I see Details thinks to use an em dash where an en dash belongs. Hasn't anyone ever told them that for some applications, shorter really is sweeter?
Details is for the twentysomething guy, isn't it? More or less everything the Details set do is so they can tell their friends they did it.
some guys request it on the first date
!!!
none of the guys interviewed said they liked to do it because it was fun or felt good
Sample bias, definitely.
This is just another barrier that GA is breaching. Free your mind....
It looks like in "Albert" we have a new candidate for Douche of the Decade. Something that he doesn't even enjoy, and yet if the woman won't do it it's a dealbreaker because it signifies that she won't be demeaned pointlessly at his whim.
I do wonder if the kind of guy who reads Details also has to act like he didn't really enjoy anal sex, b/c he might be Teh Gay if he did ... leaving aside the 80% of Details readers who *are* gay.
The woman (well, "woman's pelvis") in that picture is not lying in a position for comfortable anal sex. And the phallic train is aiming to penetrate her vagina.
I think the train will actually be derailed by the taint.
I read that article and now I'm wondering if I'm way underestimating the percentage of the population who are psychopaths. Or Details is just fucking with me.
A lot of sex is always about the meaning of sex. We have sex because it's sexy and we like to feel sexy, not just of the raw pleasure.
But Details seems particularly plugged in to the asshole demographic, in every way.
The last time I bitched about a Details article, people told me that only gay men read it.
Describing anal sex, a friend once said to me, "You know, there are places I'd rather be."
Couldn't agree more.
Whoops, pwned by 8. Was it Becks who had a post calling the Bush adminstration the 'Painful Anal Sex' administration, by analogy to precisely this sort of idiot?
11: Well, come on, it's like 3 or 4 guys? Where did they find them, anyway? Bragging on the internet about their anal adventures?
Not that you aren't underestimating the psychopath population, tho I think maybe "sociopath" is what you're going for there.
I'm wondering if I'm way underestimating the percentage of the population who are psychopaths.
A significant proportion of young men (say, under 28) are all but monsters. I can't believe you don't remember this.
Here it is, although it's just a link to a Julian Sanchez post.
A friend who I'd never otherwise suspected had a sadistic or misogynistic bone in his body once surprised me by confession, of his penchant for buggery, "You know, the truth is, I kind of like anal sex more because she doesn't."
The cutesy euphemisms in that article are vying with genocide for top spot on the list of Worst Things Evar.
17: What happens when they turn 28?
It sounds like they just want the feeling of intimacy of being trusting with each other.
"I'll never forget it," he says. "She went down on me immediately, in the kitchen, then came up and said, 'I want you to fuck me in the ass.' That's some porno shit that most guys dream about." And when he told his friends about it later, he brought down the house.
Ah, see, they're amateurs: it doesn't count if she likes it.
18, don't go spoiling the anal for me with unpleasant George W. Bush associations, okay?
Don't pwn me, LB, it doesn't feel good.
23: you think George W. Bush doesn't associate with assholes?
17: What happens when they turn 28?
Friends get jobs that take them away and they feel less comfortable with their monster-ness. (That age was just a place to put a flag.)
I'm wondering if I'm way underestimating the percentage of the population who are psychopaths. Or Details is just fucking with me.
Both, almost certainly.
Or Details is just fucking with me.
Only because you don't like it, though.
I think we should turn this up to 11, and start demanding anal everywhere. Ask your barista for anal, get a side of anal at dinner, get a little anal if you're waiting in line somewhere.
19 gets it right. The worst thing about that article isn't the guys profiled; it's phrases like "a ride in the back seat."
I find it hard to believe that almost 2/3 of people haven't tried anal. Surely that's an underreporting error, right?
I mean, is this really different from a meal seeming more special because the other person spent hours making it?
29: Dude, you won't even let people you know lick your face.
I mean, is this really different from a meal seeming more special because the other person spent hours making it?
Yes?
3:
I had a guy request it the second time i slept with him. I was offended and said no. It was one of the reasons I broke up with him.
There were few moments more awkward than when my friend, in our New Testament class, asked our old conservative teacher, if anal sodomy was biblical if it was with your wife.
My point is, i bet anal is pretty rare in bible belt.
I kind of enjoyed "backstage pass." It would make a fun southern rap anthem.
(I think it feels pretty damn good myself.)
Except with the young, 'i'm having anal to save my virginity for marriage' crowd.
That's only because you're taking it from Master Labs, Joe. Not everyone is so lucky.
It looks like "backstage pass" has only been used to mean anal sex once in rap lyrics.
It looks like "backstage pass" has only been used to mean anal sex once in rap lyrics.
My course of action seems clear.
A lady doesn't do anal until the third date.
She's the one you're glad you found.
She's your shipoopi.
30 -- a casual glance suggests that "take the service elevator" is far, far lamer than the admittedly execrable "a ride in the back seat".
Shipoopi! Shipoopi!
Third time you'll irrumate.
Shipoopi! Shipoopi!
Best not to hesitate.
oh christ, now he's quoting catullus. and buddy hackett.
37: In the rabbinic tradition, anal sex with one's wife is totally kosher. I assume that the New Testament authors would have embraced this. For instance, both Leviticus and Paul think of sex primarily in terms of pleasure, rather than just procreation.
It's only the Platonic element in later Christianity that makes them uptight about "wasting sperm" and, thereby, "sodomy" broadly conceived. (Due to my CTS education, I know ALL ABOUT sex practices in the ancient world.)
you mean plato in the dialogue where socrates refutes onan?
I would guess that Becks is correct. It is more about being able to tell your buddies that you convinced a girl to do it.
I'm also guessing that the twenty-somethings here are better informed on this topic than me.
Sunnis don't allow anal, but Shiites do. Seriously.
I think everyone could have guessed that, Teo.
51: Wow. That is some crazy Shiite right there.
Total sample bias. If you're a het couple doing anal and you BOTH don't like it, you're doing it wrong.
Obviously, guys who read Details are douchebags. But then again, I can't imagine someone asking for anal sex, any more than someone asking for any other position in bed. I think anal should be taken off its pedestal by being universalized. It's not a status symbol; it's just another position. That'll teach these sadistic fuckers!
Vidia Naipaul wrote a book about Argentina, "The Return of Eva Peron", I think, in which he claimed that all Argentine discussions between men about sex needed to have the phrase "And I fucked her in the arse" in them if the man was to persuade his buddies that he had really had the girl. There, too, her distaste and humiliation was part of the attraction.
I'll bite. AWB: Why is it enjoyable for the girl?
I think anal should be taken off its pedestal by being universalized. It's not a status symbol; it's just another position. That'll teach these sadistic fuckers!
Maybe *this* is why you're single, Keyser Soze.
57: I dunno. Explain why anything is fun in bed. Depends how you do it.
55 implies the existence of some other method of communicating in bed that I'm not previously aware of.
48: I thought that it was the Aristotelian function line (via Aquinas) that would make sodomy impermissible. The good of procreation and the acts that are harmonious with it, and so on.
56 -- thank you, thank you! I have referenced that essay many times in various discussions without ever being able to remember what it was or who had written it.
Teo, one of my favorite lines, from a short story the name of which I've forgotten, is "It is true that I too have to pee, but for entirely different reasons."
I can't imagine someone asking for anal sex
Better than just blithely assuming your partner would be into it, surely.
(I seem to remember it referring specifically to sex with prostitutes.)
As for why anal is pleasurable for a woman, someone once posted a long explanation here, but I can't find it now.
I can't imagine someone asking for anal sex
Oh come on. You don't think the guy that reportedly said, "can I put it in your butt" sounds plausibly smooth-talking?
67: Because there are nerve endings in your butt, too.
I wouldn't have sex with someone in the first place if I thought he wasn't interested in us both having a good time. That's pretty hard to find if you're a college student doing mean douchebags who read Details. But I'm glad I'm older, comfortable with a lot more things than I used to be, and pretty good at telling who are the people who don't want to hurt me physically. It makes granting general sexual consent a lot easier.
If ear canals were bigger, and a guy put his cock in another guy's ear, would that be gay? Something to ponder.
Also, anal is absolutely zero fun if either one of you is tense. So if you're all nervous about it, it will be horrible. If you're not nervous, it's pretty fun.
Who among us has not had cocks in their ears?
65 etc.
So are we assuming equivalence for statements or questions starting:
"Will you give/let me..."
"I want to..."
"Do you like ... ?"
The comments on this article suggest an emphasis on what someone did to a woman, not what someone did with a woman. DM mentioned upthread that being asked for anal sex on a second time was a problem. Would it be the same if it had only been asking if she liked it? What about in the context of a more general `what do you like' exploration (which is pretty natural when you haven't slept together much. For that matter I've had conversations like that with people I haven't slept with yet.
69: that, and the indirect stimulation of other bits apparently works well for some....
Part 2: Reasons to enjoy receiving anal sex. (Part 1 here)
1) The asshole is an erogenous zone. This is true even for people not blessed with prostate glands. There are lots of nerve endings there, and stimulation of the area feels good. I'm a woman, so I can't speak to what men experience receiving, but the feeling of deep penetration is also physically pleasurable and I wouldn't be surprised if it got at the g-spot from the other direction.) Many women touch their assholes, use butt plugs, etc. when masturbating.
2) it's a little taboo
3) the feeling that you are able to make every part of your body available to your partner. Pride in your ability to take him or her in.
4) intimacy arising from the trust necessary to perform an act whose potential to feel painful or invasive is so great
5) your partner likes giving it/you get sympathetic pleasure from the association with how it feels to be the penetrator, either with a penis, if you have one, or with fingers, etc.
6) the idea of someone being inside your entrails is really hot. It feels deeper, perhaps, than other forms of penetration. Related to 3.
7) it symbolizes violence or degradation to you and you're into that sort of thing.
8) physical and emotional pleasure associated with the release of tension in an area of the body you hold clenched all the time. Sort of like the pleasure of yoga or other deep stretching.
9) Related to 8, release of shame associated with shit/farting, and other bodily functions. Perhaps even release of some stored negative emotion around potty training, or reexperiencing positive emotion surrounding it, or something. (I should have included something like this in the Part 1, The Joy of Giving, too.)
When I was the age of details readers, I had a lot of anal sex, but the only reason I was doing it was that a few of my friends who seemed really sexually experienced bragged about doing it, so I figured it must be good. I didn't brag about it myself; I just wanted to feel more like the confident raconteurs who regaled the party with tales of buttsex.
After a while, I realized that there wasn't anything special about it for me, so I decided to lay off.
Even the gay men who read Details are total douchebags.
I realize now that "from the other direction" doesn't make sense. Through a barrier, maybe.
The Ethical Werewolf has already explored some of the associated philosophical issues
80: so it's like Maxim, but more gay friendly?
When I first read the blog entry, for some reason I assumed the article was about guys who took it up the ass from their girlfriends in the name of reciprocity.
I am sorely disappointed that was not the case.
I find it hard to believe that almost 2/3 of people haven't tried anal. Surely that's an underreporting error, right?
Let's ratchet up the status competition ... I find it hard to believe that almost 2/3 of people haven't tried _________.
83: I'd respond but every time I try to use "like" and "Maxim" in the same thought I go blank.
I am fairly astonished that the idea that there are both men and women who enjoy anal sex, in both roles is not universally believed. Of course there are! Get out there are live a little, people!
It would figure that with all the valuable content blocked from this workplace, this linked picture would not be. Think that's an HO- or N- gauge model locomotive? Car Body, F Series. Still the iconic look of a train, even though they haven't been built in nearly half a century.
71: Only if they touch balls.
So if you're all nervous about it, it will be horrible. If you're not nervous, it's pretty fun.
Alcohol is pretty essential. Orally, not topically.
I am sorely disappointed that was not the case.
That would have been a much better article. Particularly for the quotes from girlfriends who confessed they didn't much enjoy pegging their boys, but did love telling each other about it.
Let's ratchet up the status competition ... I find it hard to believe that almost 2/3 of people haven't tried _________.
...a capital case?
83: understandable .... but I only meant it in the sense of being a useful predictor of douchebaggery.
yoyo: I'll bet it depends on the generation. There is a belief that it is difficult to 'defile the marriage bed', so anything goes, as long as it is with love. This goes for OS and it is heavily debated in terms of AS. Responders to the Details survey would likely strike out because of motivation.
Let's ratchet up the status competition ... I find it hard to believe that almost 2/3 of people haven't tried _________.
Or you could just take this quiz. (It appeared in mailboxes one day my freshman year, and by afternoon it seemed as though everyone on campus were comparing scores.)
...and all posting activity ceases as everyone pauses to tally up their scores.
Does licking count as asking?
Alcohol is pretty essential. Orally, not topically.
Nonsense.
B is right. Topically works just as well, if you have a turkey baster handy.
98: Gotta strongly advise you against that.
97: I defer to B's experience.
The link in 82 is awesome, by the way.
96: In the same sense that kissing counts as asking "will you fuck me?"
101: For real??? *This* I gotta hear.
95: bah --- who hasn't done most of the things on that list?
Further to 63: Who'd a thunk it, Google result #2 (AOTW) for "The Return of Eva Peron", is a short review written by yours truly! Result #1 is just great.
Okay, okay, not me personally. But it's an old punk rock trick to ingest your Meister Brau the other way around, because the alcohol gets absorbed faster, and you get drunker. We used to have a running joke about port and a turkey baster.
I should mention that the up-the-butt technique also works swimmingly with E. Again, second-hand, but not very; I wish I did not know this to be true, but I do.
There's even slang for it!
Some of us just can't get our shit together to push our own boundaries like that, Soubz.
106.1---Surely snorting it would be easier?
108: snorting beer? This is not easy, no.
106: the eye is maybe faster for anything liquid. Can't say it makes much sense for alcohol, though.
There is a belief that it is difficult to 'defile the marriage bed', so anything goes, as long as it is with love
Yea deedes of matrimonie are pure and spirituall ... and whatsoever is done within the lawes of God though it be wrought by the body, as the wipings of shoes and such like, howsoever grosse they appeare outwardly, yet they are sanctified.(William Perkins)
Marital love is a thing pure as light, sacred as a temple, lasting as the world(Jeremy Taylor). And for the general point, remember that "The homeliest service that we doe in an honest calling, though it be but to plow, ... if done in obeidence, and conscience of God's Commandement, is crowned with an ample reward; ... God loveth adverbs; and cares not how good, but how well." (Joseph Hall)
104 -- Apparently, that quiz is still printed every year in the student handbook. It's become an entrance exam of sorts.
In the same sense that kissing counts as asking "will you fuck me?"
Well, yeahhh .... I thought about that when I kissed a married woman (me being unmarried at the time) ... once she'd done that, there wasn't a whole lot of reason not to go all the way. Which turned out to be how *she* looked at it, too.
106: I would *think* that would sting, really bad. But maybe that's part of the punk-rock thing.
Still, I think I'll continue to enjoy my Lagavulin orally, wuss that I am.
God loveth adverbs? Are there any sources to back up God's smiling upon the pedants among us?
78 misses the key thing for me, which I might as well share. Anal sex is so very much more sensitive than vaginal, which is only really sensitive in a few key places, that it's the only way to feel every inch of a cock as it moves inside you. It's a very extreme feeling, because you can't even really take in all the sense information you're getting from it unless he does it really really slowly (awesome), in which case it feels like his cock is about nine miles long. It is way overstimulating for both partners, physically as well as whatever else, and can result in a sort of overclocked, heart racing and lungs gasping feeling.
Hence, some people hate it. Plus, because it's so hypersensitive, it has a lot of potential to hurt if both partners don't know pretty well how to do it. Talk to friends and get their advice. Certain positions are much better than others when you're first trying it.
107: hmmm. I meant that a lot of it seemed pretty mainstream to me. Maybe not for 18 year olds entering college --- but still. If you dropped off all the unusual stuff, there was a majority left, I thought. I guess this assumes the reader has spent at least a little time seriously messing about with drugs, too. I sometimes forget this often isn't the case....
106: Lends a whole new meaning to the notion of "blowing smoke up one's ass".
I thought of a way we can settle the slacker one-upsmanship competition from this thread.
Take the test from 94, and if your score is higher than your credit score, you are entitled to slacker bragging rights.
All right, I got a 42. Let's see if any other non-virgin can get lower than that.
118: Ok, done, if quickly. Even if I missed some, I'd be happy to have a credit score within a hundred of that. Do I get to claim slack now?
Yeah, my score is shamefully high.
122: I was too embarrassed to complete the whole thing.
Maybe not for 18 year olds entering college
This is key. I remember being kind of scandalized by it at 17, but now, meh, not such a big deal.
I'm going to need a scale to figure out if my score is shamefully high or not. What's the range, people?
123:
mr. president, are you expressing agreement w/ awb's account in virtue of your experience as the penetrative partner or the receptive partner?
(i'm assuming it's the second, but your presidential gender makes it worth checking).
125: yeah it seems sort of vanilla, in its way. More than twenty sex partners?!? Oh gracious, nobody's done that!
124: You don't have to complete the whole thing ... just stop when you hit your credit score.
126: looks like roughly 2000 total possible. Shamefulness probably shouldn't be on a linear scale though, since there a few unlikely but very high point scores.
Maybe anyone can hold their head high if they can't beat Ned's score on a single entry. That won't be all of us, though.
128: just add `in a week' to stuff like that to renormalize.
120: I'm considerably lower than that.
Man.
This is really embarrassing now.
C'mon, AWB, soub, stand up for us degenerates.
132: trust the mineshaft to have a race to the bottom.
I also got a 42. I would ban Sifu, but he's probably already in jail.
133: fine: if you must know, rough number was 767.
There should be extra points for "ever had your cats sit on the stereo cabinet making rude noises whilst you fucked someone?"
I'd have to have done a lot more drugs and picked up an STD or three to get to my credit score...
137: I dunno, I manged above score without STD contributions.
I've had a cat on the damn bed making rude noises, if that helps.
a race to the bottom
whose bottom?
136: damn. You are a sicko. I didn't even crack 700! Near thing, though.
136: Awesome. You probably qualify to give a Reed commencement address.
Damn, soubz, that's impressive. Mine was 287. I've only done like three drugs.
If the drug list were up-to-date, I imagine my score would be quite a bit higher. Lots of nifty drugs invented since 1982.
137.1: How about "kitty bondage"? That's where the cat is sitting or sleeping on part of one of you, so that person can't move, so as not to disturb the cat.
Wow, OK. I hope my gentleman's 220 will do. Nowhere near enough drugs or legal troubles in my past.
115 is more informative than anyone's been with me, & reminds me of Toni Bentley's account, though without the theological implications. Thanx, AWB!
Oh, whoops. Did my math wrong. 705.
That's an extremely placid cat you have there, Bitch.
142: I suspect I score higher on the drug & miscellaneous columns than most of the mineshaft. Looking at it, I did misread one largish one, so I'm probably lower than above total (but still above 700, ST)
What might be more interesting is the ratio of sections. My sex/drugs is nearly 1.
i seem to recall that the average scores for entering reedies were in the 1300's.
low gpa's, tho.
I read Bentley's Surrender and thought it was terrible. I said, out loud, to each page, "Anal sex is not an ethos!" Her thing was all about how her dad once smashed a banana on her face, and so anal sex made her relive her humiliation and trauma and helped her see God. The physiological stuff was kinda good, but I thought it was pretty damaging to make it sound like enjoying anal sex is all about reliving abuse.
Mine's 173, but that's partly because of a 50-point bonus for something I did once. Also, it's kind of weird that the quiz actually *penalizes* some things, like using heroin, that you'd think would be worth at least as much as, say, being in a porn movie. Obviously it's meant to test "immorality, but only within certain acceptably middle-class bounds."
148: She's highly convinced that the primary role of human beings is to serve as furniture.
152: Right, and it skews high for female homosexuality and subtracts points for male homosexuality.
152: I think it's really the "fun to party with" index. All the negatives are sort of antisocial, in a way the positives (excluding human sacrifice) aren't.
Mine's 38. God, I am so vanilla.
Would've been 33 but I converted from Catholic to Episcopalian recently. Really, that should only be worth 2.5 points, but whatev.
PS -- It really lowers your score when you get a zero in the drug section.
50-point bonus for something I did once
I'm guessing "horse or larger".
152:
well, j mcq can speak for this one with more authority, but my guess is that those minus-signs were added late in the game, as a concession to the not-so-funny fact of a few heroin overdoses among the undergrads.
drug abuse: less cute when it leads to dead people in your dorm room.
Hm. I'm not telling my score, but the 100-point bonus really does throw off my results.
152: Yeah, that's sort of odd. Heroin, guy owning a strap-on dildo, etc. seemed bass-ackwards.
Oh, and that sound you hear is half of unfogged trying to figure out which of the four 50 pointers you did. I've got 2, fwiw.
152: B there's no shame in screwing a horse, being a prostitute, doing five or more drugs at a time, or committing a major felony overseas. Which was it?
My score was in the neighborhood of AWB's. I was somewhat distressed to realize that, were I to plot my cumulative score as a time series, the curve would be flat for the last 10 years or so.
154: Exactly. Obviously it was written by some frat boy.
I've got a 10 in the drugs, a 5 in miscellaneous (1 religious conversion), and I'm under 10 in sex if having two children means I've been "involved with" 2 pregnancies.
My non-drug use helped keep my score low.
I wonder if this is like a knapsack problem and you can work out exactly what people have done based on their scores.
Jackmormon is awfully flexible.
Or really, really twisted, but I'm going to assume that's not the case.
I wonder if this is like a knapsack problem and you can work out exactly what people have done based on their scores, at least for the lower ones. Hmmm...
Wait! Does biting your fingernails count as cannibalism?
85, I think. Dropping acid counterbalanced the pregnancies.
159 -- yikes, necrophilia?! I would not have suspected you of such a kink.
163: Yes. My guess is a frat boy who hadn't actually done many things on the list, but would claim all the `cool' ones.
161: I'd tell you, but Soubz and I shouldn't comment on ongoing investigations.
Boo. All multiples of 5 and 10. They really should have devised their point values better.
Was really flexible. But not enough so to make it any fun, really.
I'm confused by the Ronnie Geller test. Why does having , say, injected heroin, done PCP more than once or drugged an unknowing person lose you immorality points?
166: Well since I added wrong....
85: LB, I'm pretty sure LSD is a bad idea during pregnancy.
161: You neglect the possibility that she might have done it with 9 people at once.
I note that there is a distinct lack of kinkly queries. There should be points for owning Violet Wands, vampire gloves, blindfolds, ball-gags, a selection of canes, floggers, slings and other such accoutrements of average suburban life.
Does the question "a horse or larger" refer to how many hands high or just penis size?
Is the site acting a bit nutty or is it just me?
151: Yeah, she's nuts. Not in a completely non-erotic way in some places, but still.
The site is slacking and checking its score.
Score of 110, pretty dull. But comment 125 is dead on; discovering this when I was 15 (posted on the wall of a dorm at Reed, where I was for a summer program) was exciting/scandalizing. It was a great conversational trump card over the next few years as my peers discovered the more "conventional" purity tests.
(and the site seems a bit slow/nutty to me right now as well)
Sex question #2 should yield numbers not multiples of 5. I think there are too many variables for knapsack, even with (very) low scores. You can always guess based on an idea of the personality, of course.
178: Same here. Only male.
Assuming that I only score once for having dildos, not 5 points per; that joint ownership of toys with the wife counts; that joint ownership of a strapon counts for positive points; that sex includes oral and manual; that MDMA is subsumed under MDA or otherwise worth 20 points; that starting to do unnamed act G but changing my mind before getting very far counts for half points, my total is 415.5. This is a crappy purity test, though; I prefer the gender-neutral, one-point-per ones.
How much of a crime was it to be in possession of a couple of grammes of hashish whilst in the UK in 1979? Or would I get more points for fucking a Frenchman on Brighton beach at 3am, despite all the nasty rocks?
Since there's a question that allots one point per weekly orgasm, it's impossible to knapsack.
184: No, they're always like this ... OH, you mean the formatting. Yeah, I saw that too.
190: about the same assumptions I was working with.
182: I decided that "whip" included "riding crop" for purposes of this test.
In a bit of evidence for the 1982 date, crack is not on the list of drugs.
Whoops, sorry, I candyflipped my way to 435.5.
Last summer, I got roped into the "Never Have I Ever" drinking game. Jesus, that was awful. How I found my way home is anyone's guess.
191: oh dear. We're counting drug possession in foreign lands as a "major" crime? 755 it is, then.
I'm not sure why orgasms make you more impure.
Cheating, lying to get sex, faking orgasms, having sex with best friend's mother or best friend's gf/bf all deserve points.
195: But does it include Delrin cane, cat o' nine tails, horsehair flogger, paddles and all those variations on theme?
Obviously it was written by some frat boy.
Actually, one of the nicer things about Reed is the absence of fraternities and sororities.
As far as specific point values go, I think that they're not meant to stand up to close scrutiny. And from what I gather, the test has undergone some revisions.
199: No way. Importation in sale-able amounts, sure.
And, being the infantry, they didn't even think of adultery.
198: Never Have I Ever... taken prescription birth control. Good times.
No way can possession (or sale or importation) in a foreign land count. We've already covered those in the drug section.
"The infantry" is a new one on me.
On the other hand, it was someplace where drugs are really, really illegal.
201: I'm assuming you don't get to score once per. Take your 5 points and move along. Likewise, Liquid Silk, Wet, the sample tube of Astroglide that came free with my last order from Condomania, etc. all add up to "Vaseline on the bedstand".
199: That's why I was asking - I have no idea how Britain felt about hash in the 70s.
Do I get points for writing porn movies? Working crew? Discussing Shakespeare with a naked man as make-up was being applied? [To him, not me.]
AWB: oh no, not that game! I was once challenged to play it with a group of fairly straight-laced friends of a roommate. They argued my relative tolerance for alcohol would balance against the inability to avoid drinks. I managed to get them all smashed by targeting mainstream things, though.
the new version should have:
Posted your own nude pictures on the internet _ 10 pts
Emailed your own nude pictures to someone you've never met _ 5 pts
phone sex __ 5 pts
Conference call phone sex _ 5 pts
Maybe even a special category for Ogged:
masturbated to swimming posts _ - 5 pts
211: definitely. you can't get extra points just because someone gave you a pack of astroglide samplers.
best friend's gf
Yeah, that would bump the score up a bit.
207: Oh, right.. that's got it's own category, doesn't it
216: Should it score more of less if the best friend knew? set it up? was in the room?
the new version should have:
Posted your own nude pictures on the internet _ 10 pts
Emailed your own nude pictures to someone you've never met _ 5 pts
phone sex __ 5 pts
Conference call phone sex _ 5 pts
Maybe even a special category for Ogged:
masturbated to swimming posts _ - 5 pts
213: You mean you've managed to avoid all the vanilla stuff while racking up that score? "Never have I ever... done it in missionary position!"
Yeah, yeah. Site's nutty. We're working on it.
192 - Yep, no knapsacking. But it does let you speculate whether Ogged and Ned are having 2, 7, or 12, or 17 weekly orgasms.
200: What about sex with partner's same-sex parent?
In the same sense that kissing counts as asking "will you fuck me?"
if true, this would certainly explain why my career at the Banque National de Paris lasted like seven months.
Seventeen! Seventeen weekly orgasms, ah-ah-ah-ah.
207: Oh, right.. that's got it's own category, doesn't it
216: Should it score more of less if the best friend knew? set it up? was in the room?
213: Kind of like that. At the time (17 or so) there was a lot of mainstream things I'd missed out on. So while they were all `Never have I ever ... .had sex with two people', I could get them back with `Never have I ever ... been on a date', or whatever. Besides, wasn't one of them who could drink.
Will has a point about the questions. There's a lot of potential "immorality" that it doesn't capture.
225, etc. It's true. We could write a better one.
Oh yes, tons and tons. I hate to imagine a more comprehensive test.
Shot a man in Reno just to watch him die_125 points
Dude, taking a 500-question test would adversely impact my important Unfogged comment count.
Do you read all the information that comes with prescription drugs?
Have you ever used a product in a manner inconsistent with its labeling?
232: heck, I know somebody who does costumes.
Shot a man in Reno just to watch him die_125 points
Awesome.
233:
Do you eat a sandwich with mayonnaise that has sat out all day?
Shot a man in Reno just to watch him die_125 points
No way. 10 points max. Outside of Reno, maybe I'd give 125 points.
woken up in a different country, with no idea where you are, how you got there, or why: ___ points?
Do you wash your hands every time after going to the bathroom?
Have you shaken someone's hand shortly after you sneezed into your hand?
Do you brush your teeth thoroughly?
Do you tell other people when their zipper is unzipped?
Do you fart silently while others are present?
240's question are much more relevant to purity than any drug use questions.
also, both the sex & drug use section promote dilletantism. We need more questions like: "Have you ever caused internal bleeding through overuse"
best friend's gf
I haven't really done the math but my score's pretty low, probably under 50. OTOH my first sex was with the gf of my good friend at whose house I was crashing, with him in the next room and cognizant of what was going on. I like to think that counts for something. (But big negative points for my second or third sex act, which was with the same woman in a date-rape situation.)
225, 226: Like I said, it doesn't stand up to close scrutiny. But I'm delighted to have introduced it to the Mineshaft. It's an Olde Reed classic.
241: Ok, edited... but you are assuming there's a difference?
Woken up in the same country, but thought you were in another?
Woken up in the country, but thought you were in the city?
Woken up hearing country music, but thought you were hearing western?
I've taken the test in 228. 87.8% pure, IIRC.
with the same woman in a date-rape situation
As in, you date-raped her?
Random thought as I leave the keyboard: I bought a man some steamers/ Just to watch him dine.
251 belongs in the Idiocy Test, not the Purity Test.
Promised to pull out, but didnt?
Promised you wake her up to have sex, but didnt?
Promised you'd do the dishes before you went to bed?
Woken up in Personville, holding an ice pick?
250 -- hence, the big negative addition to my score. It is one of my deepest regrets in life and one of the few matters that would cause me to resort to presidential immunity.
253: well, the purity test shades inevitably into the Darwin awards.
Will is intimately acquainted with the wrongs people do. Once again, I love having a divorce lawyer around.
251 -- at the Mill, of course.
251 is definitely grosser than the guy who self-circumcised as an art performance. Holy crap.
It also reminds me of a really stupid cat we had when I was a kid, that used to eat string. Which we used to have to pull out of its butt.
I didn't even notice that that test has negative values for things. That's stupid.
Here's the picture that should've run with the Details article. "Why Are These Asses Smiling?" would've been a good headline.
the guy who self-circumcised as an art performance
I went to college with that guy. Weird dude.
261: you sure those weren't tapeworms?
256: Uhhh... ouch.
Well, blithely ignoring all the negative score nonsense (which I can't be bothered to keep track of), I'd score about 225. I'm surprised that sex in a public place doesn't make the sex immorality questions.
265: Yes. I've dealt with tapeworms, too.
Mmm. Boy am I glad 256 was presidential, and I'm so not looking because I don't want to know.
Why link to a test from 1982, anyway? I think any question about, for example, having naked pictures taken should be worth about 1/20 as many points today. Whereas certain drug questions should be worth more now that the laws are more nonsensical and cruel.
After all, my own tapeworms help me maintain my girlish figure.
268: I don't want to know either. I have to admit I kind of wish I didn't know there was something worth not knowing.
Aha, now we know where your 50 points came from.
I suppose a tapeworm could be considered "the size of a horse or larger", if you just consider length.
Having tapeworms isn't the same as fucking them.
You'll just have to trust me on this one.
It is one of my deepest regrets in life and one of the few matters that would cause me to resort to presidential immunity.
I deeply appreciate this admission, as evidence that JUST BECAUSE YOU KNOW SOMEONE AND DON'T THINK THEY'D DO SOMETHING TO A GIRL BEHIND CLOSED DOORS, DOESN'T MEAN YOU HAVE A FUCKING CLUE.
Sorry for the caps. I thought I was going to say it more briefly.
276: We needed "evidence" of this? I thought it was sort of a given.
I think I'm more disturbed by my being shocked at 276's hostility than by Cleveland's admission. Now *I'm* ashamed of myself.
I'm outraged at the outrage at the outrage.
I'm glad that others got to the 'positive reasons to have anal sex'. Add to the posted reasons, 'You're a boy and getting fucked is great'.
It's also true that pressuring a sexual partner into anything so that you can brag about it later to your buddies is pretty much the definition of douche.
I didn't mean to seem so outraged. I guess I just was thinking of all those times Tia is defending things that really have happened to her, and everyone says "No one I know would ever do that!"
This is for my homey Tia. *pours latte on the ground*
Honestly? I agree with 276 insofar saying that you're a rapist does serve a useful function, but I also think that people probably shouldn't get all confessional ON THE FUCKING INTERNET because IT'S THE INTERNET, not a 3am dormroom conversation or a sharing circle or whatever.
281.1 gets it exactly right, as does 281.2. Nbarnes: 2 for 2.
And if you're going to share such a thing, it's discourteous to use a one-off name and leave everyone who doesn't deny it under suspicion.
The thing about 256, aside from the underlying crime, is the sense it engenders that there's a rapist among us. That's fucking gross. Someone still isn't thinking about the consequences of his actions.
282: and everyone says "No one I know would ever do that!"
"Everyone" said this? Huh. I don't remember that.
Hmm. I saw 285 as I was wondering what the hell I meant in 283. I think part of it is that I can hear about all sorts of zaniness and moderately bad behavior under anonymity and we can all be pals, but "hey, I raped someone once" pretty much brings everything to a screeching halt and to be honest I'm not really sure what the right reaction is.
287: Would you rather not know there was a rapist among us?
286, 287. Alright, you make a good point. I will drop the veil, and absent myself from this forum.
289: More commonly it was: "That can't be as common as you're claiming. Or you date not-nice guys. I have the privilidged talent of being able to smell that all my friends are nice guys."
What's a one-off name?
A name that you use once and don't continue using.
286, 287: Um, that really didn't change my baseline sense of the probabilities that someone in a group of this size would have something of the sort to confess. I don't mean that I thought ill of anyone in particular, or that I wouldn't be shocked and saddened if I knew who GC was. But I'd put the odds of a man I don't know anything else about having a one-time date rape in his past higher than, say, the probability that a teenage girl has masturbated her dog.
292: Aw, crap, [redacted]. I wish you hadn't done that. I mean, obviously, better you'd never done it at all, but I wish you hadn't told us.
Let me try to throw a bone in [redacted's] defense.
The thing about date-rape is that it's massively assymmetric in the harm caused to a woman vs the perceived harm by an immature guy. The best thing that can happen to someone who does this is that they grow up and realize the impact of what they've done.
The thing about date-rape is that it's massively assymmetric in the harm caused to a woman vs the perceived harm by an immature guy. The best thing that can happen to someone who does this is that they grow up and realize the impact of what they've done.
Yes, and that's obviously what's happened.
I think there would have been less of a shocked response from people if someone had said that he'd permanently crippled somebody intentionally.
I have two male friends who did not-as-bad-as-date-rape-but-pretty-wrong things in relationships. They're still my friends--unlike someone else--because they took responsibility, accepted that they hurt someone badly out of stupidity/drunkenness/selfishness/ignorance, and worked (therapy in one case, other stuff in another) to change themselves. They did, also, what the injured party requested as restitution.
It's possible to do something really, really shitty and change yourself and learn from it and Not Be An Awful Person. Of course, it's your friends' right to drop you if they feel like it; you do something like that and you don't have any right to keep your friends. It is appropriate that there are severe social consequences for date rape and similarly-bad-behaviors.
Wait a minute. Not knowing anything about what [redacted] did other than that he now recognizes the absence of consent in something that presumably happened in his teens, I think it's a little much to assume that he's unforgiveable and unredeemable.
290: I think part of it is that I can hear about all sorts of zaniness and moderately bad behavior under anonymity and we can all be pals, but "hey, I raped someone once" pretty much brings everything to a screeching halt and to be honest I'm not really sure what the right reaction is.
Yeah, pretty much.
Wow, that's a deeply depressing and unexpected turn to the thread, I've gotta say.
297: You know, all of that depends on the details of exactly what happened, and that's another thing I really really don't want to know.
Rear Window is right. Now we've looked and looked and all seen something we didn't want to.
Further to 302, and in response to 298, 299, and 300:
The thing is, if we heard the whole story, I'm sure given that everyone wants to be kind, and no one wants to be a prick about it, and people 'know' [redacted], that we'd end up saying, "Aw, shucks, that sort of thing could have happened to anyone." And given that the victim isn't here or listening, I don't want to be handing out forgiveness here. It's not my place, and I don't think it's anyone else's here.
Dave, I don't think Frowner or Ned or me were saying that it was unforgiveable and unredeemable. Just that it requires taking responsibility, and understanding the impact, and that sort of thing.
304: Actually, I'm not at all sure that's what would happen. Either way, best not to go there.
Given that [redacted] too has now taken his leave, maybe we should just drop this now.
I think 298 and 300 are right. (And, to be totally clear, 302.) I also think Mr. Cleveland was right to post 244, presidentially or not, for the reasons explained in 282. If something like this happened, there's no good reason for people to ignore it. I can see why people might react emotionally like in 268 and 272 and the rest, but come on, better to talk about it than not.
307: Agreed. There is no way to participate in this or adjudicate this. Cose this thread, admins.
304: But the thing about being the victim of a crime is, you're forced to deal with something you didn't ask for. There's no way we can in any way tap her side of the story.
After a crime, the perpatrator and victim (in this case) totally part ways. It is fair to deal with the perpatrator's aftermath, independently from the victim's aftermath.
I agree with 306 and 307. I appreciate [redacted] for taking his leave so the issue of what to do doesn't become divisive and affect the community.
It's possible to do something really, really shitty and change yourself and learn from it and Not Be An Awful Person.
/me raises hand quietly.
302, 309: I don't actually see why this is too hot a topic to discuss.
But hey, I trust other people's gut instinct that it is.
One of the things people I know think about on the left is, essentially, "How do you deal with it when people do really horrible things in what is sort of a self-policing community?" It's a concern that's important to me, not because I've done anything really terrible to anyone, but because I've done a couple of things that I view as pretty awful, things that didn't speak well of me as a person, and I've tried to figure out how to change and to make up for those things.
There's--strangely--a GK Chesterton story (I hate Chesterton) called "The Chief Mourner of Marne" that I've always found rather powerful. In it, the annoying Father Brown talks about how his duty is precisely to the people who've done terrible things; that they are precisely the people he can't turn away from. I've been troubled, angered by and saddened by my friends' actions, and things have never been the same as they were before. I've never pretended that I thought what they did was trivial, or okay, or an accident. I wouldn't fault anyone for dropping either of them.
I can't even explain what I mean.
Wowzer. Our real-life "The Girl on the Plane" moment.
Me, I've done too much bad stuff to hate on somebody else for admitting to having done bad stuff. Just sayin.
What is there to discuss, heebie?
Oh, I don't know. I just was responding to the "Close the thread" motions in 307 and 309, and feeling like other commenters may still have something worth airing.
315: In particular I'm kind of hoping to not see a whole rash of "hey, I can't judge [Redacted] 'cause of all the crazy shit I've done" gestures. One TMI moment for the thread is more than enough.
Of course, I could just stop reading the thread. In fact, I think I will.
There's not a way to abstract from [redacted's] case specifically, and for reasons that LB outlined in 302 and 304 there's no justice in talking about his case.
I don't like to make topics Off Limits here but considering how heated some other topics related to crime and women get, I really do see hashing this out as having the potential to really hurt the community here as things will likely get very heated on both sides given people's personal experiences. [Redacted] has elected to leave and I appreciate that. Those of you who weren't around during the last big side-taking blowout about a commenter might not realize how precarious this situation could become. I thank [Redacted] for not making us go through that again.