Re: Bang Bang Bang

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Uh, I believe it should be "de-bangity-bangity-bang."


Posted by: Lars | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 2:28 PM
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Yes, that Slate article surprises because it kinda sorta doesn't...

I haven't gone to many of the links, but have always been interested in the keen interest teenage girls always showed in afterschool fights. Is there much evidence for that here?


Posted by: I don't pay | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 2:32 PM
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Bas Rutten knows when the time is right to say I loathe you.


Posted by: Armsmasher | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 2:33 PM
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If this is the video I think it is, can't see it at work, I found some other clips of Rutten demonstrating grappling techniques that started with what seemed like a random 10 second clip from it. It was hilarious because it would just jump into the middle of Rutten saying something like "and then do some real damage by slaming his head into the wall" With no context whatsoever.


Posted by: CJB | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 2:34 PM
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And then, stab his own knife into his liver.


Posted by: Cala | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 2:40 PM
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And then, stab his own knife into his liver.

That's the one. That was also one of the random clips.


Posted by: CJB | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 2:42 PM
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Here...in...the liver. Stab...the...liver.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 2:42 PM
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CJB, this one is tagged as "the better version" and seems to have some narrative continuity.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 2:43 PM
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I know we're supposed to feel ironic appreciation for the big, funny-talking foreigner, but honestly this just makes me want to arm the police more heavily.


Posted by: Lambent Cactus | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 2:44 PM
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this one is tagged as "the better version" and seems to have some narrative continuity

Yeah, what I saw was just random clips, at the beginning of some other videos, out of what I could tell was a full video. I haven't actually seen the full video. I will have to watch it when I get home.


Posted by: CJB | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 2:46 PM
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99: ironic, hell. Bas Rutten is awesome.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 2:48 PM
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Awesome? If a man of that size has been in a lot of bar fights, it's because he wants to.


Posted by: Lambent Cactus | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 2:59 PM
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I mean:

somebody's telling me that about my wife.. im sorry sir but im gonna break your leg


Posted by: Lambent Cactus | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 3:01 PM
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12: or because he worked as a bouncer. Or was a professional fighter. Or whatever.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 3:01 PM
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I can't see the video, so I don't know how relevant this is but going from comments I offer this anectdote. I used to know a pretty large guy who loved to get in drunken fights. Mostly he did it for fun, with other guys who were into it. Mostly there was more mess than real damage. Things were going lousy for him personally for a year or so, though, and he started to take this out on people. He'd pick fights with people who didn't really want to play, and not give them an easy out. He turned into a bit of a bully. One day, a scrawny little guy shot him in the face for it. Nobody could really blame the guy.


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 3:06 PM
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Or was a professional fighter.

Well that's the thing. Instructional video about boxing or even MMA fighting? I don't have the same response. Video about how to wreck a person for talking trash in a bar? Makes me feel like a Giuliani voter.

I think 12 holds even for bouncers.


Posted by: Lambent Cactus | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 3:06 PM
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Awesome indeed. His directness and practicality inspire confidence. I also appreciated his remarks about the kick to the groin, since I always felt bad about using that move the one time I (a scrawny sixth-grader) preëmptively responded to the threat of violence from a school thug. Now, Two Eyes for an Eye is my credo.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 3:07 PM
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Bas Rutten is funny, but does seem like he would be kind of the Martial Arts Dick. OTOH some of that advice looks genuinely useful, like how to break out of a full Nelson.


Posted by: DS | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 3:10 PM
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16 is right.

further to 15, the guy didn't die or anything, just lost some teeth and a piece of his jaw iirc.


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 3:12 PM
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On the Slate article: I foresee a whole new genre of journalism titled "The Art, The Poetry, The Idiocy, of Youtube " It's the modern reporters perfect piece, as it requires nothing more than surfing the web.


Posted by: PerfectlyGoddamnDelightful | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 3:14 PM
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One day, a scrawny little guy shot him in the face for it. Nobody could really blame the guy.

That'd make a great Sesame Street bit/educational school video.

"Remember boys and girls, it's always bad to bully people. America has lots of guns, and sooner or later, someone is going to SHOOT THAT BULLY IN THE FACE."


Posted by: gswift | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 3:15 PM
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I don't spend a whole lot of time in bars, but I've done my fair share. (Undergrad and grad school, etc.) Are fights really that common?


Posted by: Klug | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 3:19 PM
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I used to know a man who was about 6'5", 300lbs or so of solid muscle, who was honestly confused about why no ever one challenged him, even when he was walking out of a building with a couch under one arm. [In all fairness, he was helping a friend move.] Customs officials, cops, gang-bangers all pointedly avoided him whenever possible.

OTOH, I would love to hire Bas to beat up on the entire Dell "support" staff [except for someone named Scott, who was the wrong department, but at least forwarded me to the right one]. What part of 'yes, we have re-installed all of the software and the !@#%#!$^%# wifi still doesn't work, so we suspect it's a hardware problem' is incomprehensible to the population of greater Mumbai?


Posted by: DominEditrix | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 3:19 PM
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Sure, but can Bas Rutten move his hand and his knife the same to slap Mike Tyson in the eye?

BTW, if anybody can find the long version of this clip that was originally on the guy's website, please send me a link.


Posted by: apostropher | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 3:20 PM
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22: It really, really depends on the bar and the crowd. Some places will be cleared out once a month or so, and have a small fight or two every friday/saturday


23: I used to know a handful of guys who would have been happy to oblige him, but they were about the same size.


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 3:22 PM
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Are fights really that common?

Depends on the bar.


Posted by: SomeCallMeTim | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 3:22 PM
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25: I must be going to the wrong bars. (or the right ones.) 8-9 years of going to college-type bars and not a single fight.


Posted by: Klug | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 3:23 PM
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I'm getting the impression that Soup Biscuit is the man to call if anybody owes me money. Or that he will know the man to call, anyway.


Posted by: PerfectlyGoddamnDelightful | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 3:25 PM
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I've only been in one fight since elementary school, while physically ejecting a drunken stranger from our fraternity house. While he had decent aim with a full can of beer, he turned out to be a particularly inept grappler (and about 30 pounds lighter than me), and I mostly just held him down until the police came and took him away.

But then I'm a very happy and friendly drunk, so I really don't understand looking for a fight.


Posted by: apostropher | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 3:33 PM
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27: Definitely the right ones. Your mom was right: it's all fun and games until someone loses an eye.


Posted by: SomeCallMeTim | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 3:34 PM
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Then it's a game. Find the eye!


Posted by: Lambent Cactus | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 3:38 PM
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28: It's been a long time since I travelled in those circles, or anything near them.


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 3:44 PM
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31: Kinda sucks when you're It, though. On the hand, you're the most motivated player, but being down an eye is a clear disadvantage.


Posted by: apostropher | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 3:46 PM
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31: So it can properly all end in tears the way it's supposed to.


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 3:47 PM
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I actually know a guy who played this game, too.


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 3:47 PM
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pretty much all of my `I know a guy's ' in this thread should really be `I used to know a guy'. No idea how I'd find half of them now, if I tried.


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 3:48 PM
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Had a famous trial in Dallas where a private school preppy blinded a nerd with thumbs to the eyes. Preppy got probation, and on to Harvard, riches, trophy wife. Probably not politics.

Rule, which I learned way long ago. Run. If you can't run, kill em. Like in the video, don't take a chance. Kill the dumb drunk dead.


Posted by: bob mcmanus | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 3:49 PM
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37: you usually can run. walk even. `knock silly' is a decent replacement for `kill'. As is hobble (very effective).

The find-the-eye game was due to a pool cue, fwiw, and self inflicted. Poor bastard never lived that down (failed surgeries, glass eye now). People used to sometimes call him `sport'. Short for `the guy who turned pool into a sport', from the canonical rejoinder to 30.


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 3:52 PM
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31: Unless the crows win, that is.


Posted by: DS | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 3:53 PM
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The crow always wins, in the end.


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 3:55 PM
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My friend's dad is the guy who really did get his eye shot out with a BB gun.


Posted by: mano negra | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 3:59 PM
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37: So Bob has killed men before. This thread just got a lot more interesting.


Posted by: anmik | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 4:16 PM
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Haven't we always known that Bob has killed men? The "dumb drunk" elaboration is new, but other than that.


Posted by: DS | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 4:21 PM
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The two best bar fight type incidents I have witnessed.

1. I saw the UK Subs play at what was then WUST radio hall, with Beefeater opening. As I left the club, members of the band with their hands against a police car, being frisked and then cuffed by the cops. I stood in the middle of the road amazed at how punk this was, until I noticed a car honking and yelling at me to get out of the road. I was later told the base player for the Subs got into a tangle with Fred Smith of Beefeater.

2. Sitting quietly, in what I thought was a yuppie, no- fights-here bar, I saw someone drive a car through the storefront window and then pull out. No one was hurt, but we all had to leave the bar afterwards.


Posted by: rob helpy-chalk | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 4:25 PM
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I admit or deny nothing. Look, maybe I exaggerate, but I am also 5-4 and for a long time around 100 lbs. The guy you kicked in the crotch might have a gun in the back of his pants. You got 15 seconds to decide. Grab the beer bottle.

Lost a car & a job to a guy I though I had beat. At least somebody got the the tires & engine two days later. You are very vulnerable.

I have never liked to drink, and have always avoided bars and drinking with strangers. Alcohol makes you social, and most of social is dominance-submission shit. "Hey, I can tell a funnier joke than that loser over there." It all looks like fights to me.


Posted by: bob mcmanus | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 4:25 PM
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37: Bob is Ender?


Posted by: Lambent Cactus | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 4:27 PM
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Bob is G. Gordon Liddy?


Posted by: Flippanter | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 4:34 PM
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What does not destroy me can still hurt like hell.
Stare too long into the abyss and you'll fall in.

I am the uber-munchkin.


Posted by: bob mcmanus | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 4:40 PM
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So funny. Yesterday, I thought to myself, "Eh, not much on Unfogged today, I'll go watch fight clips on YouTube. And I watched several, including the Bas Rutten one. And now the next day it's on Unfogged! (Cue twilight zone music...)

Also, don't just assume you can act all tough against someone who doesn't look like Bas. In particular, you should all avoid picking on petite Japanese women, because one of them might completely kick your pathetic ass.


Posted by: Gaijin Biker | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 4:49 PM
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Oops, I forgot the closing quotation mark after "YouTube."


Posted by: Gaijin Biker | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 4:50 PM
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#9: I know we're supposed to feel ironic appreciation for the big, funny-talking foreigner, but honestly this just makes me want to arm the police more heavily.

If some guy starts attacking you in a bar, the police might show up after it's all over and take names. A bouncer, like Bas was, will be right there protecting you when it counts. As long as you stay on his good side.


Posted by: Gaijin Biker | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 4:55 PM
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Most bar fights don't last long. Human beings are relatively easy to knock out or put out of commission, moreso than Hollywood would have you believe.


Posted by: Cala | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 5:04 PM
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49: Hoooly crap. I know that "highlight reels" are a condensation (and a poor mirror) of reality, but wow. The 3-second clip of her repeatedly kicking a defenseless fighter in the ribs is nice -- presumably, honor prevented her from kicking her opponent in the head.


Posted by: Klug | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 5:19 PM
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51: Or to put it another way, in a good club the bouncers will protect you from bullies. In a bad one, the bouncers themselves are the bullies.

Yes, that highlight reel in 49 in pretty awe-inspiring.


Posted by: DS | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 5:22 PM
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I got hit with a chair in a bar. Wasn't much of a fight, since I went right down, and got dragged right out.


Posted by: Napi | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 5:25 PM
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I hope you went back and shot the place up. Or do you hate our American ways?


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 5:27 PM
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I like the bit where she's climbing all over the big guy like a fierce little monkey.


Posted by: redfoxtailshrub | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 5:28 PM
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49: That bit where she dives between an opponent's legs to throw them is sweet.


Posted by: Lambent Cactus | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 5:32 PM
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Since I hate submission-hold fighting, I really like the part at 6:25 in this clip where she gets knocked the fuck out.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 5:32 PM
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I've seen a few nasty bar fights, but they didn't last long. The really major location for fights always seemed to be late night taxi queues, though.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 5:33 PM
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I admit or deny nothing. Look, maybe I exaggerate, but I am also 5-4 and for a long time around 100 lbs. The guy you kicked in the crotch might have a gun in the back of his pants. You got 15 seconds to decide. Grab the beer bottle.

In my youth I hung out in the rough bars in some sort of dubious quest for authenticity. I learned from those lively evenings skipping out of the way of people throwing chairs at each other is that one should always be careful messing with the short guys. Because the big guys will maul you around a little bit, but the short guys will kill.

I got all nostalgic watching him beat the guy with the chair.


Posted by: winna | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 5:42 PM
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I was once hit in the head with a pool cue at a Public Enemy concert in Milwaukee. I woke up later, surrounded by medical staff, in the bowels of the Bradley center. My head hurt for several days. And now I think Bob may have been responsible. So take a notch out of your belt McManus; I survived.


Posted by: anmik | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 5:43 PM
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Hey winna, did you see this?


Posted by: Knecht Ruprecht | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 5:45 PM
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59: You hate submission fighting, but made it to 6:25 in a clip where her opponent spends most of the time mucking around Brazilian jiu-jitsu style?


Posted by: DS | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 5:46 PM
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Somebody once told me (probably just some nerd blowing "I've been in a few fights in my time, boy" smoke at karate class, though) that the person who wins a fight is usually the one who first realizes that a fight is happening.


Posted by: Flippanter | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 5:48 PM
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59: You hate submission fighting, but made it to 6:25 in a clip where her opponent spends most of the time mucking around Brazilian jiu-jitsu style?

I'm tough like that.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 5:48 PM
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the person who wins a fight is usually the one who first realizes that a fight is happening

cf. Poland 1939.


Posted by: Knecht Ruprecht | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 5:50 PM
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Since I hate submission-hold fighting women, I really like the part at 6:25 in this clip where she gets knocked the fuck out.


Posted by: teofilo | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 5:50 PM
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where she gets knocked the fuck out

Oh yes. That's when the core of my soul spasms and snaps, spitting out its filthy pips.


Posted by: DS | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 5:52 PM
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Somebody once told me (probably just some nerd blowing "I've been in a few fights in my time, boy" smoke at karate class, though) that the person who wins a fight is usually the one who first realizes that a fight is happening.

This reminds me of the words of wisdom my friend reports that he was given by a friend's older brother, a renowned bar fighter: With any fight, there's a minute where you know it's going to happen before it does, just like with a kiss. When that moment comes, hit the other guy as hard as possible, and then keep on hitting him until he's unconscious.


Posted by: redfoxtailshrub | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 5:52 PM
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This guy is awesome, of course, but he's giving away all my hapkido secrets! I wouldn't be surprised if some Korean were to silence him.


Posted by: foolishmortal | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 5:58 PM
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70: Or, as Sonny Chiba tells us, "Sword fighting is intimate. It involves control of breath and eye contact."


Posted by: Flippanter | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 6:03 PM
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I am from the southernmost region of a John Denver song!

The thing I always found most disturbing about bar fights is how little animus people appeared to feel after it was over. If I was angry enough to beat someone up, I would not buy them a beer the next time I saw them. Perhaps letting their angry passions rise cleansed their souls. Like muscular Christianity, but with lots of beer!


Posted by: winna | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 6:05 PM
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Does anyone know what style Ms. 49 is using? It looks like very funky ju jitsu, but I have no clue.


Posted by: foolishmortal | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 6:07 PM
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I was at the gym a few months ago and overheard two big crew-cut guys in Air Force shirts discussing Hapkido.
"We spent the first hour learning how to fall."
"What?"
"Yeah, the whole hour it's just flop, flop, flop, and I'm thinking I'm outta here."
"Yeah."
"But the next thing we do is a simple throw, and the instructor says the next thing you do is stomp on his neck. And we practice that. Throw stomp throw stomp - one fluid motion."
"Sick!"
"Yeah. I was al - I am definitely coming back to this!"
"When are the meetings?"


Posted by: Lambent Cactus | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 6:07 PM
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I had to smack someone this morning. He might have just been asking for the time, but when you haven't washed for a couple of days, talk like you're high and you're standing on a street that has a crack-house on it (NB: it's a long street, I am middle class, honest) then IMO you ought to be a bit more fucking diffident in the conversations you start at five in the fucking morning. I gruffly told him that it was five in the morning and he should say what he had to say or fuck off, and he he got quite offended with my rudeness. Unfortunately I sprained my ankle yesterday, so legging it wasn't an option, so I sort of slapped him, shoved him into the wall (of the local church drop-in centre, how ironic) and hobbled off in the direction of my local 24-hour grocery, where my mates intercepted him and it was all over bar the shouting abuse as I trundled off to the tube. Aaah real life self defence.

That video looks reasonably sensible, albeit that a lot of the moves would require you to basically be a judo champion to remember what you're meant to be doing. Also the kick in the nuts really isn't as disabling as everyone says it is; club level rugby would be more or less unplayable if it was.


Posted by: dsquared | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 6:12 PM
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#53: The 3-second clip of her repeatedly kicking a defenseless fighter in the ribs is nice -- presumably, honor prevented her from kicking her opponent in the head.

If the "defenseless fighter" has had enough, she should "tap out" by slapping the canvas with her palm. That's the signal for "Stop, I give up". Until she does that, her opponent should by all means continue to pound away.


Posted by: Gaijin Biker | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 6:13 PM
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The stuff about knowing when something is going to happen really is key. Most people never really do get into fights, so if it does happen they mostly lose before they realise what is happening. This is even true often of people with some training if they end up squared off with a real brawler because they aren't looking for the right cues and don't realize the guy is about to floor them with a pint glass.

The other thing is, though, some people like to roughouse this way. It's mostly social, and it's a really different sort of fight. People get drunk, go toe to toe a bit, wake up the next day with black eyes and are mostly still friends. In some circles that is pretty common, and telling the difference between that an a `serious' fight is a useful.

The thing about bouncers if they are your friend is true. If they are the other guys friend, you're screwed. And some places regularly have a half dozen guys in them who could take one or two of the bouncers down easy, although they are usual friendly with them. So if the place really gets going, the bouncers just get people out of the way. Nothing like your average meat market where they hire bulk to mostly muscle around drunk guys who can't fight anyway.


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 6:17 PM
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Looks like judo mixed with kickboxing. She's scary.


Posted by: mcmc | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 6:22 PM
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79 was to 74.


Posted by: mcmc | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 6:23 PM
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i'm againts all kinds of violence
especially female


Posted by: read | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 6:23 PM
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Does anyone know what style Ms. 49 is using?

The throws look to be pretty classic judo. Her ground work could be as well.


Posted by: CJB | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 6:25 PM
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Pwnd by mcmc.


Posted by: CJB | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 6:26 PM
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With any fight, there's a minute where you know it's going to happen before it does, just like with a kiss. When that moment comes, hit the other guy as hard as possible, and then keep on hitting him until he's unconscious.

This moment is also the time to walk away, typically preventing the fight from occuring.

I've seen the results of too many "bar fights" where the victor ends up charged with a felony and the victim ends up badly beaten. Neither result is one that I wish to be a part of.


Posted by: will | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 6:27 PM
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What are you, Will, some kind of homo or something?

Yeah, me too.


Posted by: Not Prince Hamlet | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 6:30 PM
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This moment is also the time to walk away, typically preventing the fight kiss from occuring.

Fixed, for the benefit of the anti-relationshipites in the audience.


Posted by: Flippanter | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 6:30 PM
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I have no idea how long women's MMA has been a big deal in Japan, GB, or if it's much of a big deal at all, but it seems that groping on trains would be far less common if a video loop of Shinashi Sakoto were to be played throughout the railway system.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 6:32 PM
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The name is .... Dalton

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0098206/


Posted by: Tassled Loafered Leech | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 6:33 PM
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I've represented too many people in these situations. Plus, it would ruin my gun class if they knew I didnt practice what I preach.

Will there be a group of shooters at DC Unfogged? Skeet shooters? gswift coming? Becks?


Posted by: will | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 6:33 PM
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Everyone should put pictures of their guns in the Flickr pool.


Posted by: TJ | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 6:36 PM
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74, 79, 82: She is a practicioner of Mixed Martial Arts (MMA), which basically means a little of this and a little of that. Most MMA competitors combine a striking art (like karate or muay thai boxing) with a grappling art, like judo or Brazilian jiu-jitsu.

Her Wikipedia page says she uses sambo (which is rooted in judo) and jiu-jitsu. Of course, she's got a sweet spinning backfist and some nice kicks which presumably come from training in some other art. Overall, I'd say her fighting has a definite Shooto flavor.


Posted by: Gaijin Biker | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 6:37 PM
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73: county seat related to a college entrance exam, a grape juice, or a conifer?


Posted by: Knecht Ruprecht | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 6:37 PM
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I just watched the video. Just about everything he is recommending will result in you being charged with a felony. I think the malicious wounding sentencing guideline range for someone without any prior convictions is two to three years in the penn. First offense.


Posted by: will | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 6:37 PM
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90: There was a call for submissions a while back, but it sort of petered out IIRC.


Posted by: Not Prince Hamlet | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 6:38 PM
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87: I have no idea how long women's MMA has been a big deal in Japan, GB, or if it's much of a big deal at all, but it seems that groping on trains would be far less common if a video loop of Shinashi Sakoto were to be played throughout the railway system.

Or better yet, if she were sent out to ride the trains undercover in a schoolgirl uniform and beat the holy crap out of any lecherous salaryman who grabs her ass. Now that would make one helluva YouTube clip.


Posted by: Gaijin Biker | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 6:41 PM
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#93: Spoilsport.


Posted by: Gaijin Biker | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 6:42 PM
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Everyone should put pictures of their guns in the Flickr pool.

I think that was tried once before, but not enough people submitted photos...

Oh, wait, by "gun" you mean "firearm".


Posted by: Knecht Ruprecht | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 6:45 PM
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Indeed, I do.


Posted by: TJ | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 6:46 PM
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88:I have said before that the sight of Swayze's deeply dimpled cheeks made me re-examine my sexual preferences. With new commentary by Kevin Smith? A must have classic.


Posted by: bob mcmanus | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 6:47 PM
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99. An underappreciated masterpiece, to be sure. Some of the cheesiest dialogue ever filmed.


Posted by: Tassled Loafered Leech | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 6:56 PM
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beat the holy crap out of any lecherous salaryman who grabs her ass

A woman I knew did something like this. A drunken salaryman grabbed her ass on the way out of the train one night, and she spun around and dropped him on the platform with a solid punch in the face. It was kind of comic; he just kind of raised his head, put his hand on his cheek and said "Awesome."


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 6:57 PM
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95:Hard Candy has been floating around my cable for a few months. Not quite what you describe, and somehow I think there is such a movie specifically about Japanese-schoolgirl revenge.

Saw Park's Lady Vengeance Sunday night. Beautiful and horrible.

And Quicksand is a very obscure unappreciated John Brunner novel.


Posted by: bob mcmanus | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 6:57 PM
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91: If I designed a martial art, I think it would be called "Shooto". It would involve uzis.

95: Now that is a fine idea. I'm sure they could make a tv show out of it and make millions.


Posted by: foolishmortal | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 6:58 PM
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It was kind of comic; he just kind of raised his head, put his hand on his cheek and said "Awesome."

Oh man. I can see it now.


Posted by: redfoxtailshrub | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 6:59 PM
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77: GB, I'm familiar with the traditions of MMA. I'm merely surprised to see such defenselessness in an MMA fight. Last time I saw such obvious teeing off, Big John McCarthy was there 0.5 seconds later pushing Severn off Taktarov.


Posted by: Klug | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 7:01 PM
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From the trivia page for Hard Candy:

"The inspiration comes from Japan. Producer David Higgins had read reports of Japanese schoolgirls ambushing men who surfed the Internet for underage dates and later developed the story."

I gotta believe the Japanese or Koreans have made a movie.


Posted by: bob mcmanus | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 7:01 PM
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107

Kind of.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 7:02 PM
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Searching for "Japanese schoolgirl ambush movie" produced a bunch of links that would probably get sent off to Coventry, plus a paean to Yo Yo Girl Cop from the ever-lovin' ISB.


Posted by: snarkout | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 7:11 PM
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Big John McCarthy was there 0.5 seconds later

UFC does a decent job of protecting the fighters. DEEP operates under Pride rules, allowing kicks and stomps to the head of a downed opponent, which really seems nuts to me.


Posted by: apostropher | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 7:12 PM
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Will there be a group of shooters at DC Unfogged? Skeet shooters? gswift coming?

Unfortunately, plane ticket + accommodations is not in the budget right now.

Everyone should put pictures of their guns in the Flickr pool.

I put a pic in of a couple of ours a while back.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/gswift/371072368/in/set-72157594502981632/


Posted by: gswift | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 7:14 PM
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76: That doesn't seem like a smacky situation to me. I guess if you're thinking you should run away, and can't, then smack is the only reasonable alternative.

That video looks reasonably sensible, albeit that a lot of the moves would require you to basically be a judo champion to remember what you're meant to be doing.

The mid-distance moves looked riskier than the close up stuff. Once a guy puts his arm in your personal space it isn't that difficult to make it go your way. You can nearly always get a grip on the guy, the question is whether a)you know how to work the joint and b)whether you're sensible given the fact that you've just been punched. They make you train a lot, but the worst I've experienced is having the guy halfway down and wondering "How does this go now?" At that point you can kind of work it by feel.


Posted by: foolishmortal | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 7:16 PM
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108: Thanks for that. I'd forgotten about Sukeban Deka, which was awesome.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 7:19 PM
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The closest thing I have been to a fight was in a no-fault divorce deposition. One of my partners finished his question of his client (the wife) and her father. My buddy told the opposing party (unrepresented) that it was his turn to ask questions.

The husband asked the wife (in front of wife's father), "Isnt it true that you are a slut and a whore?"

Father jumped up. My partner jumped up. Husband ripped my partner's shirt. Secretaries ran to get me. When I got in the middle, the guy decided he better leave. (Not that I am big or a badass)


Posted by: will | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 7:27 PM
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Quicksand is the kinda New Wave SF written in the 60s that makes me think PKD is way overrated. A naked pixieish woman appears in a British forest and kills like ten armed security guards with her bare hands before being subdued.
She speaks no known language. The psychologist in charge of preparing her for trial has to deal with his attraction to her. Is it her childlike appearance combined with her cold-blooded violence that is the turn-on? Very subtle and disturbing, like Hard Candy, which I presume y'all saw years ago.

Been thinking about High Road to Jamaica this week, based on this post and Silber bringing up Alice Miller again. Programming.

Never mind. Getting weird, I think.


Posted by: bob mcmanus | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 7:34 PM
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PKD is way overrated
Heresy. He's headed that way, but hasn't hit the mark yet. At such a point that people speak of PKD and Delaney in the same breath, I'll consider Delaney underrated.


Posted by: foolishmortal | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 7:38 PM
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With any fight, there's a minute where you know it's going to happen before it does, just like with a kiss. When that moment comes, hit the other guy as hard as possible, and then keep on hitting him until he's unconscious.

Yes, the sucker punch is the most effective punch of all.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 7:50 PM
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I can't believe I've gotten this deep in the comments without seeing a single "MANDOM!" shout out.


Posted by: Ubu Imperator | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 7:52 PM
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118

"Isnt it true that you are a slut and a whore?"

I know it makes me a bad person, but this just kills me.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 7:53 PM
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119

Never ask a question to which you do not already know the answer.


Posted by: Lambent Cactus | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 7:57 PM
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Oh, also, all my opponents (other than my brother) have been between the ages of 12 and 19. So if you're fighting an adult who is not my brother, disregard my advice. If you're fighting Phillip K. Dick, go for the gravestone. Once that's broken, he loses all earthly power.


Posted by: foolishmortal | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 8:05 PM
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I've seen the results of too many "bar fights" where the victor ends up charged with a felony

Everybody, get the fuck out of Dodge afterwards. Sticking around is a suckers bet. And if you do get hauled in by the cops, keep your mouth shut.


Posted by: gswift | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 8:07 PM
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121:

I had a hat that said "Nobody talks. Everybody Walks."

I loved that hat.


Posted by: will | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 8:10 PM
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I refuse to love hats that say things.


Posted by: foolishmortal | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 8:12 PM
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113: That's it? I went to a plastic fabrication place in Alabama for something or the other and they had an exhibit of several thick plastic sheets hit with various bullets from different firearms. "What's that for?" "A divorce lawyer's receptionist's window."


Posted by: Biohazard | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 8:19 PM
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See, this is why people shouldn't go pro se. A lawyer would've asked Isnt it true that you are a slut and a whore? Remember, you're under oath.


Posted by: Nápi | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 8:30 PM
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Objection.

Vague.

Also, what time frame are we talking about?


Posted by: will | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 8:32 PM
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56 -- The dragging was friendly. Not so friendly that head bumping into stuff, including the door jamb was avoided, but friendly enough to end the threat of active violence. I'm a little hazy on the details, but I think I may well have deserved a serious reprimand, even if not the full treatment.


Posted by: Nápi | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 8:37 PM
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#101: I am thinking this could make a decent quirky romantic comedy, kind of like Secretary in reverse: A sadistic female MMA fighter falls for the masochistic salaryman she beat up after he groped her on a train.


Posted by: Gaijin Biker | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 8:37 PM
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#102: somehow I think there is such a movie specifically about Japanese-schoolgirl revenge

You may be thinking about the movie Audition. Don't. It's gross.


Posted by: Gaijin Biker | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 8:40 PM
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#105: I agree the ref should've stopped the fight sooner. But it's not a fighter's job to hold back if the ref is slow on the draw.


Posted by: Gaijin Biker | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 8:45 PM
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129:I think about that movie a lot. Watched it 5+ times.

There is also that wonderful Japanese schoolgirl in Kill Bill Pt I


Posted by: bob mcmanus | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 8:47 PM
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Given that this is the only bouncer thread we've had in ages, I offer this: One time I was drinking far too much with a large group, and one of the group started waving his penis around. Out he goes, fair enough, except the bouncer insisted on banging his head against every surface he could find (like four of them), because he was the bouncer. Me, being drunk and 19, started talking shit to the bouncer on his account, at which point he threw me out. Except that I bought some time by centering myself and staying on my feet. I used this time to yell "Help, Help, I'm being repressed! See the violence inherent in the system!" Of course he gave me a good headbutt for my troubles and my face was fucked for weeks, but I was quite satisfied, and still am. End of story.


Posted by: foolishmortal | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 8:49 PM
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You were 19? Where was this?


Posted by: teofilo | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 8:52 PM
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103: If I designed a martial art, I think it would be called "Shooto". It would involve uzis.

It's already been done, my friend.


Posted by: Gaijin Biker | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 8:57 PM
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#105: Severn was awesome when he body-slammed that karate dude in UFC 2. It was like Zangief in Street Fighter II come to life.


Posted by: Gaijin Biker | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 9:00 PM
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I am basically the Gary "War Nerd" Brecher of martial arts. All those old streetfighters like Ba Rutten are stuck in a twentieth century mindset unsuited for modern counterinsurgency streetfights. Rather as the IDF could defeat Hezbollah in a straight fight, I am sure that most of these YouTube hardmen could beat the crap out of me if I were stupid enough to advance on them in the old British Army square formation, shouting "Did You Spill My Pint?". However, in any actual fight anyone might want to have with me, I'm going to be in a very small corner of North London where a lot of the bystanders are my mates and the bouncers will be on my side, so my guess is that Rutten is fucked. I have trained assiduously for my martial art by drinking in the same two or three pubs four nights a week for the last twelve years.


Posted by: dsquared | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 9:06 PM
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Surely it is easier to master Samuel Colt-fu.


Posted by: Lambent Cactus | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 9:29 PM
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136 and 77* together are too much awesome for one thread.

(* I mean, leave it to d^2 to actually tell a story about smacking and then fleeing a homeless guy. Why am I grinning at that? I'm a bad person for grinning at that.)


Posted by: DS | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 9:34 PM
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Sorry for the delay, but
You were 19? Where was this?
Brisbane, Australia

Also, Gary Brecher could beat up dsquared any day of the week. It's a matter of strategy.


Posted by: foolishmortal | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 9:52 PM
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137 - But way less fun.


Posted by: Lambent Cactus | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 10:02 PM
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gswift, I put a pic up, too. Today.


Posted by: TJ | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 10:07 PM
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135: Dan the Beast was amazing. I'm so glad he didn't work out in pro wrestling.


Posted by: Klug | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 10:11 PM
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#70: With any fight, there's a minute where you know it's going to happen before it does, just like with a kiss.

Yes, it's exactly the same.


Posted by: Gaijin Biker | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 10:32 PM
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gswift, I put a pic up, too. Today.

Sigs are great. Hard to go wrong buying the Euro brands.


Posted by: gswift | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 10:42 PM
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I'm amazed we haven't yet seen this display of catlike reflexes.


Posted by: Lambent Cactus | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 10:43 PM
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We really like it. Really want another. Matched set, like yours(?).


Posted by: TJ | Link to this comment | 11-27-07 11:10 PM
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re: fighting.

I've not been in a 'real' fight since I was about 19, but I did fight in a competition a few weeks back.

So, amusingly, I'm ranked seventh as a superheavyweight in the UK in s /avate. This sounds great until someone asks how many Brits competed at superheavy in s /avate last year, to which the answer is, er, seven. Still, I'll be sure to tell the next person who noises me up in a pub that [and maybe ask them to wait while I change into my unitard].

re: 145

That's a cracking punch.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 11-28-07 1:32 AM
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re: 147

Shit, I checked. I'm sixth. Yay! Still, only six people competed at that weight. So, still holds.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 11-28-07 1:37 AM
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Matched set, like yours(?).

Kind of ended up being "matched", but was unintentional. Ruger finishes their .454 Super Redhawks in that grey to differentiate them from the .44 mag Super Redhawks. Grey has never been a standard finish the .357 GP100. Ruger did a limited run of them in grey for a distributor, and I was lucky enough to run across one. Snagged it as a present for my wife a few years back.

Worth renting a good 1911 if you get the chance. Whole different feel than the polymer autos. Kimbers are nice, and of course there's the hand tuned jobs like Nighthawk.

http://www.nighthawkcustom.com/

I'm sixth. Yay! Still, only six people competed at that weight.

Heh. God, I love the endless bragging about "champions" and shit out of martial arts studios in this country. It all sounds great to people who don't realize there's fucking thousands of these little local circuits.


Posted by: gswift | Link to this comment | 11-28-07 2:11 AM
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Heh. God, I love the endless bragging about "champions" and shit out of martial arts studios in this country. It all sounds great to people who don't realize there's fucking thousands of these little local circuits.

Yeah. The better people on our circuit are world ranked,* as they compete a lot in Europe where s /avate is huge. These are people who've beaten the very best French fighters. But the ability level falls off pretty quickly from the top two or three people in each weight class as there just isn't the numbers to sustain really high quality in depth.

If I went off an opened a gym or started teaching a class and told people I was 'in the top 10 in the UK' then they've have no way of knowing that that was basically a completely meaningless claim and that a raw beginner could get ranked that high (outside of the busiest weight classes).

* I've sparred people who have silver medals and bronze medals at world and european level; my own instructor has a bronze at european level.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 11-28-07 2:18 AM
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Where do they get s/avate people from, if not from non-France-Europe?


Posted by: foolishmortal | Link to this comment | 11-28-07 2:53 AM
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re: 151

? eh, I'm not sure what you mean? Is this some 'the UK is in Europe' reference?

If so, yeah, but what I meant was, 'it's bigger on mainland Europe than in the UK'.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 11-28-07 3:48 AM
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Not trying to pose a trick question. From our position, the UK is very much European. Do you give any of your(nationally speaking) kids martial arts training? My mom had us in aikido from the age of 6, and it wasn't that unusual.


Posted by: foolishmortal | Link to this comment | 11-28-07 5:02 AM
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re: 153

I don't (personally) have any kids, but yeah, loads of little kids go to taekwondo or karate, or whatever. When I was growing up I didn't do anything like that but I had friends who went to karate classes or judo. Most local community centres or sports centres will have a bunch of martial arts classes.

The club I go to doesn't teach kids and I'm not aware of any of the UK clubs in that style who do [but it's common in France].


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 11-28-07 5:07 AM
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Had an incident relevant to this thread- there was a fight at the end of my hockey game last night (not me, I was on the bench at the time.) Shockingly, common sense prevailed in the heat of battle- two guys were throwing punches, but both had face cages on (so they left their gloves on too, no point in hurting your hands.) The refs just yelled at them to stop but didn't step in- they actually said at one point, "You're not hurting each other." But then, the guy on the other team dropped his glove and grabbed our guy's cage, twisted him to his knees, then managed to pull his helmet off. He raised it up over our guy (still on his knees) about to smash his head, and everyone on the bench thought, "Oh, fuck." But then the other guy must have realized he'd be going to jail for that one, and threw the helmet across the ice instead and backed off. Everyone afterwards, including our guy who lost the helmet, laughed about it, but that half-second the guy was holding the helmet up was one of those, "Is this really about to happen?" moments.


Posted by: SP | Link to this comment | 11-28-07 5:34 AM
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That sounds like you could point to a certain point in the linked vid, and say "he was about to do this."


Posted by: foolishmortal | Link to this comment | 11-28-07 5:44 AM
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Maybe the chair to the head at about 1:00, but Bas didn't have any hockey helmets in the bar for his demonstration, and it would have been down on the top of the head, not into the face.


Posted by: SP | Link to this comment | 11-28-07 5:54 AM
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I am sure that most of these YouTube hardmen could beat the crap out of me if I were stupid enough to advance on them in the old British Army square formation, shouting "Did You Spill My Pint?". However, in any actual fight anyone might want to have with me, I'm going to be in a very small corner of North London where a lot of the bystanders are my mates and the bouncers will be on my side, so my guess is that Rutten is fucked. I have trained assiduously for my martial art by drinking in the same two or three pubs four nights a week for the last twelve years.

This made me laugh out loud.


Posted by: Will | Link to this comment | 11-28-07 7:10 AM
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Worth renting a good 1911 if you get the chance. Whole different feel than the polymer autos. Kimbers are ...

Yeah, have fired a couple of 1911s in .45, and a Kimber, too. That was fun. Loud fun.


Posted by: TJ | Link to this comment | 11-28-07 10:59 AM
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155: fighting in hockey is pretty stupid[*]. It's either clowishly ineffective, or really dangerous.

[*] yeah, ok fighting is pretty stupid.


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 11-28-07 11:11 AM
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what i learned from the bas rutten clip:
never wear a red shirt.
those guys in the red shirts?
they're wishing they hadn't.


Posted by: kid bitzer | Link to this comment | 11-28-07 1:44 PM
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161: weren't you paying attention to the original star trek?


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 11-28-07 1:45 PM
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not really--who wore what?
wait--now it's coming back to me:
yeah, i watched it, but our tv was black & white.


Posted by: kid bitzer | Link to this comment | 11-28-07 1:47 PM
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