Alas, my vaguely salacious plan involves being at a conference out of town until late on the 21st!
I am possibly around! And a couple blocks away.
I don't think it can be a salacious plan the way you wrote it. Maybe you meant "at a conference" "out of town" until "late" on the 21st?
You're welcome. Happy to help.
2: Goddamn it, oud! :-(
I demand a special meetup!
We never did that!! I'm sitting here dissertating with all my clothes on and no webcam!
In 6 short comments, you've destroyed both alameida's dreams and KR's. When will it ever be enough for you?
and no webcam
That ASCII art isn't going to create itself, AWB. Let's get cracking already.
When a friend of mine introduced me to the Web, lo these many years ago, the very first thing he showed me was an ASCII art nude chick. But I think ASCII art will never again reach the heights of textmode quake.
6: But we really wanted to see your books!
All I see is books. I would take pics but it is too depressing that this is my life.
I have a great idea for a trendy webcomic. "Admiral Ackbar and Jeff Davis".
My wife has "It's a frap" as the background image on her computer.
I bet "Admiral Ackbar and Jeff Foxworthy" would be pretty excruciating to watch.
so, oudemia and i are meeting, that seems good. chime in, motherclownfuckers in NYC. sorry we'll be missing AWB, though.
Has there been a black and white house update?
17: If it's just me and alameida, it will have to be conducted in anapests or something.
When a friend of mine introduced me to the Web, lo these many years ago, the very first thing he showed me was an ASCII art nude chick.
Lemme guess... Meriday in the Morning?
But it is also true that I may well be in NJ or OH, so I will have to figure out my schedule.
I'm around and can hie myself to 90th and Park or wherever, postponing my salacious plans until later in the evening. Saturday would be better than Sunday, I'd say.
"Oudemia and alameida" is iambic.
I generally have a hard time getting out on weekends, but if a venue gets picked, I'll try to pry myself from the bosom of my family.
25: I'll try to pry myself from the bosom of my family
In Soviet Russia, family pries itself from bosom of you!
We never have Bay Area meetups, unless you count me having breakfast with Josh or lunch with Otto or drinks with Ben. But all one-on-one hangouts, not a party. They're never in the same room at once. I am convinced that they are all the same person.I ALMOST met Ogged, but then he totally bailed. I am convinced that he is not a real person, and merely Wolfson trolling.
I wish I was going to NYC! I really enjoyed hanging out with AWB and Bave. Have fun, alameida! Eat a pierogi for me! I had never had one before. Why did I heretofore lead such an impoverished life? And where can you get pierogies in the Bay Area?
What ever happened to the sanctity of off-blog communication? Everybody here is wonderful, but the truth is that increasingly frequent references to private meetups and private email conversations is off-putting.
Belle-Lettre, I'm not harping on you in particular, not at all, but this trend is becoming really weird, and people are dropping out as this place seems to become more and more of a private club. If that's what it becomes, that's fine, of course. I would, myself, ask for a bit more of a return to that ol' sanctity of off-blog communication thing.
The mere fact that you communicated with someone does not constitute a violation of the sanctity of off-blog communication.
Also, are not meetups as old as the bloggy hills?
The mere fact that you communicated with someone
Mentioning that fact, even, to forestall little-bitchery!
Some people are just understandably sensitive about that time the Apostropher went to Baltimore. VERY sensitive.
Redfox wants to forestall criticism of her frequent meet-ups with Snarkout. Why wasn't the whole blog invited, we ask?
I'm not sure that's legal in Ohio, Megan.
28: Ooops, sorry parsimon. I didn't think about that. Certainly, that would add to the in-groupism sense of the blog. I certainly haven't been participating long (nor as deeply recently, due to work) and I wouldn't consider myself a part of the the "private club." I recall reading some threads from years back, in which commenters (even/esp. Ogged!) would refer to private emails and hangouts, and so I guess I thought it's all fair game. I seem to miss all of the threads on Unfogged etiquette. Apologies if I step on toes! I've always felt welcome here, but goodness knows I don't want to contribute to in-groupism.
I was looking up the rock climbing thread from a couple years back, since I just went rock climbing yesterday. I read in the comments the origin of || and |> to denote an off-topic comment. I had just been copying that because I figured it was some stylistic thing, and only yesterday found out that it had to do with pause and play and a pic B sent Ogged of PK. I swear, I miss everything.
35: As I said, not talking to you specifically. Yeah, there's a history here of referring to private exchanges -- ogged and B had a joking thing about it. I will say that ogged protected the very fact of private communication carefully. But he doesn't set the terms of exchange here any more, being gone (PBUH), so that's not really relevant. It is, yes, just really about in-groupism and the effect it has. It's up to the blog at large.
Somewhat geographically on-topic, I note that Roy Edroso is moving from New York to a "small town in Texas". I like this comment of his, And that it's the only place in the country that gives New York serious competition for the most self-regarding jurisdiction on earth ... , which I can appreciate.
I'm around this weekend, but have out-of-town guests to monitor. So please keep me in the proverbial loop, but I make no guarrantees.
...this all assumes I make it back to NYC, as my train has been sitting stationary on the tracks outside of Metropark for the past hour now.
OT: Anyone know what the origin of "have it in spades" is? The question at the moment is whether it has any connection to the racist use of spade.
39: I love that half of the ads at Metropark are for Pakistani cricketers and Bollywood stars.
40: Your friends have clearly never played Bridge.
OT: Anyone know what the origin of "have it in spades" is? The question at the moment is whether it has any connection to the racist use of spade.
According to the OED, it's because spades is the highest suit in bridge. So: not racist.
More to 40: oudemia (or other students of Greek), does this sound right to you?
To call a spade a spade, which means, ironically for this discussion, 'to speak plainly and bluntly; to speak without euphemisms', is first found in Ancient Greece. The exact origin is uncertain; the playwright Menander, in a fragment, said "I call a fig a fig, a spade a spade," but Lucian attributes the phrase to Aristophanes. Later, Plutarch notes that "The Macedonians are a rude and clownish people who call a spade a spade." (It is worth noting that the Greek word translated as "spade" seems actually to mean something like "bowl" or "trough"; the "spade" may be based on a Renaissance mistranslation. In this case the original expression was "to call a bowl a bowl," and thus the "spade" expression is "only" 500, rather than 2,500, years old.)
43: That's what Random House says, but I trust the OED much more. Thanks.
44: That doesn't set off any "no way!" alarms and seems consistent with how folks talk in new comedy. I'd have to dig up line numbers to be sure.
I could stop by this weekend. I haven't met any of you before, though, and I bet I can't just head toward the geeky group like most blog meet-ups.
What ever happened to the sanctity of off-blog communication? Everybody here is wonderful, but the truth is that increasingly frequent references to private meetups and private email conversations is off-putting.
Really? I find it comforting.
We never have Bay Area meetups, unless you count me having breakfast with Josh or lunch with Otto or drinks with Ben.
Which makes me realize that I haven't seen comments from Otto in quite a while. I hope this is a good thing.
Anyone know any good bars on the UES or somewhere else accessible?
Also, are not meetups as old as the bloggy hills?
Yet older.
54: Or just anywhere maybe 6 train adjacent? I mean, one of my very favorite bars is on the UES, but it is 1. tiny and 2. expensive, but bigger places tend to be frattier. I will think on't.
Special interborough travel advisory for this weekend. No C, the A is skipping Fulton/Broadway-Nassau, no 4 in Brooklyn or downtown M'hattan, and I think the 5 doesn't operate in Brooklyn on weekends at all. This means Brooklyn - UES travel will be somewhat of a pain. Inflicting this on visitors seems a bit cruel, so definitely Manhattan.
The Subway Inn is technically UES and definitely not expensive (nor is it particularly hygienic, of course, but you get what you pay for).
I think 6-adjacent but non-UES is probably the best option.
Someplace in the Union Square area? Very easy to get to from the UES and the BQNR all go there from Brooklyn.
People have been fleeing this blog for a long time. I doubt mentions of meetings has much do with it, given that such mentions were part of the busier days.
Anyway, I fully expect there to not be a meetup in the Bay Area this summer while I'm there. (I've said this before and will probably say it again.)
Old commenters leave, new commenters show up, same as it ever was. I really don't think there's been any increase in the rate of defection; if anything the opposite, in that there seem to be more regular commenters now than back in the day, or at the very least not less.
And I definitely don't think commenters mentioning that they've seen each other in real life (on a thread devoted to a meet-up, no less) has anything to do with it, nor has it ever been deprecated here. As rfts said, sanctity of off-blog communication is about the contents of that communication, not the fact that it happens.
Shorter: I don't think Belle has violated any Unfogged rules of etiquette.
40: I'm sure it's cards, but I have a vague belief that it's not bridge, but some game I don't play with a complicated scoring system. I want the full phrase to be 'in cards and spades', where each of 'cards' and 'spades' means something for the final score. But googling suggests that I have the phrase slightly wrong -- there are only five hits, and only one is someone using it the way I want to.
Be the folk etymology you want to be in the world, LB.
Here's my phrase -- the card game is casino. But on looking at the definition, I think I was wrong and 'in spades' as an intensifier is bridge.
Keep trying, LB. I'm sure you'll hone in on the correct etymology sooner or later.
As rfts said, sanctity of off-blog communication is about the contents of that communication, not the fact that it happens.
Nobody likes an argument from etymology, so I won't make one, but in its original usage it referred precisely to the fact that it happens. The idea was to maintain the polite fiction that we were all one, big, happy clique conducting our business in public on the blog, rather than an umbrella group of sub-cliques conducting a material portion of our business in private.
Nobody likes an argument from etymology, but everybody likes etymology.
67: That's not what you told me in e-mail.
66: I am enraged to the point of speechlessness. Luckily, I can still type.
67: The concern is a valid one. OTOH, I remember worrying about it, and commenting about my worries, three years ago or so.
But more seriously, I've been around since it started being brought up as a rule here, and that's never how I understood it. Not that that means anything other than being a data point.
44: a little late, but yes, the phrase is "τὰ σῦκα σῦκα, τὴν σκάφην σκάφην λέγει", and the quoted description gets it right (including the point that the word doesn't actually mean "spade"). Lucian also has Herakles saying "άγροικός ειμι, την σκάφην σκάφην λέγων" ("I'm a simple man, I call a bowl a bowl"). Don't know if there's any basis for connecting it to the English expression.
Let's all just agree to start using "to call a mole a mole" instead.
67, 72, 73: Actually, I think M/tch is right about the phrase, "the sanctity of off-blog communication" -- that it really was Ogged being controlling about not wanting people to quote him from emails on the blog, while not worrying about concealing the fact that emails were happening. But I think SB is right about the longstanding concern that online communities get stagnant and unwelcoming when they turn into a place where people talk more than occasionally about their RL interactions, rather than places where the action is online.
On the somewhat obvious point that "calling a spade a spade" was not originally a racist expression (which is a different question from whether it can cause offence nowadays), I always heard it as "Call a spade a spade and not a bloody shovel".
I've heard many unsubtle dog whistles from racists in my time, but 'bloody shovel', not.
I am enspeeched to the point of ragelessness, but I agree with 76. This place is at odds with my IRL persona so I have frequent worries about the three Unfoggedtarians who are my facebook "friends".
But I think SB is right about the longstanding concern that online communities get stagnant and unwelcoming when they turn into a place where people talk more than occasionally about their RL interactions, rather than places where the action is online.
I'll go along with that, but I don't think anything on this thread is excessive in the RL interactions department.
This place is at odds with my IRL persona
You've said that before, and I've been curious about what would surprise your RL friends. In RL you're a heavily tattooed bouncer at a biker bar?
And maybe I'm just thick, but I haven't noticed any recent significant uptick in references to off-blog interactions, nor any increase in the dropout rate.
In real life he's completely scrutable.
I am enspeeched to the point of ragelessness
A feather in your cap, Ned.
To repeat, however, something M/tch says above: This is a *post* about meeting up IRL! Surely it cannot be untoward or contrary to the spirit of Unfogged to discuss the topic of the OP? Oh wait . . .
Whatever happened to the sanctity of only insulting other commenters, never praising them?
82: Recent, I'm not sure, but there are certainly oldtimers who haven't been around in the last year or two. I miss SCMT, Cala, Emerson, I hate making lists like this because I'm terrible at remembering everyone but just because I don't list someone doesn't mean they're not missed.
Is this the wrong thread in which to invite Natilo to send me an email? Every time I land at MSP, I remember that - want to have a communication with him, but then I forget before getting it initiated.
74: The LSJ says yes, and even calls "τὴν σκάφην σκάφην λέγειν" a proverb.
Is this the wrong thread in which to invite Natilo to send me an email? Every time I land at MSP, I remember that - want to have a communication with him, but then I forget before getting it initiated.
87: Oh, I'm certainly not denying that people drop out. And I miss the folks you mentioned too, not to mention soupbiscuit, Armsmasher, Joe Drymala, Matt Weiner, Clownaesthesiologist, stras, Adam Kotsko, Ogged, Fontana, Bob, Unf, and on and on.
I just meant dropouts are nothing new around here. Magic Johnson set the trend long long ago. And I don't see the claimed correlation with references to offblog interaction. That might be the reason for some of the departed, I don't know, but people drop out for all kinds of reasons.
And 91 was only a sampling of the gone and missed, not a comprehensive list.
frequent worries about the three Unfoggedtarians who are my facebook "friends"
I'll try not to shame you, Ned.
I only communicate with Blume on unfogged, not to worry.
I think 94 is constructively pwnd by 33.com.
And normally I'd just say that to Sifu's face and not here, but . . . .
I can neither confirm nor deny the existence of a fabulous rejoinder to the implication in 95 which was delivered through a different communications channel.
The lurkers support me in semaphore.
CharleyCarp, if you're not friends with him on FB but remember his real name, you can connect with him via my friends list (provided you can remember my real name).
-.. .- -- -- .. - / -.-. .... --- .--. .--. . .-.
...- .. --- .-.. .- - .. -. --. / - .... . / ... .- -. -.-. - .. - -.-- / --- ..-. / -- --- .-. ... . / -.-. --- -.. . / -.- --- -... . / .--- --- -.- . ...
101: -.- --- -... . / -.. --- - / -.-. --- --
(And now my plane, so I'll be dark for a few hours more).
I'll be dark for a few hours more
...laydeez.
. .-.. . .--. .... .- -. - ... / .. -. / ... - .-. .- .-- / .... .- - ... / - .... .-. . . / -- .. .-.. . ... / --- ..-. ..-.
I'm not sure it really adds much value dot org.
Nobody likes an argument from etymology, but everybody likes etymology.
FACT, i.e., something done.
How come neb's comment doesn't appear in the sidebar?
But seriously, it's much much funnier in spoken communication. You can trust me.net.
"CharleyCarp, if you're not friends with him on FB but remember his real name, you can connect with him via my friends list (provided you can remember my real name)." s/b "Kobe.net!"
99: Should be "old school.arpa."
You can trust me.net
Redirects to: you can trust me.org
Is this Unfogged's way of telling me that everyone is friends IRL with Diablo Cody but me?
I am surprisingly ok with that.
'Allo.gov!
'Allo yourself.co.uk!
I'm sure this would be much funnier in spoken communication.
A store named 1-800 luggage.com used to exist. The domain is abandoned now.
In spoken communication, the funniness goes to 11.com.
As a relative new comer, I would have to say that knowing people already knew each other and were in communication was quite nice; working out the links between people off-site (because yes, such things do matter, and are going to happen in any community) is made much easier when there are references to off-blog communication. I would be far warier if a fiction was maintained that none of us knew each other off-blog, and then had it revealed to me at some later date. I'm pretty sure there's no way you could maintain such an illusion forever, and if it comes late to one person they're just going to feel like more of an outsider.
People exist offline?
In unrelated news, I believe that I have linked the flippanter e-mail address to my FB account, for the stalkers in the audience who wish to be disappointed by my rare and irrelevant updates.
132: I just tried, flip! No dice! Or maybe you have me pre-emptively blocked?
Facebook status update that just landed in my Live Feed from somebody I've never met in person, but who knows my wife: "Black Cock is phenomenal, and they're playing several more times during SXSW. I definitely recommend seeing them if you can."
I started to type the comment you'd expect, and then remembered, "Oh wait, I don't actually know this person..."
the comment you'd expect
From apo? So, what, a link no one at work should click on?
It would have started by quoting "Black Cock is phenomenal".
Black Cock may be phenomenal, but they've got nothing on Black Mole.
105: Did you defriend me, Carp? I just went to FB message you with Natilo's name, and you're not in my friends list any more. You dick!
Was it your wife who recommended Black Cock to this person?
||
I think I may be in love with Judge Frank Roesch. He's the dude that told DWR that they have to have a real take permit to run the pumps, not a stack of binders from other reports that DWR pretends is a take permit.
Today he told Pleasanton that they have to take their fair share of housing, and must change their zoning to densify. It gives me hope that Jerry Brown filed with the plaintiffs, on the basis that "Pleasanton's housing limits added to urban sprawl and led to increased vehicle use, air pollution and greenhouse gas emissions." Perhaps he'll be a green governor after all.
If you google Judge Roesch, you see some Christian-types complaining about him, so I like him for whatever that was too.
Judge Roesch is going on my boyfriend list.
|>
||
I'm thinking this, from last December, is what the Christian-types were complaining about:
Judge: Only 'Bigots' Would Pull Their Kids Out of LGBT Education Programs|>
I like him for whatever that was too
Probably this.
Yep. Great minds Black cock, and all that.
That's just what I was thinking about!
127: Life is so much easier when you have the social intelligence of a cactus. It's simply not possible for me to track other people's interconnections, so I don't worry about it. I have a hard enough time keeping individual people straight in my head. I tend to assume that if I recognize the name that means I like them. Only if there's some outstanding incident or attribute do I recall specifics. In other words if you want me to remember you, punch me in the face while screaming your name.
*punches togolosh in the face while screaming "M/tch M/lls"*
In other words if you want me to remember you, punch me in the face while screaming your name.
Actually, this is the approved Unfogged protocol.
He's the dude that told DWR that they have to have a real take permit to run the pumps
What pumps does Design Within Reach run?
151: That is an impressive memory of the archives.
153: It's more that that's just a classic, classic thread.
OK, now I think that the flippanter e-mail links properly to my FB account.
Based on my last experience being punched in the mouth, I don't recommend it.
It's the Department of Waterways and Runnels, Josh.
153: It's an ancient Chinese secret.
155: You're not the first one who has noticed.
153: It's more that that's just a classic, classic thread.
I like that a classic thread could be under 25 comments. In ancient times, quality was so much more concentrated.
160: That was a long thread for its time. I still remember the first few times a thread hit three digits. It was a big deal back then.
♪ We'd sing and dance forever and a day ♪
162: "sing and dance" should be "cry, cry, masturbate, and cry"
OK, now I think that the flippanter e-mail links properly to my FB account.
I searched for it via the "Search for People" field, but still no dice. I will email you my real name so that you can add if you like. I enjoy rare and irrelevant updates. The irrelevanter the better, I always say.
Which makes me realize that I haven't seen comments from Otto in quite a while. I hope this is a good thing.
Yeah, y'all got leechblocked from the work machine about a month ago. Which is a sign of love! And also a sign that I really do think it's about time that I finished my data analysis. I get 5 min/hr to divide between Facebook, Bloglines, and here. Since it seems to be easier to get such bite-sized interactions out of FB than here, much of my procrastination efforts have gone that way lately.
But yes, there has been another factor at play. A female factor. I've been spending time with a girl. Enough time, in fact, that the details feel too personal to blab about on in the comment sections of obscure blogs. So, there's that. We'll see where it goes. Pessimism springs eternal.
YAY!!! Otto and a girl person! I approve!
Felicitations, Otto! Here's to hoping there's no software limiting you both to only the occasional Bisquickie.
Sigh. You guys are totally going to spoil things with these "congratulations" and this "expression of excitement". It all still feels somewhat tentative. Have y'all noticed that I'm kind of insecure and neurotic? Because I am.
My bad, shug. It is probably nothing, in a pleasant sort of way, for the time being.
Dude, busting out the tildes. It must be a special occasion!
Did this thread ever determine a place for the meetup before veering into discussing whether meetups were contrary to the Bloggeist?
172: I think it got as far as 6-train adjacent, with someone suggesting the vicinity of Union Square.
Jesus, I know of nothing around that area.
Still, you must go there and spread the Word.
Bloggeist
Tomorrow, I have to give a presentation as part of the group - in many ways, I'd rather just have a one person lecture, since it's pretty much just a lecture - and it appears that I'm going to have to say Überlieferungs/bildung.
174: Yeah, I think that's why it got no further. Either tiny fancy bars (Hi, Bar Jamon!) or enormous tourist bars (No thanks, Heartland Brewery!). But someone else can surely think of something nearish.
Where did this girl go to high school?
||
So just now, looking at our favorite dating site, I see a woman writing about killing herself. I sent her a message with a bunch of links to suicide prevention resources. Here's hoping she was either being overly dramatic or looks at one of the links I sent here.
|>
178: Not with you. The person you are thinking of and I are "just friends".
Can we move it up the 6 to the Murray Hill or down to the Chinatown neighborhoods? Not that I know anywhere in particular to go around there, either, but they seem like more likely bets.
No, my child. Your remit is among the Lurs in distant Assyria.
Just occupy the second-to-last car on a 6 train. All night long. There will be plenty of lurkers.
Can we move it up the 6 to the Murray Hill or down to the Chinatown neighborhoods?
I'm fine with either of those neighborhoods, if anyone has ideas, though I think down is a better bet than up. I didn't suggest Union Square but plausible bars I can think of near there would be Flatiron Lounge (fancy), 119 (divey), or Rye House (whiskey-ey).
I vote cheap, quiet, and accessible. I also vote against serving a mission in Lorestan.
I really should have chosen a better pseud, shouldn't I?
Hooray for Otto and his "female factor"!
I thought the only reason to go near Union Square was the Strand. Mmm, books.
I really should have chosen a better pseud, shouldn't I?
Why? Are you under the impression that you're the only Josh on the internet?
ok I just googled "Josh" and I see a little special google feature "Results from people in your social circle for josh - BETA - My social circle - My social content" with an old post from EotAW.
wtf, google? I do not want this!
191: It was more the nagging sense that no one reads my comments.
Google knows what you want better than you do. How could it not? It's spent more time analyzing your preferences than you have.
Oh, I thought you were afraid that the woman you tried to talk down might trace you here or something.
That thought had occurred to me, actually, but what I wrote was sufficiently vague that I'm not terribly concerned about it.
165: May your pessimism prove exaggerated and needless.
179: Which site is our favorite dating site again? I forget.
And that was incredibly nice and decent of you. It's really hard to know how to react to something like that; I might have just succumb to feeling helpless to do anything. But it reminds me of something I read or heard on the radio once. I can't remember if it was about suicide generally or specifically about people who commit suicide by jumping off the Bay Bridge, but there was someone who did kill themselves by jumping off the Bay Bridge and the note they left, or maybe their last journal entry, said something along the lines of "I'm heading off to jump now. If even one person smiles at me on the way there, I'll turn around and come back."
165: Allow me to be the first to jinx and doom your budding relationship by wishing you best of luck.
165: Enough time, in fact, that the details feel too personal to blab about on in the comment sections of obscure blogs
Sure, but what's stopping you from doing it here?
We could go to that bar in the 30s where we've gotten together to watch election returns. It's kind of a crummy bar, though. The Ginger Man is nicer, but I don't know what the Saturday crowd is like.
119 looks good. Or we could try Whiskey Tavern in Chinatown (I haven't been).
177: The very first NYC Unfogged meetup was at Old Town Bar and Grill on 18th -- I haven't been in a decade, but it must still be open. Or Pete's Tavern for the O Henryness of it all.
I was thrown out of Pete's Tavern when I was sixteen for making fun of a plate of hot antipasto. Well, and being drunk and underage while I was doing it.
Was the antipasto friends with the bouncer or something? Or is there a regulation against hurting food's feelings in Manhattan?
I think the management objected to the manner in which my friend and I were making fun of the antipasto. (That is, if we hadn't been helpless with laughter for no good reason, they probably wouldn't have figured out how drunk we were. As it was, they figured we were not adding to the ambiance of their establishment.)
198: This article. (Golden Gate Bridge, not Bay Bridge. Nobody jumps off the Bay Bridge, 'cause there's no pedestrian access.) And yeah, that suicide note was exactly what I had in mind.
Incredibly decent of you, Josh. I hope she's ok.
Otto: low five. Exclamation point free, tentative and half-hearted felicitations.
207: The part of that article that most strongly affected my thinking about suicide was this:
A familiar argument against a barrier is that thwarted jumpers will simply go elsewhere. In 1953, a bridge supervisor named Mervin Lewis rejected an early proposal for a barrier by saying it was preferable that suicides jump into the Bay than dive off a building "and maybe kill somebody else." (It's a public-safety issue.) Although this belief makes intuitive sense, it is demonstrably untrue. Dr. Seiden's study, "Where Are They Now?," published in 1978, followed up on five hundred and fifteen people who were prevented from attempting suicide at the bridge between 1937 and 1971. After, on average, more than twenty-six years, ninety-four per cent of the would-be suicides were either still alive or had died of natural causes. "The findings confirm previous observations that suicidal behavior is crisis-oriented and acute in nature," Seiden concluded; if you can get a suicidal person through his crisis--Seiden put the high-risk period at ninety days--chances are extremely good that he won't kill himself later.
Thinking about that also inspired me to track down an old post at respectful of otters which says something similar, even in the case of people with chronic pain or incurable illness.
[P]roponents of Physician Assisted Suicide (PAS) have successfully created the impression that there's a bright line of distinction between (1) crazy people, who want to commit suicide because they're depressed, irrational, and impulsive; and (2) incurably ill people, who want to commit suicide for rational reasons. . . . But there's nothing exceptional about the suicidal wishes of people with incurable illnesses. The desire to die is associated with depression, hopelessness, feeling unsupported, and seeing oneself as a burden with nothing of value left to offer the world. That's true for both the physically ill and the physically well. And these symptoms respond to treatment, for the physically ill and the physically well alike.
So I think you were very clearly doing the right thing.
So I think you were very clearly doing the right thing.
Also, it's a smart move approaching the suicidal on dating web sites - you can count on them for low expectations.
207: Oh yeah, the Golden Gate bridge. Duh. (That's what I was thinking of, I don't know why I called it the Bay Bridge).
And that's not the article I was thinking of, but it contains a lot of the same material. I'm pretty sure it must have been a radio program I heard.
I can never post from my phone so I don't know if this will go through, but I'm perfectly happy with any manhattan destination. I was going to say LES but it's not actually 6-adjacent.
I can never post from my phone so I don't know if this will go through, but I'm perfectly happy with any manhattan destination. I was going to say LES but it's not actually 6-adjacent.
Wow, rocking the double-post! I'm fired up.
Whiskey Tavern looks interesting, and is right near the Canal Street 6 (and everything else) stop:
http://nymag.com/listings/bar/whiskey-tavern/
Whiskey Tavern looks promising, is just a few doors up the street from good Thai food, and, most important, represents a concrete and specific plan, which we don't currently have. I say we do it. Time? I guess day, also; I'm assuming this is Saturday, but don't know if that was ever confirmed.
Sounds good to me. Saturday and 8? I'll re-post in a bit.
Sounds fine and is also reachable by the Q for those of us coming from Brooklyn.
