This story is changing faster than Hastert's. Last I read, Rice does remember and took forceful action after the Tenet presentation, including sending it on to John Ashcroft, who promptly slashed anti-terrorism funding in the FBI budget. But wouldn't fly commercial in that August. I will go look for a link.
Ashcroft said Tenet never spoke to him, according to the linked article.
Moment of Truth ...Mahablog, with multiple updates. Won't let me cut & paste, so scroll down
All it does is makes them all look shifty and dishonest.
They are shifty and dishonest.
But couldn't they be craftier about it? I expect cunning plans. This, like all the lying about who knew what about Foley, just looks like floundering.
What drives us crazy is that they are floundering, and yet will still be ridiculously difficult to beat at the polls. We've got a chance, but it should be a walk.
5:They have Other Things on their minds right now. (Cue Jaws theme)
Billmon came up with an inspired title for his post about it.
Only a filthy lefty would trust a dishonest rag like the NYT (Jason Blair anyone???) and other liberal media over honest officials in the Bush administration. Bush wants to save America, the liberals want to destroy it - what about this is so hard for you to understand???
It's not that hard for newspapers /media to fabricate records, in their attempt to bring down any politician that fails to promote their leftist agenda. Remember Rathergate???
If there were anything here to be concerned about, Bill O'Reilly would tell me in the No Spin Zone. After all O'Reilly has proven he is not afraid to call Bush out when he does something wrong -- like how he's way too soft on illegal immigrants!
Also, if there is any truth to this story, Clinton is the one who didn't do enough to stop bin Laden! He was too busy getting blowjobs!!! Good thing Bush is serious about cleaning up the mess Clinton left behind!!!
"I don't know what Ben Veniste's story is, but now would be a good time for him to tell it."
Ben Veniste says:"Ask Jelikow why it wasn't in the report"
I don't know where I read things anymore.
All my love, Brock, but whenever I try to read 9 my vision clouds and I see before me only the abyss and a scant inch of precipice.
Ok, I'm glad this is coming out before the election, but couldn't it have come out before the last election? Or before we codified oubliettes into our legal system?
Brock, I think you need a few more exclamation points.
But couldn't they be craftier about it? I expect cunning plans.
For once, I'm inclined to believe Rice. Tenet never mentioned any brush-off or domestic-attack potential to the 9/11 Comm'n when they questioned him. Tho he *was* still in his position at that time (left 7/04, report pub. 8/04). McClatchy News has Clarke at the meeting, & he's silent about it in his memoir.
Tenet has a lot to answer for, and anything he says has to be taken with some salt.
Establishement Democrats can be as weaselly as Republicans. IIRC, Jelikow has been on Rice's team for some time. Presumably he got Benveniste to sign on to some compromise deal protecting Rice, in return for some favor to Benveniste. Or perhaps he just bullied everyone else into complying.
Benveniste is letting us think somehting like that, but hew won't stick his neck out or blow anyone's cover. He's loyal to his peer group.
Even with what you have in the official 9/11 report, Bush looks very bad. I actually read about half of it. But no traction.
I also had a lot of stuff published on my site in 2004, but it didin't go anywhere because I am a conspiracy theorist. Bush has always been vulnerable on this issue, if anyone bothered to look.
A commenter at MY's said he thought Bushco allowed the attack to happen, for their purposes, but they expected something on the level of the Cole. I would never endorse such wild speculation.
In a counter-factual, it is hard to imagine how they might have been able to invade Iraq without a terrorist incident or other cause.
Bush said the Republicans are going to keep Congress. I think he knows, or at least knows the situation on the ground will change drastically by election day. The White House doesn't care about Woodward's book. Tony Snow is shrugging off Foleygate, making jokes.
Unfortunately this is where they've been getting their cunning plans.
Honest question: what could have been done in July of 2001 with that information? Or, better yet, 'al-Qaeda is interested in attacking the U.S.' Duh. They'd done it once.
There's a lot of blame to go around, but I'm wondering if by 7/10, 9/11 was already set. (i.e., what's new to blame if this story is true?)
20: I'm just surprised that seven other people didn't get to it first. "I have a cunning plan" is pretty much a stock line around our house.
19:There was a lot of information floating around, uncollected,uncollated, unconnected. The hijackers in LA, the Feebie in Minnesota. A full court press could have prevented 9/11, I believe.
I think the quote is: "I have - " "Oh God." "- a cunning plan."
Honest question: what could have been done in July of 2001 with that information?
Certainly, maybe nothing effective. But maybe prep air traffic control to react quickly? Maybe pay more attention to the FBI concerns that came out later about flight schools? Maybe step up airport security?
It'd be claiming 20-20 hindsight to say that it could have been prevented, but it's not insane to say that greater efforts could have been made, and might have been effective.
Yeah, I was just wondering if this was just more 'they're incompetent', 'they're lying' and 'once again, they don't take al-Qaeda seriously enough soon enough' or 'we could have had a Jack Bauer on every plane who said 'fuck you' when they stood up with their boxcutters.'
I grant that this is hindsight. At the time, as I said, the scale of what al Qaeda was capable of was not anywhere the range of WTC. If I am in the gov't I am looking at the Cole or Anbar and a maximum of 200-500 casualties. At the outside. Not knowing what, where, when a full court press in August might have been embarrassing.
"You are devoting 1000 agents to an attack like the Cole?"
Remember, the original plan was to mess with China and Russia. They were big-think people.
22, on my site I collected, collated, and connected that stuff. I spent the entire month of March 2004 gathering stuff together. 90% of it from legit media. The Kerry people knew it was there and they could have picked and chosen as they wished. They just refused to talk about the issue.
I still have it all, on disc and on my harddrive. It's not on the net any more.
18: Maybe Mark Foley is really the baby-eating Bishop of Bath and Wells.
22:I read your stuff, John. I read a lot of it while you were writing it. I recommend it to everyone else.
25: I don't see these as mutually exclusive, why not all four?
30: My feelings exactly. I can't believe that, had they taken the threats as seriously as they took their Iraq war plans, it wouldn't have significantly decreased the chances of the attack.
29: Likewise -- I was reading Zizka avidly for years.
as seriously as they took their Iraq war plans
Um, a *little* more seriously than that, let's hope.
I think I'm too late to hijack the broadened horizons thread so I'll try this one: are any of the available translations of Aristotle's Politics and Constitution of Athens significantly better than any others? Or is there some translation resource site that could help me choose translations for classical and Renaissance texts? (I'll refrain from posting other titles I'm wondering about.)
33: Oops, poorly worded. "their Iraq war plans" s/b "their intent to invade Iraq"
25: I don't see these as mutually exclusive, why not all four?
I didn't think they were mutually exclusive, just wasn't sure what we were supposed to draw as conclusions from the new evidence.
Billmon said that the naval forces will reach the Persian Gulf around Oct. 21, a bit more than two weeks before the election.
The Republicans should have started loudly warning against an October Surprise two months ago. I hope it doesn't happen, and if it does happen, I hope that the Democrats respond effectively, and I hope that the voters don't get suckered again.
And a pony.
37:I just read Billmon's latest, and wish I hadn't. I ain't linking.
Me and Bob know how to kill a thread.
