Re: Polls predict unprecedented Obama landslide.

1

I'm not a big message-on-a-shirt person, but I've been planning to get an Obama shirt to wear in Germany this summer.


Posted by: Blume | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 7:07 AM
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What the link doesn't address is what they thought of Hillary vs. McCain. Of course there's plenty of sexism there, maybe more, but what I'm getting at is the way people from other countries seem baffled by Obama's emergence, that it just can't be that the best candidate can come from relative obscurity this fast.

I've noticed this even among Canadians; despite or maybe because of living in a social democracy, their sense of orderly progression is appalled by the idea of somebody so new, so outside becoming president. Clinton seemed more familiar more natural to them, despite her unconventional path to power.

This despite the fact that this year will be the first in fifty years where a member of the national legislature will be elected president, an occurrence more parliamentary-like then what they usually get to see from us.


Posted by: I don't pay | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 7:07 AM
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Actually, now that I think about it, I may get extras to give as gifts to my German friends.


Posted by: | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 7:07 AM
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Blume wants people to stare at her chest?


Posted by: Will | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 7:11 AM
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4: it's definitely worth it.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 7:12 AM
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Everyone stares at everyone in Germany.


Posted by: Blume | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 7:12 AM
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re:6

It's just the monocles make it look that way.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 7:15 AM
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1: Remember they run small!


Posted by: Cala | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 7:15 AM
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McCain is going to publicize this heavily. Obama will probably be forced to publicly disavow France.


Posted by: PGD | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 7:21 AM
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Yeah, I remembered your Obooba story and was planning on getting a medium. That should be big enough, right?


Posted by: Blume | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 7:21 AM
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How frightened should you be if your thoughts exactly track a NY Times pundit ? Who isn't Paul Krugman?


Posted by: PGD | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 7:23 AM
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4: Shoulders, Will. It's unseemly to talk about ladies' chests.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 7:24 AM
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2 -- As if being governor of a place like Arkansas is any kind of preparation for the presidency, or introduction to the national spotlight.


Posted by: Nápi | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 7:27 AM
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Shoulders, Will.

Yeah, I'm totally gonna get the strapless t-shirt.


Posted by: Blume | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 7:27 AM
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13: Of course, that's just the sort of thing that frightens them. Who are these guys?

We can see he's just as qualified as our usual suspects—well, many of us think so, anyway—but this seems incredible to people from other countries.


Posted by: I don't pay | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 7:31 AM
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re: 2

Where are you getting this sense of people being surprised or frightened? Or are you just making stuff up?


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 7:33 AM
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Yeah, I remembered your Obooba story and was planning on getting a medium. That should be big enough, right?

I usually buy smalls, like 4 or 6 on top (34C, long waist), but with my Obama t-shirt, I figured I'd be conservative and get a medium. IT IS TOO SMALL. Achtung and Buyer Beware.


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 7:34 AM
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10: I ordered a small, and felt the medium would have sufficed.

Come to think of it, I guess it's not so much that they run small as that the tshirts haven't been vanity sized.

13: Cynically, the advantage to being governor is being able to say 'x years of leadership' without the corresponding 'x years of national voting records in which the candidate showed herself to be against mom and apple pie.'


Posted by: Cala | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 7:34 AM
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15: I'm a person from another country, and I have no idea what you are talking about.


Posted by: Nakku | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 7:34 AM
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16: Damn your Scottish hide, McPwn!


Posted by: Nakku | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 7:35 AM
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re: 19

Yeah, ditto.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 7:35 AM
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Hah. I'm totally doing the cackling pwn-dance right now.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 7:36 AM
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The shirts do run really short in the midriff, too. Well, given the Oboobma phenomenon it's hard to say, but if you're long torsoed, you might want to go a bit longer.


Posted by: Cala | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 7:37 AM
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Come to think of it, I guess it's not so much that they run small as that the tshirts haven't been vanity sized.

More whirly-eyed optimism.


Posted by: SomeCallMeTim | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 7:43 AM
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My personal experience is with Canadians, and I may be exaggerating the significance of what I read here and there from other countries that seems to echo the Canadians I'm in contact with. They have a palpable sense of vertigo, despite being familiar with American media and sharing much of the culture, that he could come on so fast. You hear that "should have waited till '12, not his turn, jumped the line" stuff here of course, but I'm getting tired of hearing such cluelessness from Canadians.


Posted by: I don't pay | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 7:44 AM
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My experience with Canadians is mostly with Canadians who are living and working the U.S. or married to me, and I have to say I haven't found the same reaction as IDP has. Classmates and friends seem to react to Obama pretty much like American grad students do; shivbunny knows I'm supporting him and thinks it's a moot point 'cause he'll get shot; and his employers figure that since to their mind there's no pro-oil candidate running anyway, maybe it'll be good for Canada to elect a Democrat.


Posted by: Cala | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 7:49 AM
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No hostility to him among the people I'm referring to, just a kind of surprise. And these are not "high-information" people, who seem to be clued-in everywhere. Generic preference for a Democrat is a given.


Posted by: I don't pay | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 7:54 AM
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25: Huh. Well, this story is about how the Europeans like him (and he seems pretty popular here in Australia among those who bother to pay any attention - though the belief that he'll get shot anyway is pretty widespread). I certainly haven't heard anyone worry about him coming up from nowhere. Especially since non-Americans aren't going to know about his background anyway, and couldn't give a rat's arse about him 'waiting his turn'.


Posted by: Nakku | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 7:54 AM
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Especially since non-Americans aren't going to know about his background anyway, and couldn't give a rat's arse about him 'waiting his turn'.

Low-info Canadians may be in a special position, thinking they should know more than they do. I've often thought of them as a kind of Far-North Appalachian anyway, certainly in certain cultural aspects; maybe this is one more datum.


Posted by: I don't pay | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 8:00 AM
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I don't like the sound of these 'low-info Canadians'. What can be done about them?


Posted by: Nakku | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 8:02 AM
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I'm disappointed that Obama is trying to get those crucial eyeballs for his advertising by forcing women to flaunt their poitrines while wearing his name. This strategy will backfire as women choose not to wear the shirts at all.


Posted by: Ardent reader | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 8:03 AM
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Data:

Current head of UK's Liberal Democrats - 41 years old, only been a member of parliament for 3 years.

Current head of Conservative Party - 42 years old, been a member of parliament for less than 7 years.

It's fair to say we're not exactly stunned into silence by Obama's level of experience (or lack thereof).


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 8:04 AM
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The British way of doing things seems to make sense. I wondered why the opposition party installed a leader (Irritable Duncan Syndrome) and then didn't even wait until they lost an election under his leadership before replacing him. Well, he was unpopular and weird-looking. Why should a more promising leader have to wait his turn until after IDS lost an election?


Posted by: Ardent reader | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 8:06 AM
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This strategy will backfire as women choose not to wear the shirts at all.

Well, all the women's shirts in M are backordered right now, so someone is choosing to wear them. Or at least order them.


Posted by: Blume | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 8:10 AM
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All the men's shirts in the size I want are back-ordered, too. Stupid groundswell of support!


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 8:12 AM
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The Oboobma shirts, with their patented design, provide such a groundswell of support that you don't even need a bra. Wear one every day -- that's a couple fewer loads of laundry every year.


Posted by: Obama For America | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 8:13 AM
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2: I don't know which Canadians IDP is talking to either; old guard Tory stalwarts perhaps? Even Canucks in a redneck burg like mine are mostly cautiously optimistic at the prospect of having a non-moron running the big country next door.

Guy Saperstein, on a hot streak having predicted Clinton's non-inevitability, now predicts Obama in a walk. (Someone, of course, will attempt to shoot him or blow him up or something, everyone should take that as a given.)


Posted by: DS | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 8:19 AM
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I was highly entertained yesterday when I hung out with my Egyptian cousin who's in town for business. He professed to me that he was sure Obama was going to win the election. But then, he was confused about the American political system and I was explaining the primary vs. the general. And he said "so who's the other guy now?"

"John McCain."

"Who?"

"He's a senator from Arizona."

"Huh. I never heard of him."

It's really been kind of awesome how it's been really all about the Democrats this year.


Posted by: m. leblanc | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 8:24 AM
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This strategy will backfire as women choose not to wear the shirts at all.

In certain demographics, Obama will benefit if he gets credit for women choosing not to wear shirts at all.


Posted by: politicalfootball | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 8:25 AM
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The first conversation I had with a stranger in Germany this summer was about Obama. An old and apparently unemployed chess enthusiast interrupted my game to go on a twenty minute explanation of why I should be voting for Obama (health care! transit! global warming! the war!; he might have even used the phrase "would turn America into Europe"), despite my saying that I had already done so.

He then offered to walk me to the train station. (And I wasn't even wearing one of the shirts, Blume.)


Posted by: destroyer | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 8:32 AM
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I have a friend who moved from Argentina to go to Princeton for grad school in the fall of 2000. Of course, everyone was going around asking, "Are you voting for Gore or Nader? Gore or Nader?"

She told me that near the end of October she was asked a friend, "Who's this Bush guy? I thought it was between Gore and Nader."


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 8:39 AM
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32: Yes, but those are cute little boutique parties who don't expect to hold high office or anything.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 8:46 AM
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I'm not sure what my rural Canadian in-laws will think of Obama's candidacy. I've noticed they're kind of uncomfortable talking about race; a story of two American Southern truck drivers being floored by Canada's cold winters ('I've never seen anyone drive so fast towards the border') had a lot of apologetic language ('They were from Alabama, and black, not that I'm saying anything about that, but...')

I think they'll just be hoping he isn't Bush, mostly.


Posted by: Cala | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 8:51 AM
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Heebie is going to wear an Obooba shirt at her wedding.


Posted by: Will | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 8:53 AM
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It is kinda interesting. I think this comes from Europe etc having more parliamentary systems, stronger parties, and more obvious loyal opposition leaders. If America had a Parliamentary system, Obama wouldn't be the nominee. Clinton likely wouldn't be either, since I don't think Congressional Democrats would elect her. Harry Reid? Pelosi?


Posted by: bob mcmanus | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 8:54 AM
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One other thing I might say about this is that with a Parliamentary system we would be less likely to get these independent "stealth" candidates. Some here might find that troublesome, but I mean not much criticism.

If Obama really governs according to his public policy positions, which are in accord with 90% of his Party, just shoot me for boredom. Every President is more ambitious than that, and always has an additional or expanded agenda that he/she at best only hints at during the campaign(s) Bill Clinton may have mentioned health care, but not as radical as what we got. Bush & Iraq were maybe predictable, but he campagned on a humble foreign policy.

The surprises are what we are really voting for. One big difference from a Parliamentary democracy. A Parliamentary leader, AFAIK, can't deviate much from Party line, the members have more control. Except for Blair & Iraq, I suppose


Posted by: bob mcmanus | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 9:06 AM
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I've noticed they're kind of uncomfortable talking about race

Canadian racism is usually prefaced with the phrase, "I'm not racist, but..." My favourite recent example of this was a guy who told me candidly that he's not racist, but he sure is glad his local Tim Horton's is staffed by white kids.


Posted by: DS | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 9:06 AM
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47: look he just doesn't trust you with a Timbit.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 9:08 AM
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he sure is glad his local Tim Horton's is staffed by white kids

Did he tell you this after you cut your afro short or before?


Posted by: apostropher | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 9:08 AM
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47: Awesome. That reminds me of my favorite overheard quote ever, from a guy in BC: "I may be wrong a lot of the time, but not in my own mind, eh?"


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 9:12 AM
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46: If Obama really governs according to his public policy positions, which are in accord with 90% of his Party, just shoot me for boredom.

Why not shoot you for kicks? But it sure is nice to see you packing in the anti-Obama schtick now that the primaries are over.

A sitting PM in a Parliamentary system isn't likely to be unhorsed by his own party. If the opposition parties are strong enough, however, you can get things like votes of no confidence when the PM turns out to have done something egregious. Blair survived mostly intact because the opposition wasn't strong enough to challenge him in this fashion.


Posted by: DS | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 9:15 AM
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49: After, but there's still no way he could have been mistaking me for a white guy. It was just that sort of weird "hey, you're black and you're not a gangbanger, I'd love to share my real views on race with you" moment that certain sorts of people seem prone to.


Posted by: DS | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 9:18 AM
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50 is great.


Posted by: DS | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 9:18 AM
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I want to know more about Mangnay, the 34-year-old house husband.


Posted by: Counterfly | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 9:21 AM
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shivbunny once described his dad's weird brand of racism as, 'if he saw a black guy in the ditch (a common occurrence on rural roads), he'd definitely stop (since he has a huge truck), and tow the guy onto the highway and make sure he could get to town, but later, when describing it to everyone, he would probably say 'This n-- drove into the ditch today. Seemed like a nice guy and his car wasn't busted up too bad,eh.'

Personally, his rural area of Canada is so white I figure they have to import the stereotypes from the U.S.


Posted by: Cala | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 9:22 AM
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55: hey, maybe he said "neighbor".


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 9:22 AM
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I think this comes from Europe etc having more parliamentary systems, stronger parties, and more obvious loyal opposition leaders. If America had a Parliamentary system, Obama wouldn't be the nominee. Clinton likely wouldn't be either, since I don't think Congressional Democrats would elect her. Harry Reid? Pelosi?

The U.K. model, in which the leader of the parliamentary opposition leads the opposition party in the general election, is not entirely normative for Europe, either. The combination of parliamentary supremacy, single-member constituencies, weak federalism, and a symbolic head of state distinguishes the U.K. from other large European countries.

Where these conditions do not hold, the model looks different. Germany, for example, has strong federalism and double-ballot parliamentary elections, so its parties select candidates who are not members of parliament (state premiers have been especially popular in this role) and put them at the head of a party list. France has a strong presidency, so its presidential candidates are not necessarily members of parliament. Italy, under its new electoral system, has also moved away from the equation of leader of the parliamentary opposition and general election candidate.


Posted by: Knecht Ruprecht | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 9:24 AM
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Neighbor, please.


Posted by: Cala | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 9:24 AM
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54: Google only has one hit, and it's this post.


Posted by: apostropher | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 9:25 AM
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53: While I'm remembering, my favorite ever overheard conversation, from later the same trip, on a bus in Ontario:

Woman reading magazine: Hey, I have a riddle for you. "I have a mouth but do not eat, I have a bed but do not sleep. What am I?"
Her companion: Um, let me think... Oh. A tree.
WRM: Nope. A river.
HC: Well, I was close.
WRM: What do you mean, close? You said a tree.
HC: Yeah, you know, rivers and trees.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 9:30 AM
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Eh? Neighbour, surely?


Posted by: Nworb Werdna | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 9:31 AM
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61: homonyms without borders, man.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 9:33 AM
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Canadian racism is usually prefaced with the phrase, "I'm not racist, but..."

My favorite Canadian racism was trying to convince my students that late 18th century black methodist abolitionist writers weren't easily dismissable as having "adopted the white man's religion."


Posted by: bitchphd | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 9:34 AM
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50 that's the great quote and that's how i feel sometimes too
our parlamentary elections will be this June, i read my former coworker's name in the list of the hopefuls, thought how strange, all these politics are so close and real


Posted by: read | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 9:36 AM
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51:But it sure is nice to see you packing in the anti-Obama schtick now that the primaries are over.

Malicious misinterpretation unsupported by the text. But that's you.


Posted by: bob mcmanus | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 9:36 AM
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i


Posted by: read | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 9:40 AM
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Yes, the Obama logo and name is a more effective talisman for good vibes than the almost any other through the urban centers of the world. I'm sure it's going to replace the Canadian flag as the backpack accoutrement of choice for overly self-concious American college students overseas.

One of the new media staffers for the campaign vowed to shave the Obama logo into his hair if they won the primaries. He hasn't yet, because he's a wuss, but I maintain that doing so would lead to a lot of free drinks and better service.


Posted by: Po-Mo Polymath | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 9:41 AM
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I maintain that doing so would lead to a lot of free drinks spontaneous pickups and better service


Posted by: Knecht Ruprecht | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 9:45 AM
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50: Must have been an Easterner. "eh" isn't native there.


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 9:51 AM
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Nobody I know would prefer a Republican to a Democrat, although there are plenty of such people in Canada. But I think HRC's loss baffles them a little. They're as hopeful for a rational American government as anybody else, and better social services and everything. It's the nominating process that confuses them.


Posted by: I don't pay | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 9:56 AM
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re: 42

I don't think you'd make much money betting against the Conservatives at the next election.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 9:56 AM
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In any case, we have yet another thread emphasizing Obama's race, youth, outsider status, and charisma rather than policies. I will vote for him, but I do not have to feed into these advantageously divisive narratives.


Posted by: bob mcmanus | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 9:58 AM
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If the US President is "leader of the free world", the free world oughta get a vote on the matter! Now define free.


Posted by: W. Breeze | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 10:05 AM
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71: England is going to have a cute little boutique prime minister. Awwwwww....


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 10:06 AM
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74: so quaint and old world!


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 10:06 AM
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Old and new. Quasi-pseudo-sort-of-federalism now means there are several 'heid yins' depending where you live.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 10:12 AM
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1: I recommend the long-sleeved olive green one. It's quite fetching.


Posted by: Sir Kraab | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 10:13 AM
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Yeah, I know that I haven't followed British politics as closely as I should, but haven't the Conservatives been out of power since Wellington?


Posted by: Walt Someguy | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 10:13 AM
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In a post-racial society, anyone will be able to work in a donut shop.


Posted by: ari | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 10:15 AM
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re: 78

The party that has governed for over two-thirds of the past 100 years?


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 10:20 AM
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The Liberal Party?


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 10:21 AM
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Krugman seems unable to get over his general pissiness over Obama's win, but I think he's got a fairly astute (and quite hopeful) take on the current state-of-play in racial politics.


Posted by: politicalfootball | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 10:25 AM
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80: Wasn't that the Thatcher party? I'm so confused.


Posted by: Walt Someguy | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 10:27 AM
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The party that has governed for over two-thirds of the past 100 years?

I don't claim any particular expertise on UK politics, but FWIW, I always thought that Blair hewed so close to Bush (as he did to Clinton) because his grand project was to make New Labour the "natural party of government" in the UK. It was never about winning the next general election, or even the one after that, but about positioning New Labour to win 2/3 of the elections over the course of a century.

In my theory, Blair ascertained that there were certain positions that the natural party of government could not take, and certain positions that it must take. One of the latter was "reflexive support for US leadership in international affairs, no matter how matters look from a UK domestic political perspective".

The irony is that Blair probably read history correctly, and if the American president had been even slightly less crazed and incompetent than GWB, he would have succeeded. Instead, he has wrapped the albatross of Bush around New Labour, and even though Gordon Brown wasn't responsible for the policy, he will reap its fruits.


Posted by: Knecht Ruprecht | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 10:41 AM
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re: 84

Possibly. They've also tacked heavily to the authoritarian right on domestic law enforcement and civil liberties issues, which I suppose could be seen as part of a similar strategy.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 10:43 AM
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which I suppose could be seen as part of a similar strategy

A generic branding as "tough on crime" falls into the "positions that the natural party of government must take", in my theory. Although I think a fair bit of Jack Straw and Tony Blair's crime policy consisted of unforced errors (e.g. trying to limit the right to trial by jury). Wasn't really necessary for the desired branding, created backlash from Middle England, and was bad policy to boot.


Posted by: KR | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 10:46 AM
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Tough on hippies and ravers, too.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 10:50 AM
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My theory is that the idea that there is a "natural party of government", and a set of positions it can hold that will maintain consensus, is entirely wrong.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 10:50 AM
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I think they are sincere in their authoritarianism. I don't think it's a matter of branding [at least for the true believers within the party]. I have quite nasty 'class-warrior' views on all of this, mind.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 10:51 AM
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77: Hey, that's the one I have.


Posted by: Cala | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 10:52 AM
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Why the hell should I care what some Belgie thinks about who should be President of the US? First of all, Belgium is not even a country. Secondly, the dern ferners should mind their own business, cuz they will still hate us anyway. Putting a warm and fuzzy on it because they like the media image of one of the candidates seems a little, shall we say, shallow.


Posted by: Tassled Loafered Leech | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 10:53 AM
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No fair turning our attempts to troll ttaM into a serious political discussion.


Posted by: Walt Someguy | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 10:55 AM
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So, basically the Labor party has morphed into a copy of the Thatcher Tory party, leaving rational voters in the UK with no real options.

Is that right? UK commenters help me out.


Posted by: rob helpy-chalk | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 11:00 AM
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This does bring to mind the Guardian's infamous "Operation Clark County" from 2004.


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 11:01 AM
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re: 93

There are still some policy differences, but on law and order and national security issues the current Labour party is to the right, rather than left, of the Tories. Or at least to the right of the touchy-feely image the Tories are currently projecting.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 11:02 AM
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Putting a warm and fuzzy on it because they like the media image of one of the candidates

Maybe they're just collectively hoping for a "sucks less" option in 2009. It's not like the shortcomings of the current administration haven't caused some of them grief too. If the US operated in a vacuum, I'm sure they wouldn't care at all. That said, I'm not really sure what the point of such a poll is either.


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 11:05 AM
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||

Kind of on-topic, since he ran against Obama for the Senate:

I've been trying to find the video of Alan Keyes jumping into Michael Moore's mosh pit in 2000, but all the youtube clips I've run across have been taken down. Anyone got a link?

|>


Posted by: Tom Scudder | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 11:08 AM
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95: So who does someone like you vote for? The Tories? A smaller party? Do you stay home?


Posted by: rob helpy-chalk | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 11:13 AM
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98: Obama, duh.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 11:15 AM
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96.Outside of of few expats nobody in the US knows or cares about elections in Europe, not only because it's not on the TV so it doesn't matter, but also because it doesn't matter. You might find some interest in who will be President of Russia or China, but there's no voting for them, either, even if you're Russian or Chinese. The weak dollar is doing more to embarrass the trustafarians backpacking through Europe, fake Canadian flag or no. What's the second verse of "O Canada", eh? It is a little disingenuous to whine about US defense spending, then look to the US to provide airlift to the hotspots of the world for the Rapid Reaction Force.


Posted by: Tassled Loafered Leech | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 11:18 AM
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re: 98

A lot of people seem to be voting Lib Dem, some stick with Labour because their local constituency MP is good [there are still quite a few of them], in Scotland there's the nationalist option and the smaller socialist/green parties.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 11:22 AM
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I am interested in any election involving Yulia Tymoshenko. Segolene Royal was a washout, though, being of terrorist stock.

Go on, TLL. The US is doing lots of wrong things but not doing the right things. It's consistent to object to both.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 11:25 AM
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It is a little disingenuous to whine about US defense spending, then look to the US to provide airlift to the hotspots of the world for the Rapid Reaction Force.

Are you claiming that Canada wines about US defense spending? IME, generally speaking not at all (they like the contracts). Or rather, much like the US itself, those individuals who oppose the spending a) probably don't support those missions anyway, and b) aren't complaining about airlift capability.

but also because it doesn't matter I

In some sense this is obviously falst, but a more local sense this is true. It's not that it doesn't matter, it's that they can't see how it directly matters to them. This is becoming less true as EU power relative to US is shifting, but it's still true. Which was basically what i said --- people in europe only give a rats ass about who is sitting in the oval office in proportion to their perception of how likely that person is to fuck them over (or to a lesser degree, help them out). Which isn't crazy. Why the interest in such a poll here, I don't know.


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 11:27 AM
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Yulia's even lovelier daughter marries skanky Brit.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 11:27 AM
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even lovelier daughter

Man, the last two pictures on that page.


Posted by: apostropher | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 11:30 AM
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You're not nobody, Mr. Emerson. And certainly, people whine everyday about even important matters, not just the trivial. But I'll be surprised if the Europeans still like President Obama after six months in office. It is the American public he works fro, afterall.


Posted by: Tassled Loafered Leech | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 11:31 AM
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I was so stunned by the skanky bridegroom that I didn't get that far. He looks like an Eagles reject.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 11:32 AM
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It is the American public he works fro, afterall.

Freud's watching you, TLL.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 11:32 AM
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he works fro

Racist.


Posted by: apostropher | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 11:32 AM
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I am selling Obama fro picks. Get 'em while they last.


Posted by: Tassled Loafered Leech | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 11:34 AM
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If Yulia had a good PR man Ukrainian elections would be big time here. It's a shame the Ukraine gave up their nukes. Yulia could put some oomph behind feminism.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 11:34 AM
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Canadians don't whine about defense spending, just about how they send their guys to Afghanistan to clean up our mess and then our guys accidentally kill them.

More seriously, the U.S. is big and powerful, and who's in charge here can have an impact on how their life goes there (e.g., Canadian cattle ranchers), just because we're big and have a lot of money.


Posted by: Cala | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 11:34 AM
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112: and play dirty.


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 11:35 AM
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There were stories in 2000 about Europeans not being happy with the outcome, weren't there?


Posted by: eb | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 11:37 AM
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The Canadians do whine about their own defense spending. With all the talk about Iraq breaking the US Army, operations in Afghanistan has "broken" Canada's. On the one hand, it is very sad, given their proud tradition. On the other, it's like like the Ruskies are poised to come over the pole anytime soon.


Posted by: Tassled Loafered Leech | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 11:39 AM
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like the Ruskies are poised to come over the pole anytime soon

They're coming under it, yo.


Posted by: apostropher | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 11:41 AM
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Their troops are tied up in Afghanistan at the very moment when the Danes are threatening the Fatherland. Hans Island may fall without resistance.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 11:41 AM
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Every 1.3 square kilometer of the Fatherland is precious, and must be defended to the last drop of Canadian blood.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 11:44 AM
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There ya go. Defense spending is always wasted until you need it.


Posted by: Tassled Loafered Leech | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 11:45 AM
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Back in the day, the Danes pillaged England, Ireland, and France, but they're going to find a tougher customer in Canada. But not immediately.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 11:48 AM
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Rasputin is back from the grave yet again! After seducing the president of Ukraine, he will get to work on Preved Medvedev!


Posted by: Ardent reader | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 11:48 AM
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Every 1.3 square kilometer of the Fatherland is precious, and must be defended to the last drop of Canadian blood.

Are you still prepping for your interview with Citizenship and Immigration Canada, John? I told you I'd give you some crib notes.


Posted by: Mary Catherine | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 12:19 PM
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The two hardest questions for me are "How old are you" and "What kind of work do you do?"


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 12:48 PM
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Couldn't you just crib from Oscar Wilde? I'm sure the wit of the loveable irishman has been pleasing Customs officials worldwide for the last century.


Posted by: Walt Someguy | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 1:00 PM
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"Belgians are rooting for Obama because, let's face it, the guy knows what he's talking about, especially compared to Bush," says Stéphane Mangnay, a 34-year-old house husband in Villers-la-Ville.

Wow, could you have found a gayer quotee? That'll really win over those NASCAR chad-hangers: A 'house husband' named Stephanie whose name sounds like Man-Gay thinks he's tres smart!

This is gonna be such an uphill climb...


Posted by: Rottin' in Denmark | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 3:56 PM
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This is gonna be such an uphill climb...

To win over the crucial Belgian NASCAR dad demographic?


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 8:20 PM
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This is gonna be such an uphill climb...

Don't sweat it. It's gonna be a fucking romp, the most enjoyable landslide since 1964. Damn. I barely remember 1964, the rest of you have never really experienced Democrats kicking and stomping and laughing at the whimpering whipped dogs of Republicans. Prepare to party. For a year.

Obama Is Talking About Oil

He's pretty smart, especially to read the comment threads of Unfogged, where I recommended this just yesterday. If Obama & Democrats keep this up on top of all the other issues and advantages, you may see 300 Dems in the house and 65 Senators.


Posted by: bob mcmanus | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 8:47 PM
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Saw a piece today where the Republican goal for the year is to hold onto 41 seats. If the dems can get to 59 plus Lieberman—I'm counting Sanders among the Dems—it may make sense to stay cordial with Lieberman, who might vote with them on issues not involving the Middle East.


Posted by: I don't pay | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 8:57 PM
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I'm with Bob on this one. The polls now mean nothing. There was a poll in June of '88 that had Dukakis up by 18 points, for example. By October we'll be wondering why we ever thought it would be close.


Posted by: Walt Someguy | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 8:58 PM
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if these trends continue...


Posted by: CN | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 8:59 PM
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65: On reflection, the earlier remark was an injustice. I'm ssss.... I'm very very ssssssss..... I'll keep working on it.

110: Oh! Oh!

I think you should target Qwest Love with this promotion. Once he's wearing an Obama fro pick, even people without fros will be wearing them.


Posted by: DS | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 9:12 PM
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The W is actually a U.

As a matter of fact, the Q is actually a ?.


Posted by: CN | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 9:25 PM
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132: no, no. He was talking about the adorable cartoon mascot for the baby bell.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 9:27 PM
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the Q is actually a ?.

I know, but really, fuck that.


Posted by: DS | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 9:38 PM
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He should do Jennifer 8. Lee one better, and write articles under the name Ahmir ?. Thompson.


Posted by: CN | Link to this comment | 06- 9-08 9:44 PM
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