Re: Arar

1

Maybe Bush needs a few people under threat in the justice system in order to have an excuse to pardon everybody.


Posted by: bob mcmanus | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 1:33 PM
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It's certainly unusual. My cynical guess is that we are in for a "not that a democrat is in charge, here are some sweeping limintations on presidiental power." type of decision.


Posted by: Asteele | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 1:34 PM
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If by "unnecessary", you mean "informative".


Posted by: ben w-lfs-n | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 1:34 PM
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If only we had other, more commonly used words that expressed the same content! Alas.


Posted by: FL | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 1:37 PM
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w/r/t the sua sponte part, I didn't even know courts could do that. If I were on the federal judiciary, I'd act mea sponte all the goddam time, and Girard be damned!


Posted by: ben w-lfs-n | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 1:37 PM
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Everyone should have enough Latin to understand "sua sponte".


Posted by: ben w-lfs-n | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 1:38 PM
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By contrast, French can suck it.


Posted by: ben w-lfs-n | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 1:38 PM
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Ben, you're going to remain a callow youth until about 65, aren't you?


Posted by: FL | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 1:40 PM
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Neither "sua" not "sponte" are the sort of Latin word that we learn from knowing SAT words.

I think "sua" means "pig", because "Sus" is the genus that pigs are in. And sponte must give rise to spontaneous. Unexpected pig?


Posted by: CN | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 1:40 PM
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Very interesting. Hopefully the dissenting judge was really pissed off & convinced enough others to join him, though that's far from guaranteeed. I wouldn't really care if limits on these powers get imposed "now that a Democrat is in charge," not that I think that's what's going on. There are a fair # of Clinton appointees in the Second Circuit--then again, the two judges who wrote the initial, atrocious decisions in this case were Clinton appointees.


Posted by: Katherine | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 1:41 PM
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En banc: because sometimes, two languages just aren't enough.


Posted by: Matt F | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 1:45 PM
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If I were on the federal judiciary, I'd act mea sponte all the goddam time, and Girard be damned!

I feel certain you sponte quite enough, W-lfs-n.


Posted by: SomeCallMeTim | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 1:45 PM
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9 - "sponte" means bridge, like in the song "sua sponte Avignon"


Posted by: togolosh | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 1:48 PM
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This is about a civil case for monetary damages, right? Would a pardon make any difference?


Posted by: bob mcmanus | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 1:50 PM
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Unaccountably, in the Second Circuit, they call in "in banc." As can be seen from the Order.

Among active judges, 5 are GWB appointees, 6 are WJC appointees, and 1 is a GHWB appointee.


Posted by: Nápi | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 1:52 PM
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I think "sua" means "pig", because "Sus" is the genus that pigs are in

So does "Woo pig! Sooie!" have its origins in Latin? That'd be cool. Does the U of Arkansas have a strong classics department?


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 1:53 PM
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And Judge McLaughlin, another GHWB appointee, gets to decide whether he wants to sit in banc.


Posted by: Nápi | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 1:56 PM
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the U of A is strong in every department.


Posted by: Michael | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 1:56 PM
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gets to decide whether he wants to sit in banc.

I'm so not understanding this post/comments. Why wouldn't he sit in a chair?


Posted by: Michael | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 1:57 PM
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Neither "sua" not "sponte" are the sort of Latin word that we learn from knowing SAT words.

Spontaneity?


Posted by: oudemia | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 2:07 PM
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One of my friends in HS was told by his priest that "Sooie" when speaking to a pig is in fact Latin. Or maybe Greek.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 2:09 PM
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21: The Greek is "sus" -- so, plausible!


Posted by: oudemia | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 2:17 PM
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Know what's fun? Looking at the bios of the judges on the Second Circuit. The chief judge, for example, was a lecturer in the English department at Queens College.


Posted by: Nápi | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 2:18 PM
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Actually, pig in Latin is "sus" and Greek is "hus".

Sus (swine, boar):
singular

nom.: sus
gen.: suis
dat.: sui
acc.: suem
abl.: sue
voc.: sus

This judge news is good news. Lawyers cannot comment at work though.


Posted by: peter | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 2:43 PM
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So you would say "O sus!" in an ode to a pig?


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 3:19 PM
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Ben, you're going to remain a callow youth until about 65, aren't you?

Paradoxical!


Posted by: ben w-lfs-n | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 3:19 PM
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So you're saying is more like a callow gaffer then?


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 3:20 PM
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24: Two forms. Sus, suos or hus, huos.


Posted by: oudemia | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 3:31 PM
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So you would say "O sus!" in an ode to a pig?

You would.

One of my favorite Greek inscriptions is in fact a sort of ode to a pig, a funerary monument to (apparently*) a dearly departed pet; it begins, "Here lies young Pig, four-legged friend to everyone..."

*There's actually some controversy, if you can call it that, over whether this was indeed dedicated to an animal, or to a young man nicknamed 'Pig', who, um, spent a lot of time on four legs.


Posted by: potchkeh | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 3:35 PM
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29: Interesting! Especially since "Pig" is slang for . . . ladybits, in Greek.


Posted by: oudemia | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 3:38 PM
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30: and he spent a lot of time on four.... hey, whoah!


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 3:45 PM
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good to see the mineshaft returning to it's roots.


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 3:46 PM
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At my URL is my research on smutty etymologies.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 3:50 PM
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--


Posted by: | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 4:13 PM
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The ToS has, if anything, gone downhill during his hiatus. I don't remember the antisemitisim.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 4:33 PM
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Ben, Ben, Ben - without French, we'd have no voir dire, no venire, no oyer and terminer, no parol, no petit/grand jury... we'd have to say all of those things in Latin. Or Finnish. Or Javanese.


Posted by: DominEditrix | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 4:42 PM
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its


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 4:44 PM
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You know what they say, though, DE: Use latin when the french for a thing doesn't exist.


Posted by: ben w-lfs-n | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 5:34 PM
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FOAD, ToS.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 6:38 PM
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Everyone knows hosers surrender their rights at the border. This is a frivolous suit and will be dismissed ipso facto.


Posted by: bjk | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 8:14 PM
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The Arkansas shooting is turning out disappointingly. The guy had all the marks of a lone wacko who snapped. He was a gun collector and his motive is unknown, though he did specifically target his victim. No sign of ideology or religion so far.

Of course, that's what they want us to believe.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 8:33 PM
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41: well if are looking for something to make your blood boil than John, try this Scott Horton interview with Same Seder on some of the Siegelman-like DOJ prosecutions.


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 08-14-08 9:15 PM
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we'd have to say all of those things in Latin.

Like "venire". The fact that much of English law is transacted in an extinct provincial dialect of mediaeval French is far more wonderful than if it were in Latin. Latin is so commonplace.


Posted by: OneFatEnglishman | Link to this comment | 08-15-08 1:06 AM
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My contact points for outrage have been burned out for a long time by now, but it still amazes people that the Siegelman prosecution isn't a bigger deal than it is. It was the kind of railroading that you expect in the worst third world countries, or in fascist or communist dictatorships, and it almost certainly started in the White House.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 08-15-08 8:31 AM
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44: Yeah, that one's really, really weird. I think a lot of what's going on is a kneejerk assumption that where there's smoke there's fire -- that the prosecution, even if flawed, must have meant that there was something there.

The Jersey senator, Melendez? I can't recall the name, who was being investigated around the time of the 2006 election, is similar. Again, there didn't seem to be anything to it at all except an attempt to use a political prosecution to swing an election.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 08-15-08 8:42 AM
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Is the French legalese from the all conquering Normans, before they became cheese eating surrender monkeys?


Posted by: Tassled Loafered Leech | Link to this comment | 08-15-08 2:10 PM
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but it still amazes people that the Siegelman prosecution isn't a bigger deal than it is.

Perhaps this has just become what many people expect from the Justice Department these days. Burned out on outrage, and over time, acceptance.


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 08-15-08 2:14 PM
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46: Oui.


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 08-15-08 2:17 PM
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