Re: Hold Your Breath

1

That list is actually way better than the title would lead one to expect (despite the obvious ridiculousness of the exercise and yes I will be the grump/scold/whatever marvelling at how many of them happened to write in English).


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 8:49 AM
horizontal rule
2

Also I was sure that the most important Chicago Jew would be Saul Bellow.


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 8:53 AM
horizontal rule
3

Euripides: Before him, Greek drama was Happy Days and Good Times. Yeah, like the episode where at the end Fonzie rushes out screaming, ἄναξ Ἄπολλον, αἵδε πληθύουσι δή, κἀξ ὀμμάτων στάζουσιν αἷμα δυσφιλές.


Posted by: chris y | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 8:53 AM
horizontal rule
4

Not all of us know ancient Greek, you know.


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 8:57 AM
horizontal rule
5

The list in the OP is obviously correct in its entirety.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 9:02 AM
horizontal rule
6

3, 4: Something about Lord Apollo, eyes, blood, and bad friends?


Posted by: Benquo | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 9:06 AM
horizontal rule
7

Maybe something filling up too?


Posted by: Benquo | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 9:07 AM
horizontal rule
8

3.Bet Fonzie didn't.

Something like, "Lord Apollo! Look, there are droves of them, and they drip horrible blood from their eyes!" (Originally Orestes, in Aeschylus' Libation Bearers, referring to the Furies, pursuing him for murdering his mother, one of those plot devices so common in American sitcoms.)


Posted by: chris y | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 9:10 AM
horizontal rule
9

Or multiplying, I don't know Greek either.


Posted by: Benquo | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 9:10 AM
horizontal rule
10

3: Was that the one in which he jumped the shark?

Does anybody else remember the Happy Days episode in which Fonzie played Hamlet?


Posted by: peep | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 9:12 AM
horizontal rule
11

Well, Fonzie always did like the birds.


Posted by: Ginger Yellow | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 9:15 AM
horizontal rule
12

Wait, it is now "assumed" that Auden was gay? As in, researchers have found textual clues in his work or something? I thought he was straightforwardly out.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 9:20 AM
horizontal rule
13

James Garner's death made me wonder again about Juanita Bartlett, who wrote most of the best Rockford episodes.

What about Matthew Weiner? The first few seasons of Mad Men, while Draper had a secret, were really pretty good.

Oh, if Sebald (which I agree with) then also Bolano. Can't stand DH Lawrence.


Posted by: lw | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 9:25 AM
horizontal rule
14

12. He was.


Posted by: chris y | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 10:06 AM
horizontal rule
15

Well, yeah, I was pretty sure. I mean, "Auden assumed gay" is right up there with "Generalissimo Franco still dead."


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 10:08 AM
horizontal rule
16

12/14: but we have no way of knowing whether that was just an act. Maybe he was a closeted straight man.


Posted by: urple | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 10:09 AM
horizontal rule
17

16: Because straight male poets were so oppressed in the 20th century.


Posted by: peep | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 10:31 AM
horizontal rule
18

Interesting that two authors who in 1930 were considered half of the of top four have fallen off the list of 100.


Posted by: bob mcmanus | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 11:45 AM
horizontal rule
19

Huh, I was thinking the placement of Gertrude Stein was the most ridiculous placement, and then I got to the end. Clearly William Faulkner is the greatest author, in any language, of all time.


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 11:51 AM
horizontal rule
20

DH Lawrence in, I think, the 30s was also pretty egregious. As was wherever Phillip K. Dick was placed.


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 11:51 AM
horizontal rule
21

Possibly relevant to the Auden sub-thread.


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 11:54 AM
horizontal rule
22

18: Who were the top 4 in 1930?


Posted by: peep | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 11:58 AM
horizontal rule
23

WHERE ARE JAMES GOULD COZZENS AND WARWICK DEEPING


Posted by: OPINIONATED GRANDSON | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 12:17 PM
horizontal rule
24

I will be the grump/scold/whatever marvelling at how many of them happened to write in English

I sometimes marvel in the opposite direction at the Nobel Prize in Literature. The committee members can't read the majority of the nominated authors in their original languages, which I guess leads to handing out the award largely on the basis of "what the author has to say".


Posted by: Criminally Bulgur | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 12:19 PM
horizontal rule
25

They can't even get their own story straight. They say that Saul Bellow is the greatest Jewish novelist of the 20th century. But Stanley Elkin, Gertrude Stein, and Franz Kafka (there are probably more) are all rated higher.


Posted by: peep | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 12:20 PM
horizontal rule
26

25: Maybe they're making some fine distinction between novelist who is Jewish and Jewish Novelist.


Posted by: AcademicLurker | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 12:22 PM
horizontal rule
27

I didn't even realize that this was supposed to be a ranking, rather than just a numbered list.


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 12:25 PM
horizontal rule
28

26: That explanation was considered and rejected.


Posted by: peep | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 12:25 PM
horizontal rule
29

Maybe Stein was disqualified on account of collaboration.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 12:30 PM
horizontal rule
30

I too thought 2. (Sorry, Uncle Marvin.)


Posted by: k-sky | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 12:56 PM
horizontal rule
31

2, 30: Maybe they consider Bellow a Canadian Jew.


Posted by: peep | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 1:00 PM
horizontal rule
32

No Japanese. I would certainly put Watanabe on there, maybe Mishima, know nothing of Oe.

The two who have apparently dropped off are Mann and Gide. That's interesting. Not a big fan of Gide in general, but Counterfeiters is a modernist monster of a novel, as important and qualified as anything. And Gide was important for belle lettres, very important earliest anti-colonialism.

And Thomas Mann? Jeez.

Both were gay, Gide militantly, Mann hyper-closeted.

Maybe both are too cold and intellectual, too moralistic in a grand narrative sense for the age of My Struggle.


Posted by: bob mcmanus | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 1:01 PM
horizontal rule
33

To make Auden maybe gay and Willa Cather totes a lesbian seems a bit odd given the references they left behind. Not that I disagree that either was, mind you.


Posted by: Thorn | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 1:03 PM
horizontal rule
34

19 I don't see that as particularly egregious, or at least no more so than putting anyone else in the number one spot which is itself egregious. However, lists are fun. You can argue over them, congratulate or chastise yourself over how many you've read, mock the whole exercise, feel guilty over paying attention to it. Like I said, fun.


Posted by: teraz kurwa my | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 1:09 PM
horizontal rule
35

As an undergraduate, I lived in Cather Hall. It was attached to Pound Hall, was named for her friend Louise Pound. Cather was all men and Pound all women.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 1:10 PM
horizontal rule
36

35 to nothing in particular.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 1:11 PM
horizontal rule
37

Mari Sandoz, of Old Jules fame, also has a dorm named after her.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 1:14 PM
horizontal rule
38

35: The fact that Cather Hall was all men seems to me to be pretty convincing evidence that she could not have been a lesbian.


Posted by: peep | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 1:19 PM
horizontal rule
39

35: I spent my Junior and Senior years living in a dorm named Rand Hall, but I'm pretty sure it wasn't named for Ayn Rand. Who, by the way, would certainly have shown up as number one on that list if the ranking had been determined by online voting, because libertarians.


Posted by: AcademicLurker | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 1:21 PM
horizontal rule
40

35: We get it, Moby: you are ALL MAN.


Posted by: Flippanter | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 1:21 PM
horizontal rule
41

39: No, she couldn't have beat out Tolkein. Rowling and Mitchell might also beat her.


Posted by: peep | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 1:27 PM
horizontal rule
42

I lived on Blake Avenue for a few years, but I'm pretty sure it wasn't named after William.


Posted by: peep | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 1:31 PM
horizontal rule
43

It's an interesting list -- more interesting than most.

Though -- Heinlein? Seriously? I mean, I like him too. But is he a great writer?

Also: 16 women out of a 100 writers. It beats the 7% rule, but not by much.


Posted by: delagar | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 2:43 PM
horizontal rule
44

I skimmed for my name, then clicked away. No time for haters.


Posted by: JRoth | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 2:56 PM
horizontal rule
45

Per the OP, we are sort of off. We're at swim lessons, and then we're leaving directly from here. So we're all packed and out of the house.


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 3:06 PM
horizontal rule
46

44 The only thing of yours I've read is Radetzky March, anything else you'd recommend?


Posted by: teraz kurwa my | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 3:08 PM
horizontal rule
47

Not sure if this goes in the Road Trip thread, the update thread, or the musical thread, but I've now listened to Annie for the first time in 30 years, and I guess it held up? We made it to our first destination.


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 7:52 PM
horizontal rule
48

Get some rest. The sun will come up tomorrow.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 7:55 PM
horizontal rule
49

Bet your bottom dollar.


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 8:02 PM
horizontal rule
50

Just pull down you visor and grin and say...


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 8:23 PM
horizontal rule
51

"Why is there a dollar in my bottom?"


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 8:26 PM
horizontal rule
52

It's one of the new coins. President Aft.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 8:36 PM
horizontal rule
53

There's a reason it's called a coin slot.


Posted by: teofilo | Link to this comment | 07-23-14 8:54 PM
horizontal rule
54

"Why is there a dollar in my bottom?"

Because you've turned into a dragon. http://www.unfogged.com/archives/comments_11606.html#1357006


Posted by: ajay | Link to this comment | 07-24-14 1:44 AM
horizontal rule
55

Initial read: Cather Hell.


Posted by: CharleyCarp | Link to this comment | 07-24-14 6:25 AM
horizontal rule
56

||

I am temporarily in charge of my section while the boss is away. In that role, I am supervising cases that are most easily referred to as "the stripper case" and "the hooker case". Representing state agencies isn't usually this film noir.

|>


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 07-24-14 8:27 AM
horizontal rule
57

I once wrote a "Motion in Limine (No. --) to Exclude Evidence and Argument Related to Strip Club Visit." I was proud of that title.


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 07-24-14 8:32 AM
horizontal rule
58

We've got a motion to strike scandalous material in the pleadings going, including an averment that the prostitute was fondling some other guy, not the affiant, and he just poured them a drink, as you do when you find a prostitute (which, he didn't even know she was a prostitute) and some guy in your office.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 07-24-14 8:38 AM
horizontal rule
59

Would it be possible to exclude the evidence but keep the argument or is that just one of those lawyer phrases like "cease and desist"?


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 07-24-14 8:38 AM
horizontal rule
60

Or "averment".


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 07-24-14 8:40 AM
horizontal rule
61

Also, I don't usually talk about specific work, but I recently had to look at an issue that tangentially involved the 1978 film "The C/at From Outer Space." Did you know that it featured BOTH of the Colonels from MASH and also S/Andy Duncan?


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 07-24-14 8:47 AM
horizontal rule
62

There was an episode of MASH that featured both colonels from MASH. Harry Morgan appeared as a general before Stevenson quit.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 07-24-14 8:50 AM
horizontal rule
63

I think I had a novelization of that movie as a child. Why, I have no idea. The c/at in question was an orange tabby, IIRC?


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 07-24-14 8:51 AM
horizontal rule
64

Harry Morgan appeared as an insane, racist general, to be precise.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 07-24-14 8:52 AM
horizontal rule
65

Yes!


Posted by: RH | Link to this comment | 07-24-14 8:52 AM
horizontal rule
66

And the not-racist protagonists called the only black person "Spearchucker." Because the 70s were fucked up.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 07-24-14 8:54 AM
horizontal rule
67

Yes to orange tabby, can neither confirm not deny racist Harry Morgan character.


Posted by: RH | Link to this comment | 07-24-14 8:55 AM
horizontal rule
68

66: That was actually the character's nickname in the original 1950s novel -- I believe he was a track and field scholarship athlete in college, with a javelin specialty. Racist still, but artisanally preserved racism from prior decades.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 07-24-14 9:01 AM
horizontal rule
69

It's like the debate over the dialog in Huck Finn, but not really.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 07-24-14 9:03 AM
horizontal rule
70

"Why is there a dollar in my bottom?"

Keep digging and you'll find the other four.


Posted by: MAE | Link to this comment | 07-24-14 9:06 AM
horizontal rule
71

61. Unavailable on Amazon prime, unavailable on netflix streaming. Looks appealing though.


Posted by: lw | Link to this comment | 07-24-14 9:19 AM
horizontal rule
72

||

I'm starting to sense a pattern of high-level people apparently coping with all their external constraints by hyping blue-sky reform ideas that sound good in the abstract, but when thought out in any detail become obviously infeasible. They then ignore both the conceptual problems and any higher-level rebuffs. (Not my employers, thankfully.) Rather like Republican health reform proposals in some ways. Wonder if there's an idiom for this.

|>


Posted by: Minivet | Link to this comment | 07-24-14 9:34 AM
horizontal rule
73

"Mangement"


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 07-24-14 9:36 AM
horizontal rule
74

I really liked the C/at From Outer Space. When I was in afterschool care they would show us shitty live action disney movies on 16mm. Condorman was my favorite, as you might imagine, but Unidentified Flying Oddball and The Computer Wore Tennis Shoes also made strong impressions.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 07-24-14 9:40 AM
horizontal rule
75

I don't remember those. Escape from Witch Mountain is my main memory of a shitty live-action Disney movie. I think there was a flying RV.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 07-24-14 9:42 AM
horizontal rule
76

"Mangement"

Great, now I have to wonder if the misspelling was deliberate or not. Since I doubt I'll get a completely straight answer from Moby.


Posted by: Minivet | Link to this comment | 07-24-14 9:45 AM
horizontal rule
77

There was one that was sort of Treasure of Sierra Madre-ish which featured a guy getting turned to gold and I can't for the life of me remember what it was called.

We also watched all seventy five hundred Herbie movies, and amazingly they were totally high quality.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 07-24-14 9:47 AM
horizontal rule
78

+a


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 07-24-14 9:49 AM
horizontal rule
79

my main memory of a shitty live-action Disney movie

Black Hole
Something Wicked This Way Comes


Posted by: Criminally Bulgur | Link to this comment | 07-24-14 9:53 AM
horizontal rule
80

Yeah, Moby, sure.


Posted by: Minivet | Link to this comment | 07-24-14 9:56 AM
horizontal rule
81

79: The Black Hole could have been a pretty good movie had it been made by anybody other than Disney. A script rewrite or two, get Ridley Scott to direct, and go for the "R" instead of the "PG" rating, and now we're talking. Instead, you get this jarring mish-mash of a really bleak premise that they attempted to counterbalance with goofy shit like a robot voiced by Slim Pickens ("You know, for kids!"), plus special effects that range from breathtaking to laughably amateurish. Ugh.


Posted by: MAE | Link to this comment | 07-24-14 10:08 AM
horizontal rule
82

66

The Oliver Wendell "Spearchucker" Jones character comes from the two original MASH books (before they got made into a movie or TV show and before the book franchise).


Posted by: | Link to this comment | 07-24-14 10:21 AM
horizontal rule
83

No Japanese. I would certainly put Watanabe on there, maybe Mishima, know nothing of Oe.

Fuck those guys. Murasaki Shikibu and Sei Shonagon.


Posted by: mcmc | Link to this comment | 07-25-14 8:37 AM
horizontal rule