perpendicular walls that stood four or five feet asunder by the mere pressure of his arms and legs, and would thus reach the top, even if it were as high as a tower, without resting either in the ascent or descent...When he was at home, he would practise with the other young esquires at lance-throwing and other warlike exercises, and this continually."

Same article, 1482, more fun: "All morning long to God they pray, and after noon they laugh and play. They wrestle and they fence with swords, they throw big stones, and serve great lords. Manly exercises are their sports, they have good luck in princely courts."

Lots of mention of sparring constantly with equals, no particular mention of hewing down villeins as practice.


Posted by: clew | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 12:18 PM
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Dude, if a grandma shows up to a 10K ski race, you can count on her being nails.

75, 76 - This lesson has burned into my consciousness.


Posted by: bill | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 12:28 PM
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Re: 77

They dug up the skeleton of a 14th c. knight at Stirling Castle a few years back and did a forensic reconstruction. Basically, 5ft. 9, about 200lbs, hugely muscular, big dense bones. Hard-core life-long trained athlete.


Posted by: | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 1:40 PM
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Fitness for what?

Survival!


Posted by: Herbert Spencer | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 1:41 PM
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81

I want to know how far I go in a hockey game. Last night I played a 100 minute pickup, 2 lines. Each 3 minutes shift I probably go end to end maybe 6 times plus some cross ice stuff, so say minimum 1000 feet per shift. In 100 minutes I'll get about 15 shifts so that's about 3 miles. I have no idea if that's a good estimate though. Of course on skates you can glide some of the time.


Posted by: SP | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 1:44 PM
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This story made me want histograms, felt kind of weak without them. No love for field hockey or cricket or kabbadi, I see. Which is, in fact, perfectly understandable.


Posted by: Ile | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 5:51 PM
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83

Swinging a sword is very fatiguing and armor is uncomfortable, but according to the History Channel it is eminently possible to do somersaults in full plate , even if it is +2 to saving throws against filthy nerditry.


Posted by: Flippanter | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 6:03 PM
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I want to know how far I go ...


Posted by: Turgid Jacobian | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 6:15 PM
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85

Knights never put their armor in the washing machine. They would just leap into freezing rivers in full armor to sterilize it.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 6:16 PM
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In unrelated news, no one tell TWYRCL that I put my never-washed jeans in the freezer for two nights last week.


Posted by: Flippanter | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 6:17 PM
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85: heard that they knew urine is sterile and so they gathered all the squires to pee on them. Hence the alternate word for servant, "peon."


Posted by: Turgid Jacobian | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 6:27 PM
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81: The boyfriend has a few teammates who wear FitBits, but they don't work well. They can't track gliding, so they give nonsense values. He's played a couple recently where he was on ice for 2/3 of the game, which leaves him more tired than the three mile runs he does daily. 2-4 miles seems to be Google's guess.


Posted by: ydnew | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 6:41 PM
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I want to know how far I go ...

On his two line pickups....


Posted by: teraz kurwa my | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 6:43 PM
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39: Gymkata


Posted by: Tom Scudder | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 7:03 PM
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61: smearcase, you are my brother in not-sports-doing. I have the luxury of living somewhere hot, so I can swim 5 desultory laps over the course of an hour which is actually spent working on my tan, with the head of my lounger in the shade usually or else a boater on my face (it blows off, though. this is my biggest sports-equipment problem.) I recommend doing the NYT crossword and controlling your weight via tedious borderline eating-disordered behaviors, and not worrying about fitness. having said that, I'm really sick, and you're not, so you should probably be fit so you can be agile past 60 and stuff. I am at this very moment in bed eating off a tray in year three of "in bed eating off a tray," and I must say that it gets very boring. also, this...um...."diet and exercise" strategy lamentably works better for women than men I think. and if I ever got exercise I could presumably eat. I hear jai alai is making a comeback?


Posted by: alameida | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 7:45 PM
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My sympathies on the bed-ridden part of things. I hadn't realized you were still stuck there.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 06- 2-14 8:21 PM
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This is on-topic given the swordistry, right?

I don't know why they didn't invite Heidegger - to slight unfogged reading groups everywhere? Next they'll have an economists MMORPG night and not invite Peekittee.

http://www.critical-theory.com/dungeons-and-dragons-and-philosophers-comic/


Posted by: simulated annealing | Link to this comment | 06- 3-14 1:34 AM
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Maybe they just have a strict anti-Nazi policy.


Posted by: teofilo | Link to this comment | 06- 3-14 1:42 AM
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re: 83

Yeah. I saw another BBC documentary years ago, in which they put some fit guys in historically accurate plate armour, and then had them do assault courses, and things. They could do push-ups, climb walls, run, , do forward rolls, etc. The whole thing totally debunked all the myths about knights falling down and being unable to get up, or having to be craned about as they were totally immobile. It was heavy, but because it's very well distributed across the body, and properly strapped on, if you are fit and strong, you can basically do all the things you'd do without it.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 06- 3-14 2:36 AM
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A couple of thoughts:
1. Hockey players are amazing athletes.
2. Someone mentioned nordic skiing. In cycling and swimming, a ten percent improvement in streamlining (reduction in drag or friction) is far more important than a 20 percent increase in fitness. I suspect the same is true for nordic skiing. Grandma who knows what she is doing is going to crush the great athlete who is a beginner.


Posted by: will | Link to this comment | 06- 3-14 5:50 AM
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