Yeah, that play makes it much easier to accept the outcome. Championship earned.
Brady was too efficient, if he'd taken longer to score their second TD then Manning wouldn't have had time for the Giants' comeback. You can't control the clock as well when you're an air-based team.
The throw isn't as impressive as the catch? I'm not an educated consumer of football, but the evasive maneuvering Manning did there is something I've hardly ever seen. Usually, if there are that many defenders that close to you on all sides, you're down, no?
But it was a very impressive play on both ends.
3: Gawd, yes. The whole play was just outrageous.
Actually, under older rules he might have been ruled down- there was an "in the grasp" rule that allowed the refs to blow a play dead if a QB was grabbed but not yet down, to protect the QB from being slammed or hit by another player without being able to protect himself. The irony of obscure rules (see also tuck rule.) Further irony- when Brady was sacked and stripped while trying to throw, the guy who got him was named Tuck.
3: the throw was a very good scramble by the QB, but that's not all that unordinary--happens several times every Sunday. The catch was on his helmet.
Actually, under older rules he might have been ruled down- there was an "in the grasp" rule that allowed the refs to blow a play dead if a QB was grabbed but not yet down, to protect the QB from being slammed or hit by another player without being able to protect himself.
Exactly. Just a remarkable effort from young Eli. I don't think of him as soft, but--for some reason--I just expected him to take the sack and go down.
And the reason the Giants win is bearable is because they played much better football, plain and simple. It has nothing to do with this throw and catch and everything to do with their consistent defensive pressure. In fact, what would truly have been unbearable is if they'd been largely outplayed but managed to eek out a win on some outrageous throw-and-catch like this.
It was a great game and the better team won.
The Tuck strip was great. The reply revealed that Tuck was trying to get Brady in some kind of arm bar to make him submit.
Ogged, are you borrrowing baa's weird imaginings of the liberal mindset again?
Yeah, what Brock said; I was hoping the defensive line would collectively get the MVP somehow.
I don't think a lineman has ever won MVP- it's unusual enough when a defensive player wins, it's almost always a QB, sometimes RB or maybe a WR.
Actually, there have been a couple- position breakdown:
* 22 quarterbacks
* 7 running backs
* 5 wide receivers
* 2 defensive ends
* 2 linebackers
* 2 safeties
* 1 cornerback
* 1 defensive tackle
* 1 kick returner/punt returner
The Puppy Bowl could have been more exciting.
11:Cowboy Harvey martin was one DL that won MVP, IIRC. I'll go check.
Yup. The memory ain't so bad.
To me the most impressive part of that play is that Eli sprints away from the defenders, spins around, and just whips it downfield - how the hell did he know Tyree would be there? I guess he started looking downfield mid-sprint, but still - that's pretty impressive field vision.
Ah, and I just realized how the ball didn't pop off Tyree's helmet when he landed - the defender cushioned him. It was actually a pretty gentle landing.
that's not all that unordinary--happens several times every Sunday.
At least two different D-linemen had hold of Manning's shirt! I watch every Sunday (bad habit) and I've never seen that.
The Giants' win is bearable because in the end it wasn't a realization of the Harrison Bergeronesque fantasies of those loathsome leveling liberals
No, the Giants' win was awesome precisely because of this. No perfect streaks for you! Imperfection and blemishes for all!
Also, O, see here for the flip side of your "Worship Greatness, Peons" attitude. Ayn Rand's pregame call:
Belichick squared his broad shoulders as he stared Coughlin in the eye. The smaller man cowed and threw his hands to his face in a pathetic flail. "Tom," said Belichick, "I bet nobody has been honest with you in your entire life, so let me be the first. I was taught in the ways of strength. Yes, my men will win today. But it's because we've had the courage to act on our judgment, and the fortitude to trust our decisions. [...]
Actually, it's funny - I just realized that on Saturday I was explaining to my daughter that "nobody's perfect." She took this to heart, and told her mother that she's not a perfect mother, and that I'm not a perfect father, and that Anya isn't a perfect friend, and Anya's mom isn't a perfect mother.... She went on in this vein.
At any rate: Thank you, NFL, for supporting my parenting lessons in such a high-profile setting. Maybe I'll show her some Michael Vick video to further the "don't pull the dog's ears" lesson.
I agree with Labs and Brock. The Giants' defense was really impressive throughout the game. But that play seemed like a lucky fluke to me, and consequently not all that impressive. It was really exciting, but definitely not something that makes me wish Eli Manning was QBing for the Redskins.
I don't think anyone disagrees with Brock and Labs. But it's hard to love a negative: "the defense kept Brady from hitting Moss," etc.
Of course the D line was the difference in the game, but this was a great play, and I don't see any youtube clips of solid defensive line play, so this is what you get.
There are some sack videos. This was the best- pile driving action. Also Strahan here.
I'm sure the NFL goons will wipe Youtube of all clips by this afternoon.
I agree with 8. The Giants' failed drives were a lot more flukey than the Pats' - in fact the Pats had, I think, 2 drives that continued due to extra-normal circumstances (the 12th man, and I feel like there was another). The Giants outplayed the Pats on both sides of the ball, and I would've been really annoyed at a last minute Pats win, largely because it would have been told as a perfect win by a perfect team, not a flukey win by an outplayed team.
I actually felt that way about several Pats games this season; that's part of why I wanted them to lose. I honestly didn't think they played up to the hype after the Steelers game. It seemed that, in the first ~10 weeks, they built up a juggernaut rep. Then, in the last ~6 weeks, they kept scraping by - but each scrape was evidence of perfection. The other guy misses an easy FG? Bellichek's a genius. Phantom interference call prolongs a last-minute drive? Brady's the G.O.A.T. Now the hyperbole can be curtailed. They were very, very good. Next year will be interesting.
19: I don't call Manning-to-Tyree a "fluke" - Manning showed strength and resolve to escape the sack and fantastic field sense to find Tyree; Tyree showed great athleticism* in going up to get the ball, and then astonishing strength and hands to hold onto the ball coming down.
Hey, on the Giants' D - what did happen on the TD drive? It seemed like, all the sudden, the Giants were laying back (the announcers mentioned this briefly). I know that making the D seem helpless is what Brady does, but they dominated every other drive of the entire game except the other TD drive, and that was a close-fought one. I couldn't understand why the Pats moved so easily that one drive.
* He's black, right? Otherwise, he showed a lot of grit.
I saw Obama ads before the game and at the end of halftime. Did any other candidates run ads?
OK, what's up with this:
When asked whether he expected such success for both of his sons, Archie said: "I never thought about them even playing college ball, much less pro football, much less winning Super Bowls or M.V.P.'s. It wasn't in the plan."My understanding is that these two boys have had this shit planned out since they were in utero. I mean, there's modesty, and there's bullshit. Am I wrong?
The sweet thing about Tyree's catch is that the NFL rules have become really oppressive regarding what can be ruled a catch. You bobbled a little? The ball touched the ground a little? No catch. But as weird as that was, Tyree clearly made the catch by NFL rules. Had he not fallen on the defender, though, the ball would have touched the ground and I bet on replay it would have been overturned.
Hey, on the Giants' D - what did happen on the TD drive? It seemed like, all the sudden, the Giants were laying back
I think the Pats went to a short, quick underneath passing game in the fouth quarter. That helped Brady handle the blitz better and they had a lot of success. I don't know why it took them so long. This felt like a coaching breakdown on the part of the Pats -- maybe the most unexpected weakness of all.
25: I don't think so, and after speaking to people who know these sorts of things, I believe it's the first time a presidential primary candidate has run a Superbowl commercial. I was kind of disappointed in the commercial, though -- it looked lousy compared to the ones bookending it, and I had been hoping for one of Obama speaking to the camera directly instead of a generic campaign ad.
24: The Giants had two injured defenders on the last few plays of the Pats' TD drive, and I'm sure the remaining guys were EXHAUSTED. Manning hadn't given them much down time.
At least two different D-linemen had hold of Manning's shirt!
I totally thought he was going down. I bet those Pats linemen *still* can't figure out how the fuck he got away.
You guys are all missing out on the important question: what did you think of Tom Petty?
You guys are all missing out on the important question: what did you think of Tom Petty? How was the food?
It was a complete fluke, and the Pats blew it.
That said, thank you Pats, for blowing it! Whew.
The 72 dolphins can't live much longer, anyway.
30: I thought exhaustion might have been part of it; didn't know about the two guys out. They sure as hell had plenty of git-go for the last 34 seconds. Adrenaline is an amazing thing.
22: Already, the embedded vid has stopped working for me.
Half-time was so incredibly dull that I found myself nodding off and got up to walk around, refresh the soda, etc. If the Obama ad played here (which would surprise me) then I didn't see it.
Cowboy Harvey Martin was one DL that won MVP, IIRC.
Cowboys' linebacker Chuck Howley has the distinction of one of two linebackers to win the MVP and the only player to win the MVP* while playing for the losing team.
*That's "Superbowl MVP". I think several players have been named League MVP while playing for the losing team in the Super Bowl.
win the MVP* while playing for the losing team
I didn't even realize that was a possibility.
The Tyree catch was both a great play and a fluke. 95% of the time an effort like that would have failed -- incomplete or a sack, with interception a real possibility. But everything feel right.
I've seen great catches by Randy Moss that made me think "No one else can do that". The Tyree catch didn't make me thing that, and neither did the Manning throw. They made a maximum effort, thet gambled big, and they won.
Oddly, the Manning-haters haven't quieted down. They're just saying "The Pats couldn't even shut down The Lamest Quarterback Ever."
31: Tom Petty looked old, which probably is a result of being old. Also, I was unsurprised that he chose to the play the hits from the least interesting part of his career.
It was as though Fox said to themselves, "Let's get Tom Petty, and let's pay him a gazillion bucks to put everyone to sleep so that even if he moons the goddamn camera halfway through his set there won't be anyone who can say they were scandalized."
What was wrong with Tom Petty? He stood there and sang some of his big hits. No it wasn't exciting, but are they ever? I'm struggling to recall a halftime show that held my attention.
I don't know how "Even the Losers Get Lucky Sometimes" missed the playlist. Seems tailor-made to the occasion.
Or "Referee"
I approve of Petty generally, but yeah, kinda boring. Still, it wasn't the bullshit pageant of noise and vulgarity that is the archetype of the halftime show, so there's that.
How was the food?
Couldn't track down my friend with the great rub recipe, so I threw together some molasses-heavy teriyaki sauce with adobo sauce, balsamic vinegar, garlic and rosemary, and coated two racks of baby back pork ribs with that. Totally made up for the Pats' loss.
I really enjoyed the halftime show. Sure, not many people get really excited about Tom Petty. But given that the average halftime show hovers between "lousy" and "godawful", I think "mediocre" counts as a major triumph.
Kind of weird that they had Alicia Keys in the opening slot, though, especially given how well her album's doing.
Ah, and I just realized how the ball didn't pop off Tyree's helmet when he landed - the defender cushioned him. It was actually a pretty gentle landing.
it's sheer luck that Tyree didn't end up with a broken back. if that defender's leg didn't fall sideways as Tyree came down on it...
Petty was fine--that's about as good as a halftime show is going to get. Who were you hoping for, the King Brothers, Vampire Weekend?
43: Prince was okay. Tom Petty should have had a giant, inflatable Janet Jackson titty.
It's w-lfs-n's world and we're just living in it: the "football sucks" thread, a thread that devolved into a discussion of the commercials, and a thread that devolved into a discussion of Tom Petty.
I don't know what you're talking about, those people dancing on the field looked like they were having a great time.
I like Petty but he doesn't have much stage presence. I want someone who rawks more for a halftime show.
Tom Petty should have had a giant, inflatable Janet Jackson titty.
Did you see that HUGE phallic guitar in the intro?
I want someone who rawks more for a halftime show.
See, a GWAR halftime show would make people sit up and take notice.
Did you see that HUGE phallic guitar
Seeing my own huge phallus every day makes me tend not to notice things like that.
You see, apo's penis has frets, which is odd at first but helpful for hand placement. What you must bear in mind, however, is that the metal strings running the length of it are not for strumming. They are structural.
52: Totally. It appeared to be cut (as opposed to an uncut) guitar.
Best superbowl in ages, and I include in that the one where my team won. I knew hating beauty and excellence was going to pay off for me eventually.
I've seen quarterbacks scramble, but this wasn't a scramble, this was a game-ending sack-in-progress that to me, while I was watching it seemed like it didn't happen just because Eli thought "fuck this shit." It was almost like the Patriots thought they had him down and eased up, and then, fuck, look at that.
And 42 and 52 are right.
The Eagles "ran" a much better version of the same play a couple of years ago in a pre-season game. McNabb ran around in circles for 30 seconds before one of his receivers deigned to get open. It was Freddie Mitchell, "Fred Ex, he delivers" who made the catch.
That said, it was a total fluke. I thought the Patriots clearly outplayed the Giants in the second half. (I missed the first half when I was treed by someone chock-full of Federal Reserve conspiracy theories.)
The liberals hating beauty and excellent thing is totally true. I was a party of a self-described "Progressive" meetup group, and it was 100% people rooting against the Patriots.
The difference between near perfect losers and imperfect winners is excellent enough for me.
BTW, still unclear on how bandwagon-jumping is the sign of a noble nature. Drop me a note when you can explain.
48: Ogged, you like Vampire Weekend? Figures, honky.
Tom Petty looked old, which probably is a result of being old. Also, I was unsurprised that he chose to the play the hits from the least interesting part of his career.
Plus "American Girl", which was probably recorded before that dreadlockish guitar guy was born. I was happy to see that 4 out of 5 Heartbreakers were in their 50s like Petty, though. He's no Mark E. Smith.
Half-time was so incredibly dull that I found myself nodding off and got up to walk around, refresh the soda, etc.
That's when you switch the channel to the Puppy Bowl.
Ogged, you like Vampire Weekend?
Did I say that?
Boomer Esiason (he was doing the radio) gets credit for the best call. Just before the snap on the Burress touchdown he noted the one-on-one mismatch and said something like "This might be the game right here".
Petty was OK, I certainly didn't expect anything from him like either the necrophilia song or "now he's got nuthin', head in the oven". I was actually hoping he might have done one interesting cover to lessen the "most mainstreamish greatest hits" quality.
60, 40: Note especially Emerson's preference for liberal orothodoxy in 40.
Emerson would have it that Tyree's catch was the result of luck, not merit. No mention of Tyree's years of preparation for this moment. No discussion of the prodigious effort that it took, in the moment itself, to make this play happen. Just like a liberal, he ascribes excellence merely to the vagaries of fate, overlooking the role of individual excellence.
If I were mcmanus, I would also note that Emerson ominously exempts a Big Man from the normal rules, suggesting that Moss's success, such as it is, is the result of his own merit, rather than luck or the milieu in which he operates.
Americans can breathe easier now that the mis-named hegemon Patriots (from Massachusetts !), with their collectivist (or "team") ethic, were denied in their bid for dominance.
68: Esiason does that kind of thing all the time. I never understood the bad rap he gets as an announcer.
You people watch Prince do a half-time show and then watch Tom Petty nap in time to his own music and you think Petty was better? You are insane.
I want the GWAR half-time show. I want it so bad.
71b is too direct. They should dig up barry manilow to do a norwegian metal review.
I'm chiefly wondering why they chose Tom Petty in the first place. I mean, I've always liked the guy, but ... not really half-time material, is he, since the SuperBowl is all about spectacle.
'course I'm reading everything as politically inflected these days, and the choice of songs (which I seriously doubt was entirely up to Petty) seemed odd: American Girl, and um, I've forgotten now, but all pretty straight-up 'Merica 'n' Apple Pie. As vanilla as you could possibly be.
Well, I suppose it's the Boss' turn next.
Or perhaps the '85 Bears (RIP, Sweetness).
I want the GWAR half-time show. I want it so bad.
And where is GWAR from class????
That is right! Richmond!
Jizmak Da Gusha is a former classmate of mine.
Now I want some apple pie! THANKS LOADS, parsimon.
It is not sterile patriotism we have thank for dull halftime shows, but Janet Jackson.
And where is Tom Petty from? That's right: Gainesville, Florida, baby.
77: You think they weren't dull before?
And Tom Petty is old! Just like Heebie now!!!
Well, that particular one wasn't dull. My point, though, is that any amount of vanilla whatever has everything to do with the FCC.
You want to know what is good with vanilla? Chocolate!
But smoking does not. How are you doing?
69: Yes, to me the hundreds of hours Tyree has spent practicing the top-of-the-helmet catch, and the equally-many hours (starting from a very early age) that Peyton has spent playing tag and blindlt throwing balls as far as he can, are as nothing. Fate and chance rule all.
any amount of vanilla whatever has everything to do with the FCC
Yeah, but the FCC doesn't dictate that you have to go overboard. (I like Tom Petty, I do, but still think the choice was weird.)
Peyton
Apparently all Mannings look the same to you. Racist.
Thanks for asking. It's gone better. That yoga class on Saturday really had the opposite of desired effect. I hadn't been in 4 months and was hoping it would jump start a desire for health. 50 people in the class brought the temp up to 115 and eliminated nearly all available oxygen. While this sounds like a scenario that would prompt a person to care tenderly for her lungs, it made me so dejected with the misery of the class that I adopted a fuck it attitude. But I'm back on schedule today. So far.
Long answer.
I once gave up desserts for a year.
89:
You put an extra s in your sentence, heebie.
Good for you Sybil. Kick smokings ass today!
87: Well, Ronald Reagan did say `If you've seen one Manning, you've seen them all', didn't he?
Thanks, soupy!
I gave up dessert for a year? But I usually eat them by the handful. I reduced to eating desserts sequentially, for one year, because I've got stick-to-it-tiveness.
Still, it wasn't the bullshit pageant of noise and vulgarity that is the archetype of the halftime show, so there's that.
But isn't that the whole point of half-time shows? Without the bullshit, the noise, and the vulgarity, we might as well do something improving with the time spent watching.
I didn't see Petty's performance, but I can't imagine that there's anything he could do better than Prince (except, maybe, help Kevin Costner rebuild America).
I've been through desserts on a horse with no name.
In the desserts, you cant remember your name.
Without the bullshit, the noise, and the vulgarity,we might as well do something improving with the time spent watching.
You're talking about a game....
The King Brothers wouldn't work in a stadium noise like that is supposed to assault you viscerally in a way that can only be done in cramped, chaotic quarters.
Now GWAR could put on an appalling spectacle in a stadium. That would be fun.
We need to make this happen. Somebody put up an orange-titled post.
How long have GWAR been going at it? I remember seeing them in college. Have they gotten dumber?
I'm not sure the The King Brothers would fly, either.
How long have GWAR been going at it?
Since '85.
Yeah, I just saw their wikipedia page. Talk about line-up changes.
Sad to see that the chic who danced around with flaming torches isn't with them anymore.
You know who could do a half time show that wouldn't suck and still make it past FCC? The Flaming Lips. With bonus old enough.
From the wikipedia page of GWAR singer Slymenstra Hymen:
Most recently, she has formed a Los Angeles based interior and exterior home design company named Wrapped In Comfort.
I'm chiefly wondering why they chose Tom Petty in the first place
Very unlikely to flash his tits.
My son was arguing they should just bring back Janet and Justin. It would be sure to be lame and suck, but as he pointed out it would be the most closely watched halftime show ever.
I just watched the clip in the post for the first time, and I think 6 was unfair. Somehow I wasn't remembering how many hands were mauling Manning. I'm not exactly sure how he got out of there on his feet.
Yeah, I wasn't going to argue, because I don't watch all that much football, but I'll watch ten minutes or so fairly often. And that looked like some kind of trick, not ordinary dodging.
110: but it's not as if Manning has super-human strength or anything. He was alert and mobile and also clearly didn't fold when touched, which is a good sign (and that's not sarcasm), but equally-clearly he must not have been mauled as badly as it looks on the replay. The defenders grabbing at him just never got a good grip for whatever reason--pushed off balance, or just missed, or something. I'd still maintain that the catch was still a much lower-probability event than the throw.