Re: Liquid Television

1

What is there to get? It's not like there was a uniform aesthetic. It was a way for MTV to package up animated shorts and etc. that had made the rounds at animation festivals. I mean, I loved it, but I also loved animation festivals.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 6:41 AM
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Now I don't get you.


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 6:44 AM
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I get that.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 6:45 AM
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Probably not one person in a hundred who watched Liquid Television on MTV knew there was such a thing as an "animation festival".

It was one of those weird windows into underground culture that were very hard to find in the heyday of MTV.


Posted by: Cryptic ned | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 6:46 AM
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Huh. I mean, I guess I can understand that that's true but... huh. Y'all missed out on some epic Bill Plimpton shorts, that's for sure.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 7:17 AM
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Would you believe I listened to mainstream pop and R&B in the 90s?


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 7:19 AM
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It is also possbile that you (heebie and ned) are too young for the heyday of animation festivals; the regular (non-Sick & Twisted) Spike & Mike's was really on its way out by the early '90s (history!). On the other hand, a lot of the classic Liquid Television shorts (like Frog Baseball) first got shown in Sick & Twisted, so.

Next you're going to say most people didn't have VHS collections of early computer animation demos rescored to synth-rock by Jan Hammer.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 7:28 AM
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It's really a miracle I ever had a girlfriend.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 7:28 AM
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I loved the original Aeon Flux shorts from Liquid TV. But I never watched them on MTV Liquid TV, I watched them on regular TV and DVD years afterwards.

TV series was ok and movie is some sort of morality tale of what a concept looks like after intense electroshock therapy.


Posted by: conflated | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 7:30 AM
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I thought I was more Tweety-aged than Ned-aged.


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 7:36 AM
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Next you're going to say most people didn't have VHS collections of early computer animation demos rescored to synth-rock by Jan Hammer.

My dad has one of those, but the soundtrack is obscure grunge bands like Paw and Hammerbox.

Where can I find more? I love early computer animation.


Posted by: Cryptic ned | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 7:36 AM
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6: Isn't that still what you listen to?


Posted by: peep | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 7:36 AM
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Aeon Flux was the only part of Liquid TV that I watched. It was great. I heard the live action movie was a real let down, though.

Was the animated TV series distinct from the shorts that ran as a part of Liquid TV? In my mind they've blurred together.


Posted by: rob helpy-chalk | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 7:38 AM
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Some classics I caught at an animation festival back in the late 80s:

The Hockey Sweater

Vincent


It's kind of impressive how Tim Burton's aesthetic hasn't changes at all in 32 years.


Posted by: AcademicLurker | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 7:41 AM
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||

Is anyone else flummoxed as I am by the GOP candidates coming out in favor of over the counter access to oral contraceptives? Reproductive rights supporters seem to be caught on the back foot by this, sensing a ruse to undermine support for insurance coverage of contraception. To me, the obvious rejoinder is: why choose? Let's have oral contraception without a prescription *and* insurance coverage. I don't get why the Dems are so reluctant to take yes for an answer here. Or rather, I do get why (they don't want to muddle their message of "GOP war on women"), but I think it's misguided. By calling the Republicans' bluff, our side can get a chance for policy victory while inciting discord between the GOP candidates and their base (who will only be content to bite their tongue on this if they think it stands no chance of being enacted). Dems should be all over this, remembering to twist the knife by mentioning Plan B in the same context at every opportunity.

Also, did Tillis take a page out of Romney's debate playbook, or what?

|>


Posted by: knecht ruprecht | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 7:52 AM
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Relatedly, Halbig will be heard en banc.


Posted by: Ginger Yellow | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 8:11 AM
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Aeon Flux was the only part of Liquid TV that I watched.

I love Richard Sala's work, although Invisible Hands isn't as good as his comics.


Posted by: snarkout | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 8:29 AM
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Next you're going to say most people didn't have VHS collections of early computer animation demos rescored to synth-rock by Jan Hammer.

After all these years, "Adam Powers, the Juggler" is still totally badass.


Posted by: MAE | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 8:44 AM
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13: The shorts were five minutes or so and there were only six, the TV series were twenty minute episodes and there was a season, with similar animation.

The movie had lovingly crafted art design and effects, and the writing was awful on every level.


Posted by: conflated | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 8:55 AM
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16: After the full D.C. Circuit decides against the appellants, I'm looking forward to the spectacle of Halbig cheerleaders, who just spent the last month arguing that the case is far too insignificant to rehear en banc, turning 180 degrees to argue that the case is far too important for the Supreme Court not to hear their appeal despite the unanimous agreement of the lower courts.


Posted by: knecht ruprecht | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 9:05 AM
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15: I'm deeply suspicious of this gambit. I wonder, if oral contraceptives were made available over-the-counter, would that give drug stores the option not to carry them at all? I mean, drug stores don't have an obligation to stock every over the counter medication that is on the market. Could they just say, "Oh, we don't sell that. Better luck elsewhere."?


Posted by: MAE | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 9:15 AM
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Peep gets me.


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 9:21 AM
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15: In general, it's probably much cheaper for women to get prescription BC than OTC. They're saving insurers money at the cost of women having to pay more. I'm guessing, but I think BC with insurance is ballpark $10/3 months. That's maybe the cost of aspirin.

But yeah, I think having OTC birth control would be generally a good thing, and it would be great if there were a way for it to be cheap. It's certainly safe enough for OTC.


Posted by: ydnew | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 9:28 AM
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I loved Liquid TV and especially Aeon Flux. I caught some animation festival stuff back in the day, mostly at midnite movie theaters but not a lot. Liquid TV was a nice treat. And fwiw, Liquid TV --> Adult Swim.


Posted by: Barry Freed | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 9:46 AM
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would that give drug stores the option not to carry them at all? I mean, drug stores don't have an obligation to stock every over the counter medication that is on the market. Could they just say, "Oh, we don't sell that. Better luck elsewhere."?

A far bigger risk is individual pharmacists refusing to dispense prescription birth control, especially in jurisdictions where conscience laws specifically protect this. The vast majority of Americans live within a few miles of a retail location of one of the big three pharmacy chains, and those companies are not at serious risk of deciding not to stock contraceptives. Also, OTC drugs can generally be sold in non-pharmacy retail outlets, like convenience stores and grocery stores, though I suppose lawmakers might be reluctant to go that far in the case of BCP.


Posted by: knecht ruprecht | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 9:50 AM
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In general, it's probably much cheaper for women to get prescription BC than OTC

Just because a drug is available OTC doesn't mean you can't get a doctor's prescription for it. This is really a no lose proposition for reproductive choice. BC would become much more widely available and cheaper at the point of sale, because of the well-documented tendency for drug prices to go down when they are approved for OTC sale, and it would not affect the right of women with health insurance to get their free annual well woman visit (i.e. their BCP scrip) and their zero co-pay BCP refills.


Posted by: knecht ruprecht | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 10:00 AM
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Granted, Tillis and company are saying they want to trade one for the other, and that's not a trade I would take. But if a bunch of GOP office-holders go on the record supporting OTC status for birth control pills, that can only make it easier for President Hillary Clinton's FDA nominee to make it reality.


Posted by: knecht ruprecht | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 10:02 AM
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11: It actually seems like they might all be up on archive.org


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 10:09 AM
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I didn't even have cable.

BC, 25: are you thinking that rather than true OTC, BC would end up behind the counter, like Sudafed? Wouldn't that have the same chance for trouble with pharmacists that prescriptions do? Or is there another category that would keep them out if general retail channels?


Posted by: Nathan Williams | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 10:12 AM
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26: Huh, I didn't realize that was possible. Neat.


Posted by: ydnew | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 10:22 AM
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Just because a drug is available OTC doesn't mean you can't get a doctor's prescription for it.

Don't lots of prescription plans exclude (with a few specific exceptions, perhaps) drugs available OTC, whether they're prescribed or not?


Posted by: redfoxtailshrub | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 10:23 AM
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Granted, Tillis and company are saying they want to trade one for the other, and that's not a trade I would take. But if a bunch of GOP office-holders go on the record supporting OTC status for birth control pills, that can only make it easier for President Hillary Clinton's FDA nominee to make it reality.

That sounds nice, though!


Posted by: redfoxtailshrub | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 10:24 AM
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31: I just looked at BCBS, and they'll do it for two types of OTC, allergy and proton pump inhibitors. If prescribed, the insured gets them for the lowest copay. I bet BCP is one they'd love to do this for.


Posted by: ydnew | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 10:26 AM
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they'll do it for two types of OTC, allergy and proton pump inhibitors. If prescribed, the insured gets them for the lowest copay.

Funny you should mention those, because I wrote and then deleted as superfluous a sentence citing Loratadine and Omeprazole as examples of commonly prescribed drugs that got a lot cheaper when they went OTC. Drug formulary decisions are a complex business, but in general the insurer would prefer to pay for a cheap therapy, even one that's available OTC, if the alternative is for the patient to get a more expensive option that is available only by prescription.


Posted by: knecht ruprecht | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 10:32 AM
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Or is there another category that would keep them out if general retail channels?

I was thinking of something similar to Plan B One Step (emergency contraception), which can only be sold in stores that have an onsite pharmacy, but can be sold outside of pharmacy hours. That said, the "onsite pharmacy" condition encompasses a lot of non-drugstore retail settings, including WalMart, Target, and many grocery store chains.


Posted by: knecht ruprecht | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 10:43 AM
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Don't lots of prescription plans exclude (with a few specific exceptions, perhaps) drugs available OTC, whether they're prescribed or not?

I think in general they're allowed to do that but the ACA requirements on covering preventive services override that practice.


Posted by: Minivet | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 11:06 AM
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36: That's right. Presumably that would also apply even to aspirin and some nutritional supplements (e.g. vitamin D and folic acid) for certain at-risk populations.

The Essential Health Benefits standards could also have the effect of mandating formulary coverage of certain OTC drugs in certain circumstances, though the mechanism is an indirect one.


Posted by: kermit roosevelt, jr. | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 11:20 AM
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Kermit, you are super helpful, but I must say, I've got a mental picture of you in a godforsaken basement government office with cracking plaster doing literally nothing but correcting internet misconceptions. "Obamacare Interwebs Communications Director" or something. With a red Swingline stapler.


Posted by: ydnew | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 12:30 PM
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38: Like this? In real life, I'm way less socially valuable than your mental picture would suggest. OTOH, I have a pretty sweet view from my comfortable office.


Posted by: kermit roosevelt, jr. | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 12:50 PM
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you know who else is good on health insurance stuff? Richard Mayhew at balloon-juice


Posted by: Annelid Gustator | Link to this comment | 09- 4-14 12:55 PM
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