Re: Guest Post - Gospel of Mark

1

John was wearing a camel hair sport coat with leather elbow patches.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 6:46 AM
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Also, yes, Mark is very deliberately making John the new Elijah.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 6:47 AM
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3

Anyway, it's an interesting blog. Very Lent-appropriate.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 7:00 AM
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2: That was my understanding.

3: Agreed! Thanks, NickS!


Posted by: peep | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 7:11 AM
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5

"Holy Ghost" and "Holy Spirit" drag in some very sophisticated Christian ideas about the Holy Trinity and Pentecost, which aren't really present in the text, however much we might want them to be.
Is this correct? AIUI Mark is actually written ~300AD so at least some of that theology would have been around and known to the audience.


Posted by: Mossy Character | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 7:32 AM
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Apparently I was thinking of Matthew, which ~100AD. Never mind.


Posted by: Mossy Character | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 7:40 AM
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5: No, Mark is dated to before the end of the 1st century, probably soon after the destruction of the temple in 70 CE. Even John's gospel, the latest to be written, was probably no later than the early years of the 2nd century.


Posted by: Ume | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 7:42 AM
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Luke's version of the same event mentions that the Spirit takes the form of a dove. Maybe he knew more Greek and was trying to be clear that he wasn't talking about wind?


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 7:43 AM
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There are lots of "blogging the bible" blogs out there, often from the "I know about the most famous parts, but much more" perspective. David Plotz did a pretty good one in Slate about ten years ago, which seems to be still available and was also published as a book.

He started with Genesys. Unsurprisingly, his early posts were "God! What an asshole!", followed by "Noah, what a perv/asshole!", "Abraham! what a pimp/asshole!". Later on, "God! Still an asshole!", "David! What an asshole!", "Solomon! What an asshole!", "What happened to God? Oh, he's back. Still an asshole!" . . .


Posted by: unimaginative | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 7:44 AM
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The text pleasantly reminded me of Larry Gonick's introduction to the Gospels, showing John in a hairshirt standing in the water, unhurriedly holding someone's head under, and chatting to the reader, "This really works, y'know! Specially if you hold'em down long enough."


Posted by: Minivet | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 7:45 AM
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11

Spoiler: Jesus dies at the end


Posted by: Spike | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 7:57 AM
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12

OR DOES HE?!


Posted by: Mossy Character | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 7:59 AM
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13

Yeah, they set it up so he could come back for the sequel, but its been two thousand years.... I don't think they are really making a sequel.


Posted by: Spike | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 8:14 AM
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14

ARE YOU SURE?


Posted by: OPINIONATED MORMON | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 8:24 AM
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15

Mormons are to Christianity what Old George Lucas is to Young George Lucas.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 8:27 AM
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16

Is that why analogies are banned?


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 8:43 AM
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17

I shall have to keep reading this now, to see how Rilstone deals with the ending problem.


Posted by: chris y | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 8:46 AM
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He started with Genesys. Unsurprisingly, his early posts were "God! What an asshole!

Evelyn Waugh was in German-occupied Yugoslavia along with, among others, Randolph Churchill. "In the hope of keeping him quiet," Waugh wrote to Nancy Mitford, "Freddie and I bet him £20 that he cannot read the whole Bible in a fortnight. Unhappily it has not had the result we hoped. He has never read any of it before and is hideously excited; keeps reading quotations aloud... or merely slapping his side & chortling 'God, isn't God a shit!'."


Posted by: ajay | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 8:53 AM
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One of the books I most want to read is Jack Miles, "Christ: A Crisis in the Life of God". It sounds fascinating.

I've been reading about Bible stories more recently. When put in context they become so much more interesting. Unfortunately learning them as a child, even at iberal churches where they don't believe the stories are true, you don't get any sort of context.


Posted by: Cryptic ned | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 9:01 AM
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13. He was crucified, dead, and buried (as they say in the Apostles' Creed) and came back once to prove it could be done. Then he went away and promised to come back again. So he came back from death once already. The Apocalypse/End Times/whatevah is him coming back to kick ass and take names. Definitely a "sequel" but not a return from death: been there, done that already. The sequel is more one of those Marvel Comics Universe things but without Thanos.


Posted by: DaveLMA | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 9:34 AM
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21

Actually, maybe Thanos is the anti-Christ.


Posted by: DaveLMA | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 9:36 AM
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22

I think you could make a good case for Trump. I'm not joking.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 9:39 AM
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23

Why the fuck am I writing tildes? c.c.


Posted by: Mossy Character | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 9:51 AM
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24

There are better grounds for concluding it's the Pope (any pope). The point of Antichrist is that he is not only opposed to Christ but opposite to him - he's Christ's Mirror Universe evil opposite setting himself up as Christ's successor. So, Christ lived in Judaea and was oppressed by Rome; the Antichrists live in Rome. Christ lived in poverty; the Antichrists live in luxury. Christ refused temporal power when he was tempted with it by Satan; the Antichrist claims not only temporal power, but authority over all the kingdoms of the earth. Christ died in ignominy and was buried as a pauper; the Antichrists should be famous and buried in splendor. Christ advocated giving away all your possessions; the Antichrists are hugely wealthy and run a bank.


Posted by: | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 9:55 AM
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25

Beware!


Posted by: Minivet | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 9:57 AM
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26

24: I think they still teach that in the schools in England.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 10:03 AM
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27

But I should probably apologize for comparing Mormonism to The Phantom Menace. Nobody deserves that.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 10:06 AM
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28

26: pretty sure they do in the schools in Northern Ireland. Some of them anyway. Ian Paisley was very clear on the subject.


Posted by: ajay | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 10:12 AM
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29

Star Wars: early Christian church
The Empire Strikes Back: council of Nicaea (fantastic, still a favourite)
Return of the Jedi: conversion of Constantine (huge success but some feel undermined the original concept)
Phantom Menace: the Great Schism
Attack of the Clones: the First Crusade
Revenge of the Sith: the Fourth Crusade and the Sack of Constantinople
The Force Awakens: the foundation of the Benedictine order
Rogue One: St Francis and the various reforming movements derived from the Franciscans
The Last Jedi: Martin Luther and the Reformation (successful but divisive to many devoted fans who thought it was a bit social justice-y)
Solo: A Star Wars Story: The Thirty Years War


Posted by: | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 10:17 AM
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30

29 me obviously.


Posted by: ajay | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 10:18 AM
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31

Not forgetting, of course, the other major franchise.

Star Trek (original series) : the Sunni
Star Trek: The Motion Picture - Rashidun Caliphate - flawed, but got the franchise under way
Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan - the Umayyads - chewed the scenery but got shit done
Star Trek III: The Search for Spock - the Fatimids - a well-intentioned but catastrophic followup
Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home - the Ottoman Empire - a real departure but one of the best
Star Trek V: The Final Frontier - the Seljuks
Star Trek VI: The Undiscovered Country - the Abbasids

Star Trek: The Next Generation: the Shia
Star Trek: Generations: the Caliph Ali

Star Trek (2009): ISIS (hideously ill judged reboot)


Posted by: ajay | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 10:24 AM
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32

24: I'm reminded of the episode of Seinfeld where Jerry tries to explain Bizarro Superman to Elaine.


Posted by: dalriata | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 10:27 AM
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33

29 seems about right.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 10:34 AM
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34

What about Discovery?


Posted by: Minivet | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 10:37 AM
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35

There are lots of "blogging the bible" blogs out there . . .

The Last Jedi: Martin Luther and the Reformation (successful but divisive to many devoted fans who thought it was a bit social justice-y). . .

To give another sense of Andrew Rilstone's writing style (and interests), here is an excerpt from what turned into a lengthy series of posts thinking about The Last Jedi and how it fit into the mythology and fan culture around Star Wars

If you are not very careful "that was not at all what I expected" can turn into "that was bad". I honestly can't remember whether my first (and therefore truest) reaction to the Empire Strikes Back was that the surprise ending was gobsmackingly cool or that it was a bit of a cheat because it totally changed everything about Star Wars.

This is a big problem with blockbuster culture. You live for three years on speculation and hints and leaks about what is going to be in a movie, and then spend two hours thinking "oh...so that rumor was true and that rumor was false and why wasn't that bit in the trailer?" rather than actually watching the film. I can very clearly remember my first (and therefore truest) reaction to Rogue One. It was "How the hell did they keep that ending a secret?" We can only experience a film once we have already seen it. Where that leaves the question of spoilers I really couldn't say.

So my first (and truest) reaction to the Last Jedi was disappointment. "After 30 years, is this really all the Luke Skywalker we are going to get?" . . .

I expected Old Luke to be kind of a strange old hermit; or maybe even a wise Councillor to Leia or Mon Motha. (Obi Wan always seemed more Merlin than Lancelot.) Maybe he could have been one of those old alien duffers who sit in the Jedi Temple being serene and insufferable. But in retrospect, he was always going to become Yoda; hiding away on an uninhabited planet, cooking soup, milking cows, refusing to train obviously talented students who come looking for him, not taking the film quite seriously. It's easy to forget how comedic Yoda was when he first appeared. That was everyone's second reaction as the lights came up at the end of Empire Strikes Back. "Alec Guiness's mentor was a muppet? Are you kidding me?" Luke's rejection of Rey's precious lightsaber is an important plot-point. Luke chucking the thing over his shoulder as if it was a piece of junk is not a misstep (as I first thought) but a perfectly judged piece of characterization. It's just the kind of thing which Yoda would have done.

Posted by: NickS | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 10:49 AM
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In the interests of a balanced diet i gave the kid for his recent birthday spufford's unapologetic and e o wright's real utopias, seemed a good meal for a budding public servant. He's v much enjoyed both. On a lighter note, highly recommend the noah's ark & wood beetle chapters of barnes' hist of world in 10.5 chapters. Will check out the linked blog!


Posted by: dairy queen | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 10:59 AM
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e o wright's real utopias

That is lovely to hear. Thank you.


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 11:07 AM
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38

he loves it, heebie. most warmest of spring wishes to you from all of us here in sf!!!


Posted by: dairy queen | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 11:09 AM
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39

18 Churchill must have been a better parent than I thought if Randolph managed to reach adulthood without reading the Bible or apparently even knowing Bible stories.


Posted by: No Longer Middle Aged Man | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 11:37 AM
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40

I see that Brad DeLong just posted the link. I assume this means that he followed the link in the OP.


Posted by: NickS | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 11:59 AM
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39: "I cannot be called a pillar of the church. I am more in the nature of a buttress, for I support it from the outside."


Posted by: Flippanter | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 12:44 PM
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Romans and Greeks did it,
Even hairy prophet freaks did it,
Let's do it,
Let's bathe en masse!"


Posted by: Natilo Paennim | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 4:48 PM
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43

ok google was jesus ever nude


Posted by: Minivet | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 5:26 PM
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44

Thanks for the shout out. I am glad you found the piece at least somewhat interesting. I didn't know how this was going to go down after two and a half years writing about Spider-Man!


Posted by: Andrew Rilstone | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 6:23 PM
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45

Can you reuse any copy from what you wrote about Infinity War?


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 6:31 PM
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I am glad you found the piece at least somewhat interesting.

I very much enjoyed your writing about Spider-Man and Star Wars (and bought your Star Wars book), and wasn't sure what to expect from you tackling the Gospel according to Mark, but the first entry has me very interested in reading more and (as I said), appreciative of how well it fits your style.

[FWIW, I found my way to your blog a while ago from Mike Taylor's blog.]


Posted by: NickS | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 6:49 PM
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29 and 31 are quite good.


Posted by: Just Plain Jane | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 7:05 PM
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48

After the modrin meme:

Lawful Good: The Motion Picture
Neutral Good: First Contact
Chaotic Good: The Voyage Home
Lawful Neutral: Search for Spock
True Neutral: Beyond
Chaotic Neutral: Generations
Lawful Evil: Into Darkness
Neutral Evil: Star Trek (2009)
Chaotic Evil: The Final Frontier


Posted by: Minivet | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 7:35 PM
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44: welcome!


Posted by: heebie | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 8:30 PM
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48: Slightly on topic...


Posted by: foolishmortal | Link to this comment | 03-21-19 9:34 PM
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51

I feel the logical next step is to equate the history of Judaism with the James Bond franchise but I don't know enough about Jewish history to make it work. Clearly Goldfinger has to be the construction of the Temple of Solomon.


Posted by: ajay | Link to this comment | 03-22-19 2:52 AM
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52

I would be afraid to assign any parts of the Bible to Roger Moore.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 03-22-19 4:51 AM
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53

I can see him doing Jonah.


Posted by: Mossy Character | Link to this comment | 03-22-19 4:53 AM
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52: AQ case could be made that it was a mistake to assign to Roger Moore any part of the Bond franchise.


Posted by: politicalfootball | Link to this comment | 03-22-19 6:31 AM
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55

-Q


Posted by: politicalfootball | Link to this comment | 03-22-19 6:31 AM
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Mark is a really strange book, and it's easy to not realize this if you're used to conflating all the gospel stories into one. Ever since Matthew wrote his "improved version" of Mark it's been way way more popular and more read, and that's true to this day. But Mark's weirdness makes it a lot more interesting.


Posted by: Unfoggetarian: “Pause endlessly, then go in” (9) | Link to this comment | 03-22-19 6:43 AM
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57

||

Go see Us.

|>


Posted by: Barry Freed | Link to this comment | 03-22-19 8:45 AM
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56. Ain't that the truth? Frex, without Matthew, nobody would ever have questioned that Mark's congregation was Adoptionist.


Posted by: chris y | Link to this comment | 03-22-19 10:08 AM
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51: I think Oddjob would make a good Sampson.


Posted by: foolishmortal | Link to this comment | 03-22-19 10:10 AM
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I was thinking that Sampson isn't usually considered a villain, but he is a little bit genocidal.


Posted by: Moby Hick | Link to this comment | 03-22-19 10:20 AM
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||

documents the selling by traffickers of women and girls from Kachin and northern Shan States into sexual slavery in China. Trafficking survivors said that trusted people, including family members, promised them jobs in China, but instead sold them for the equivalent of US$3,000 to $13,000 to Chinese families. In China, they were typically locked in a room and raped so they would become pregnant.
[...]
sell them to Chinese families struggling to find brides for their sons due to the gender imbalance in China related to the country's earlier "one child policy."
|>


Posted by: Mossy Character | Link to this comment | 03-22-19 10:44 AM
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57: Doing so today with Rory (yay spring break!). I do not do well with scary movies, so I am already preemptively terrified.


Posted by: Di Kotimy | Link to this comment | 03-26-19 5:06 AM
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