Re: Personal Growth

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I like Morton's Sea Salt. My own marker of personal food growth is that I am right now boiling my first ever chicken carcass to make soup. I had, to this point, found it too disgusting.


Posted by: Sybil Vane | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:16 PM
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So which iteration of carbonara are you going with, ogged? My obnoxious food-and-wine industry snob brother says that those with tons of cream are inauthentic.


Posted by: oudemia | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:19 PM
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As I think I've mentioned, there was recently a magazine article that either attempted or described attempts to demonstrate differences in the tastes of different types of salt. IIRC, the attempt failed.


Posted by: SomeCallMeTim | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:20 PM
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No cream (I'm lactose intolerant anyway). I'll mostly follow this, but substituting pancetta for bacon, pecorino for parmesan, messing a bit with the proportions, and also adding a tiny bit of feta.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:22 PM
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Sea salt comparison.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:22 PM
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I also think that Maldon salt is worthwhile, in settings where you are sprinkling it at the table. There's no point in cooking with it, because its noteworthy feature is its distinctive shape and texture. It is in delicate pyramid-shaped crystals that crunch very nicely without being too hard and resistant to the tooth. I find the effect noticeable and pleasant. It's also not outrageously expensive, if used only at the table -- about $5 for a 250 gram box.


Posted by: redfoxtailshrub | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:23 PM
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For cooking, I use plain, non-iodized kosher salt.


Posted by: redfoxtailshrub | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:24 PM
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Why kosher and why non-iodized?


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:25 PM
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How come non-iodized?


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:25 PM
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How come pwned?


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:25 PM
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Because iodized salt tastes like metal.


Posted by: Matt F | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:26 PM
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Yeah, I've heard that the Maldon sea salt is awesome.

For most purpose, I use Trader Joe's Kosher Salt. It's so flaky and delicious.


Posted by: m. leblanc | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:26 PM
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6: I agree with RTFS. Some Maldon sprinkled on a perfect tomato? Rrrowr.


Posted by: oudemia | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:26 PM
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Salt is NaCl, no matter how it's packaged. Given the option between plain salt and salt with special added ingredients to make it "flow easily", I'll go for plain salt: otherwise, NaCl is salt is NaCl, and fancy branding makes no difference to the flavor/chemical effect.

(Experiments cooking with different brands of "gourmet salt" versus plain unbranded, demonstrated that, if anything, "gourmet salt" makes food taste worse, as it encourages cooks to add more.)


Posted by: Jesurgislac | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:26 PM
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Kosher salt is better for cooking with because the crystals are larger, so you can sprinkle it by hand much more easily. "A pinch of salt" is kinda hard to get with Morton's.


Posted by: Josh | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:27 PM
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Experiments cooking with different brands of "gourmet salt"

Like foxytail says, you're not supposed to cook with the stuff.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:27 PM
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I learned this a while ago--kosher salt is not called kosher because it's kosher, but because it's apparently used to make meat kosher. It's very flaky, and is absorbed into meat better. I like it when I want the salt to melt on my tongue... mmm.


Posted by: m. leblanc | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:27 PM
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Experiments cooking with different brands of "gourmet salt" versus plain unbranded, demonstrated that, if anything, "gourmet salt" makes food taste worse, as it encourages cooks to add more.

Given that most (non-professional) cooks usually way under-salt their food, color me skeptical.


Posted by: Josh | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:28 PM
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I like kosher because it's grippier than fine-grained salt for times when you want to grab a pinch or two (or more, say for pasta water) by hand, but also dissolves just fine (unlike some salts with an even coarser grain). Non-iodized because iodine has a flavor.


Posted by: redfoxtailshrub | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:29 PM
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because it's apparently used to make meat kosher.

Yeah, it has more surface area, so it absorbs blood better. It's used in kosher butchering.


Posted by: Matt F | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:29 PM
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Ok, 17 is wrong. "its use in making meats kosher, by helping to extract the blood from the meat. Because kosher salt grains are larger than regular table salt grains, when meats are coated in kosher salt the salt does not dissolve readily; the salt remains on the surface of the meat longer, allowing fluids to leach out of the meat."


Posted by: m. leblanc | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:30 PM
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Given that most (non-professional) cooks usually way under-salt their food, color me skeptical.

Seriously. I don't know jack about cooking except that salt tastes great. Whenever I'm eating something a friend has cooked, I end up salting the hell out of it.


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:31 PM
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I think the stuff I buy from Trader Joe's is actually called "Kosher Flake Salt." I don't know what the fuck that means, but it's tasty.


Posted by: m. leblanc | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:31 PM
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5: Please don't make me track down the article. My recollection is that the thrust of the article was what Jes says in #14. No one says you cannot still claim to enjoy aesthetic distinctions that you cannot perceive.


Posted by: SomeCallMeTim | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:33 PM
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I'm also slightly hyperthyroid, so no need for extra iodine in my diet.


Posted by: redfoxtailshrub | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:34 PM
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What I wanna know is, why the hell are you making carbonara for breakfast?


Posted by: Josh | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:37 PM
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I try to keep at least a couple of different salts around. Diamond Kosher Flake is for everyday use, and then a little fleur de sel for sprinkling on delicious things like salt-free peanut butter (because I'm fancy). As far as fleur de sel goes, I don't like it when the chunks are too big and rocky, despite it looking fancy. I don't like chowing down on something that feels like it has grit and gravel in it. My favorite is Saunier de Camargue, but I've lost my supplier (ex who'd bring it back from Paris for me every time he went). I miss it.

Another great everyday salt, if you're too fancy for Diamond Kosher, is Baleine sea salt. I really like it, but I can't see that it's actually superior in taste to Diamond, which melts beautifully on the tongue.


Posted by: A White Bear | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:37 PM
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If you can't eat cream, why not go for Pasta all' Amatriciana? It's the same kind of pancetta/pecorino flavors, only in a tomato base instead of cream.


Posted by: Becks | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:40 PM
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Iodine is important though, right? Where else to we get it from than salt?


Posted by: Sybil Vane | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:40 PM
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Sea salt is 2% various other minerals besides NaCl. These other minerals are critically important in you diet, especially if you're selling sea salt.

At gourmet salt tastings they discern these other minerals: "Slight magnesium flavor blah blah blah ancient Tibetan salt flats blah blah laid down during the late Cretaceous era blah."


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:41 PM
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#18 - It was years ago, but basically some magazine or newspaper with a food section set up a blind taste-test for half a dozen salts - five gourmet, one plain unbranded table salt. There was some variation, but in general, when the tasters didn't know which salt had been used, they preferred food salted with plain unbranded salt.

NaCl is salt. No one can tell the difference.


Posted by: Jesurgislac | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:42 PM
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why not go for Pasta all' Amatriciana?

Because real carbonara is also not cream-based. If you were Italian, you would know this.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:44 PM
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Only the better class of people can tell the difference. Not you, not the people in the taste-test. Refined people.

But not refined like refined sugar, refined in a completely different, totally exquisite way.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:44 PM
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What I wanna know is, why the hell are you making carbonara for breakfast?

I had brunch at a place around the corner that does their own version of carbonara, and it taught me that it's a perfect breakfast food.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:45 PM
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OTish: haas anyone here had any success with taking magnesium supplements ot reduce muscle pain/cramping?


Posted by: Sybil Vane | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:45 PM
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NaCl is salt. No one can tell the difference.

I feel like we're talking past each other. Everyone grants that the salt you cook with, provided it's not iodized, makes no difference in flavor. The difference is in the size, texture, and hardness of the flakes that are used to season/present food when it's ready to be served. I'm also willing to believe that there are minute differences in flavor based on whatever trace elements are in the various salts, but we don't need to fight about that.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:47 PM
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35: never heard of that. Just potassium for muscles and calcium for my uniquely bizarre uterine cramps I get from very intense exercise.


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:47 PM
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magnesium supplements ot reduce muscle pain/cramping

Like a leg cramp cramping? What's wrong with good old potassium?


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:47 PM
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Iodine is important though, right? Where else to we get it from than salt?

If you eat fish, from fish. Also seaweed. And, apparently, dairy products, thanks to what dairy cows get fed.


Posted by: redfoxtailshrub | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:49 PM
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Iodine is important though, right? Where else to we get it from than salt?

Most people get enough from the food they eat. Some places have iodine-deficient soil, so crops and livestock don't have enough iodine. Iodized salt helps with that problem, but most people don't need to worry about it these days.


Posted by: Matt F | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:50 PM
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#29: Sea salt is not a good source of iodine.

Most people probably get most of the iodine they need from milk or fish. if you don't do dairy or fish, eat lots of green leafy vegetables... or seaweed. ;-)

You don't need more than 0.14 mg a day, and eating too much iodine can kill you. Eating too much salt can also kill you.

Seaweed's safer.


Posted by: Jesurgislac | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:51 PM
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Basically like a leg cramp but in my shoulder/neck area. I've got some wonky shit going on up there and it has escalated in recent weeks to severe spasms all through the day. A kind of quacky-y person told me to try magnesium supplements, and some googling supports the idea, but I am looked for data from trusted imaginary internet people.


Posted by: Sybil Vane | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:51 PM
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#33: I'm crude. Like oil.


Posted by: Jesurgislac | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:52 PM
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Seaweed's safer.

and grosser.


Posted by: Sybil Vane | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:52 PM
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42 - I'd think, being totally unqualified to talk, that when it comes to back and neck, there's something underlying that's causing the spasms, and just treating the spasms won't help. Taking pain-killers or muscle relaxants might, but the problem isn't originating in the muscle, so that mineral imbalances are unlikely.

But hell, placebos are good things too.


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:55 PM
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43: Are you extra virgin or just regular virgin?


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:55 PM
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My then-roommate once bought a huge jar of nori packaged especially for snacking -- in snack-sized rectangles, roasted, slightly seasoned in some tasty way, and individually wrapped so they stayed nice and crisp. I love love loved them and noshed on them all the time. I wish I could find them again, but it was some random Korean brand found at a Japantown market, never to me to be seen again.


Posted by: redfoxtailshrub | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:56 PM
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Sybil, fuck the magnesium, hie thee to a massage therapist!


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:56 PM
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The difference is in the size, texture, and hardness of the flakes that are used to season/ present food when it's ready to be served.

Ah. So just cop to that.


Posted by: SomeCallMeTim | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:56 PM
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#44 I think you'd be surprised how many foods you eat use hydrocolloids. (Agar and carrageenan are hydrocolloids.)

Which may be gross, but are definitely seaweedy.


Posted by: Jesurgislac | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:56 PM
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I get fleur de sel when I can, but mostly because I've visited the salt flats in Brittany a number of times and they are totally beautiful.


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:57 PM
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"Brown rice, seaweed, and a dirty hot dog", in the words of the poet.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:57 PM
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I think I've taken magnesium supplements in the past, because I read something about them being good for heart arrhythmias, but they really messed with my digestion. For that, and for muscle cramps, potassium has been much better, with far fewer side effects, so I'd try that first. List of high potassium foods here.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:58 PM
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#44 There's also laverbread, but I bet you can't buy that outside Wales. :-(


Posted by: Jesurgislac | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:59 PM
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I started going to a chiropractor, heebie, which is helping a little but they are all so deeply invested in their own PR over there it makes me skeptical. But while the mobility of my neck is improving, the spasms aren't. And my kid wants ot be picked up all the time. No compassion whatsoever from the 2 yr old set.


Posted by: Sybil Vane | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 12:59 PM
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Flaky seaweed sheets was a common snack in Taiwan. Also dried shredded squid, slightly sweet and slightly hot. Mmm. You needed teeth for the squid, though.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:00 PM
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I started going to a chiropractor

Don't do that, you crazy woman. A massage and a decent potassium intake will fix you right up! (Personally, I get potassium from v-8 (low sodium) and soy milk.)


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:02 PM
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Ooh, oh ho. I think I have just not been trying very hard.


Posted by: redfoxtailshrub | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:03 PM
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I am deeply skeptical of chiropractors as well. I had a serious lower back spasm problem when I was about 19. I went to the doctor (after a friend discovered me lying flat on my back and crying). The x-ray showed nothing. I went to a chiropractor. He cracked my back a bunch of times, told me that one of my legs was slightly longer than the other, and suggested I come back weekly for, like, the rest of my life. I went to a massage therapist. She taught me a bunch of visualisation exercises, put her hands on the muscles that were freaking out, and suggested different ways to balance my weight. She charged me $20 and it worked so well I never went back.


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:04 PM
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I'm telling you, the chiropractor was a last resort. It's been a recurring problem for years but usually I can yoga it out; this time it's really stuck. They did xrays and showed me my totally wonky neck, which was alarming for a minute, but since i have no neck films other than the textbook ideal one to compare it to, I've really no sense of what to make of it.

They are definitely sort of car salesman-y, though, which has disappointed me. But I have a good friend who is an osteopath who has always given me helpful manipulations (their word for adjustments) so I have some help.


Posted by: Sybil Vane | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:04 PM
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Poor Sybil! That sounds awful. Sure, try the magnesium. What the hell, right?


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:04 PM
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You know who else is a bunch of sleazy car salesmen? Acupuncturists. Talk about being upsold! And your treatment won't work unless you sign up for ten supplements. One of which contained feces of the flying squirrel. I swear to god. I've ingested squirrel shit.


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:07 PM
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Carbonara is awesome. That recipe is pretty close to the one I use (from Marcella Hazan's book). One trick that I find helps a lot is to preheat the bowl you're going to mix in by filling it with very hot tap water while everything else cooks. Otherwise, when you mix the egg and hot pasta, the room-temperature bowl sucks out a lot of the heat that you want going into the egg-and-cheese mixture (it also helps if the bowl holds a lot of heat, by being ceramic or glass). Preheating the serving dishes is nice, too.


Posted by: Nathan Williams | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:07 PM
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One trick that I find helps a lot is to preheat the bowl you're going to mix in

Thanks, I did read that somewhere else and wasn't sure whether it was worthwhile. I'll do that.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:08 PM
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Koshering salt is totally useful for things like salting eggplant, for the same reason it's used for salting meat. So it's not like the shape doesn't make any difference. Sea salts with lots of crap other than NaCl can make a difference when there isn't much else going on, like on tomatoes/veg but up to you whether or not that's a better thing. The yuppie packaging and selling at $20 or whatever is pretty silly though.


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:10 PM
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Is it basically the fact of their wanting us to come so much that makes us skeptical of chiropractors? Because while I have my own negative response to that, I don't know that I really think it's a sign of exploitation or quackery or whatever. It does make some intuitive sense to me that the nervous system is a master system int he body that the body develops memory about spinal geography and that correction can take repeated coaxing.OR that our lives are just largely not conducive to maintaining good skeletal form. Is there anything health related we expect one-stop shopping from other than allopathic medicine?


Posted by: Sybil Vane | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:10 PM
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Saunier de Camargue, but I've lost my supplier (ex who'd bring it back from Paris for me every time he went).

You could try dating closer to the mouth of the Rhone.


Posted by: eb | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:11 PM
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Have you been to a massage therapist? Ask your yoga instructor for a recommendation. I've only been to ones that treat a lot of dancers, so perhaps I've had unusually good experiences, but seriously, they were really good.

/soapbox


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:12 PM
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I too hold massage therapists in less contempt than the other fruity hocus-posusists.


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:13 PM
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Is it basically the fact of their wanting us to come so much that makes us skeptical of chiropractors?

For me it was also that they didn't seem to want to teach me anything. If I'm sitting wrong, well, tell me how to learn to sit better!


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:14 PM
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hocus-pocusists. Or perhaps hocus-pokusists.


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:14 PM
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I started going to a chiropractor

I've had neck/shoulder/upper-back problems for a few years now. Last year I went to a chiropractor, who looked me over and then started doing a bunch of manipulations, including turning my head further than it really wanted to go. After that one visit, I never went back.

So earlier this year I finally went to see an orthopedist. Turns out I have arthritis in my neck, and C1 and C2 have autofused. A simple X-ray would have revealed the problem when I went to see the chiro. Fucking jackass.

(Now I'm going to physical therapy, and the guiding principle my PT operates on is "none of this should hurt". I have more mobility and feel better than I have in years.)


Posted by: Josh | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:15 PM
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I was very skeptical about chiropractors until I had a lower back injury that my MD told me I should go see one about. He referred me to a guy who was a sports chiro, and attached to a few olympic teams so I figured it was worth a go. 5 minutes in he had figured out exactly what was happening (a particular nerve was being compressed and not working) and sorted it out. Pretty impressive. He didn't go in for all the more general claims some chiros get on about, so these days I figure if it's an actual mechanical problem actually in my back, I'll talk to a chiro


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:15 PM
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I'm not a chiropracter, I just poke a lot.


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:15 PM
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addendum to 73 is i still won't trust them beyond that, and any non-mechanical problem goes elsewhere. Physio is often the right thing to do, but some MDs are bad about that too (because they don't really understand it)


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:17 PM
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Is it basically the fact of their wanting us to come so much that makes us skeptical of chiropractors?

No, it's that they can often to physical harm, and that their practice can breed dependency. JM is totally right; go to a good massage therapist, and ask around for posture specialists. This place is local to me, but might have recommendations in your area.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:17 PM
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For me it was also that they didn't seem to want to teach me anything. If I'm sitting wrong, well, tell me how to learn to sit better!

This is one of the (many) things I love about my PT. The very first thing she did when I came in for my first appointment was show me how I could adapt my daily activities to minimize the stress on my neck and back.


Posted by: Josh | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:17 PM
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Maybe I was just lucky with the sports chiro guy. He explained everything he was doing and why. Gave me some exercises to help with the pinched nerve, told me what to avoid. We went from 3/week to 0 visits in 3 months, once he figured I was ok.

Personally, I won't accept care from any health specialist who can't or won't explain what they want to do and why.

And I'm not about to let a chiro mess about with my neck, or get into long term treatment either, so I'm hardly a booster for the practice except in limited forms which worked really well for me.


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:21 PM
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73: Your particular problem happened to be right in the center of the chiropractor's core competency. But they use the same method on every disease.

A friend of mine who became a chiropractor ca 1980 says that the faculty divided up the students into three categories: hippies, garlic-eaters, and plumbers. (For the plumbers it was just a skilled trade that wasn't too hard to get into.)


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:22 PM
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Re: the link in 5:

1. Ogged caves to the supremacy of Pittsburgh in matters pertaining to the culinary needs of white people?
2. Ironic statement on points raised in the other thread?
3. Clueless happenstance?


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:24 PM
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Your particular problem happened to be right in the center of the chiropractor's core competency.

That was part of what I was trying to say. For the right sort of problem, it's a big help. Other than that, though, take with many grains of salt. For all I know, acupuncture or whatever has the same kind of core area where it works well for understood reasons (Or not I'm completely ignorant). There certainly are a lot of areas the MDs are pretty much incompetent in, so if you're lucky enough that your problem happens to be one someone else knows something about, doesn't seem crazy to go there.


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:27 PM
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garlic-eaters?


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:28 PM
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It's true that they've not offered much by way of measures I can take to correct the issue by this my third visit. They seem like very decent people though.Although the one was really defensive when I joked about how many props they have to explain their practice, which I found off-putting. Historically, my experience with massage has always been of only temporary relief. Int he long term I need to find somewhere else to put my tension/stress (by now the muscle starts to spasm as soon as I feel anxious or frustrated) but I feel worried that it's too far gone for some rubbing and meditating.

Y'all have sufficiently discouraged me about the chiropractor, though. I might switch out the next appt for a massage, despite the latter's not being insurance covered.


Posted by: Sybil Vane | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:29 PM
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80: I had the same thoughts.


Posted by: Sybil Vane | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:30 PM
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Heebie, you need to separate mere hocus-pocusists, like massage therapists and chiropractors, from the realm of mumbo-pocusists, like acupuncturists and the bloodletters who use those glass cups.


Posted by: Cryptic Ned | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:32 PM
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I think the most discouraging thing about health care is when you have to shop around for a competent person. I know this is true in every avenue of life, but when you're not feeling well, it's particularly daunting.


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:32 PM
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"A pinch of salt" is kinda hard to get with Morton's.

Oh, please.


Posted by: bitchphd | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:32 PM
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They did xrays and showed me my totally wonky neck

The chiropractor did x-rays? or your doctor? If the latter, I'm surprised you're not referred to a physical therapist (if the x-rays showed something wonky, it's not just muscular, right, but something skeletal causing the muscle cramping?)


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:34 PM
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Also, I've seen chiropractors twice and found them helpful. Yoga's helpful too, but it's not covered by insurance and requires me to actually, you know, *do* something, so fuck that.


Posted by: bitchphd | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:34 PM
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86 is one of the key problems with the idea of efficient information in private health care systems. Your asking people to deal with difficult decisions not a the worst times.


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:35 PM
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So I'm sitting here feeling discouraged about the possibilities for a pain-free neck and start to get mopey and then i give myself this little speech about how I will start to watch my posture eat better and eliminate a lot of nonsense from my diet and at that moment the neighbor kid rings my doorbell to deliver the 4 boxes of girlscout cookies I ordered from her.


Posted by: Sybil Vane | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:36 PM
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The chiropractor did xrays. Vertebrae all wonked up; almost no tissue between 2 of them.


Posted by: Sybil Vane | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:37 PM
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89: I've a friend with chronic back problems who tells me that if he's aligned ok, he can keep out of trouble for months to years with yoga. But if he stops practicing, or has a fall and knocks the alignment out, he typically needs a few chiro visits to get sorted out. Lather rinse repeat.


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:38 PM
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92: For god's sake: physical therapist. Seriously. I have the same thing (degenerative disks, in the lower back in my case) and the PT was freakin' phenomenal.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:39 PM
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Don't be sad, Sybil!


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:39 PM
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85: good point. The worst is the hoity-toity mumbo-pocusists, from Bora-Bora.


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:39 PM
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"Garlic-eaters" fanatical health / diet nuts. Macrobiotics would be another example.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:41 PM
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I sure as shit can't be sad now, I have tagalongs.


Posted by: Sybil Vane | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:41 PM
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I just ate three chocolate-chip cookies and the last of the ice cream in solidarity.


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:41 PM
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So I'm sitting here feeling discouraged about the possibilities for a pain-free neck

I felt that way for a long time. I was convinced I was just going to have to live with the pain in my neck and shoulder and upper back. But like I said, I found an awesome PT and now I'm much much better. It's definitely worth going back to your doctor and seeing about a referral to a PT. (And physical therapy is covered by insurance.)


Posted by: Josh | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:41 PM
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85: good point. The worst is the hoity-toity mumbo-pocusists, from Bora-Bora.

Even then there's the hoity-toity ones, the fancy-schmancy ones, and the hoity-schmancy ones.


Posted by: Cryptic Ned | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:43 PM
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I sure as shit can't be sad now, I have tagalongs.

Damn, I envy you.

Also, carbonara is an awesome breakfast.


Posted by: bitchphd | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:44 PM
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Jackmoron, I raise a samoa to you.


Posted by: Sybil Vane | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:45 PM
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And I didn't mean to call you a moron.


Posted by: Sybil Vane | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:46 PM
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My hand hurts a lot and is swollen from where the goddamn cat attacked me this morning. And I have no tagalongs.


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:46 PM
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The chiropractor did xrays

Quack!

Seriously, what others have said. PT.


Posted by: gswift | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:47 PM
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105: Well, what were you doing to piss the poor kitty off, hmmm?


Posted by: bitchphd | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:50 PM
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107: It was the Southern Baptists! not me!


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:52 PM
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I think I might make a cake.


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:53 PM
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I just told my kid I'd take her out for a donut.


Posted by: Sybil Vane | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:53 PM
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108: Well jeez, you should know better than to expose your kitty to Southern Baptists.


Posted by: bitchphd | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:54 PM
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Just to pile on: after improving something like 85% after 3 months of PT, the psychological weight is lifted quite a bit as well. Not just because you feel so much better, but because you're relieved of the dreadful fear that you'll always be in pain, which (as you know) can really do a job on you. In other words, you can cheer up, Sybil! They'll help you!

(/soapbox)


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:55 PM
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108: I described the incident in all it's gory bloody baptistmisness over at my place. With a video to boot. But not of the Baptists. They were like ships in the night, unaware of the ruckus they caused


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:57 PM
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I mean, 111. And I meant to have a period at the end.


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 1:58 PM
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Lest anyone mistake my above, let me pile on to say PT is awesome. They can't help with everything, but who can. For some stuff they're the cats pyjamas.

Other ones to be really leery of are surgeons, ime.


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 2:00 PM
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I'm off, yinz, for donuts and optimism. Thanks for all the encouragement and gentle well-meaning disparagement of my previous course of action.

But really, thanks.


Posted by: Sybil Vane | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 2:02 PM
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I just Cabbage-Patched when I was intending to Frug.


Posted by: oudemia | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 2:11 PM
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The scientific foundation behind chiropractic is, as with acupuncture, utter horseshit, with the difference that acupuncture has actually been shown to have positive clinical results. "Subluxations" do not exist according to every measure medical science has been able to devise to look for them. On the other hand, chiropractors can be good massage therapists, if they don't get too wrapped up in the nonsensical foolishness at the heart of their practice.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 2:38 PM
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A review of papers examining the effectiveness of spinal adjustment:

Generally speaking, the conclusions drawn from these systematic reviews were disappointing. The meta-analysis by Assendelft et al.9 suggested that SM was superior to sham therapy or to ineffective/harmful interventions for low back pain. The meta-analysis by Gross et al.12 implied that combining SM with other treatments, particularly exercise, is effective in reducing neck pain but demonstrated that SM is not effective as a singular treatment. Bronfort10 concluded that SM and/or mobilization are viable options for treating low back and neck pain. Bronfort13 concluded that SM has a better effect than massage and a comparable effect to prophylactic drugs for headache. Reid21 found only limited evidence from methodologically poor trials for effectiveness in cervicogenic dizziness. All other conclusions agreed that the effectiveness of SM is not supported by the results from rigorous clinical trials.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 2:42 PM
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Hijack: Can anyone guess what Nicky Barnes is on about here:

BARNES:(FACE OFF)
This is a New York quarter.

(MUSIC OUT)

BARNES:(CONT)
When I left the street, if you heard someone was scrambling, that's what they were selling.

78. (1:10:45.05) ECS Finger
and heroin on a marble counter top. Nick mixes two piles of power with playing cards.

BARNES:(CONT)
What made this particular quarter so famous was that, my quarters, you could dump that quarter out, go get a quarter of cut, a quarter of manite, or manita, take that quarter of manita and put it with my quarter, blend them together and they would have two quarters, and that's where the innovation was.

WTF is manita?


Posted by: David Weman | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 2:51 PM
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Milk sugar, whatever that is.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 2:55 PM
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Or possibly mannite, a product of the ash tree used as a mild laxative.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 2:56 PM
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This stuff.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 2:57 PM
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Sorry I missed the first, foodie part of this (I was, as promised, in the Strip with Iris), but:

Linguine?
RED wine?

I'm a bit flabbergasted. I've tried a number of versions similar to Marcella's, but none have ever matched hers, and all are more complex.


Posted by: JRoth | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 2:59 PM
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OT Bleg:

So, my honey and I are looking to take a three or four day vacation in a little while, and we'd like to go somewhere upstate NY, nature-y, and not-too-pricy.

We'd like forest or ocean, and recognise that ocean is likely either too urban or too pricy or too unforested. My honey is open to the idea of renting a car, but I'd prefer to get there by train, if possible. We don't really need there to be any activities, per se: just pretty stuff to look at, maybe a trail or two.

Does anyone know of a "awesome cheap getaways from Manhattan" independant website, or have any recommendations?


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 3:14 PM
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OT: Has he been kicked around enough? Maybe then you'd like to get shep3804 a copy of "Breakthru Pilates" from his Wishlist


Posted by: bjk | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 3:14 PM
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125: if you can deal with leaving the state, North Adams and Mass MOCA are probably lovely and cheap this time of year. It would require a car, one imagines.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 3:16 PM
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125 -- It doesn't meet all your criteria, JM, but I just had a nice little vacation in Quebec City. link.


Posted by: CCarp | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 3:30 PM
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That area does look nice. The city website hooked me up with lots of very posh looking b&bs---I have no idea what sort of rates are normal for a b&b---and I do like the idea of being able to wander out of the town and into the hills. We would need a car for that, looks like.


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 3:31 PM
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You know it's still winter in upstate NY, right?

If the snow melts enough, I'd say bike touring around the Finger Lakes. You can do wine tasting too up there. Stay in a B&B in a little town. Very pretty. You could perhaps do the same thing in the Hudson River valley further south.

Otherwise, cross-country skiing in the Adirondacks or the Catskills.

The Catskills and the lower Hudson River valley are relatively short drives, others are long.

What I'd really say is save your money and take a plane somewhere truly cool. Big Sur on the California coast is spectacular in March.


Posted by: PerfectlyGoddamnDelightful | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 3:31 PM
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It doesn't meet all any of your criteria.

Fixed.


Posted by: Nápi | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 3:31 PM
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I've only been near there one summer - on the Vermont side - but the lake Champlain area is on the train and seems pretty nice.

I think NY to Montreal is one day on the train, but you probably can't get to Quebec City in one day.


Posted by: eb | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 3:34 PM
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We could go to California, where most of my relatives live. We'd have a free place to stay, use of a car, home-cooked almost-gourmet meals, the choice of two pianos and an organ to plod away at, and of course all of the local guidebooks or guides a person could want. On the other hand, most of my relatives live there. We're looking to look at trees and vegetate.


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 3:36 PM
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I suppose the other thing to mention is that when I got to Vermont in mid-June that year, people were saying it was just starting to get warm.


Posted by: eb | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 3:36 PM
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We're looking to look at trees and vegetate.

Sorry, meant to add: my relatives can be just a tad judgmental about people who visit and are not sufficiently energised by the beauty of the area. And about people in general, really.


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 3:39 PM
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The Hudson River area is spectacular in summer and early fall. I've never been there in springtime. Depending where you are going, you can get there on the Metro North train, or the Amtrak to Rhinecliff or Rhinebeck or whatever the heck it is. Be forewarned that Amtrak is often ridiculously (like, hours) late.

I'm blanking on specific places to stay, though. This place is in that general area, but is not at all the kind of experience you're looking for, I think. Unless they let you just go and stay, and not attend workshops.


Posted by: Witt | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 3:49 PM
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We're looking to look at trees and vegetate.

Well you could always skip the relatives, go to a cabin in one of the Big Sur camps (reserve in advance) and veg. Alternatively, a tent on one of the beachfront public camping spots along Highway 1 further south, if you're up for roughing it a bit.

Upstate NY tends to be either snowy or muddy in the early spring, unless you hit it quite lucky. Summer or fall is the time to go (and then it's spectacular).


Posted by: PerfectlyGoddamnDelightful | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 3:55 PM
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You could almost certainly catch an Amtrak to North Dakota.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 3:58 PM
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Snowy can be awesome. Just saying.


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 3:59 PM
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I think my parents would be very offended if I managed to bring my honey out to California and didn't manage to present him. (He's only met my mother---there's lots more of the clan to encounter!)

The Hudson Valley area is sort of what I'd had in mind, Witt, thanks. Rhinebeck sounds interesting, and the Omega retreat-place looks like it could be interesting...


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:10 PM
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Trees and vegetate? Within a day of NYC this time of year? Seems a pretty tall order.

I've been pleasantly surprised by the Pine Barrens in NJ.


Posted by: Napi | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:10 PM
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138: Surprisingly, Elgin does not have its own Amtrak station.


Posted by: apostropher | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:13 PM
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This is all going to be much more satisfying if you enjoy cross country skiing, JM.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:16 PM
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I think South Dakota, Oklahoma, and one other state do not have Amtrak service.


Posted by: eb | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:17 PM
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Also, would anyone happen to know where I could buy some kind of window lining that serves the purpose of curtains but does not require curtain rods - that is, it sticks to the window itself?

As much as I enjoy being able to look at the condemned, but not abandoned, house across the backyard, I don't particularly want to live in a room with uncovered windows.


Posted by: eb | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:19 PM
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Hawaii, Alaska, South Dakota and Wyoming.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:20 PM
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145: Duct tape.


Posted by: Minivet | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:20 PM
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140: As all have said - either go for the snow now (and that is most reliable in Catskills, Adirondacks, or Taconic/Berkshires) or then wait until the mud is gone. Some of the Hudson Valley estates are pretty spectacular, grounds and nature as well as houses. Between Rhinebeck and Hudson you get Clermont and Olana (Bard College is nearby as well). Here is a site with a whole list. There are a number of B&Bs along there.


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:23 PM
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I don't know if I enjoy cross-country skiing. I don't even know if I have any truly waterproof clothing.

Thanks for the Pine Barrens recommmendation, CC. That seems to be fairly doable!


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:23 PM
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145: what do you have against curtain rods?


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:24 PM
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146: Huh. My information, which was from memory of a conversation in the 90s sometime, is really out of date (except for Hawaii and Alaska, which I was assuming didn't need to be mentioned in this context). I didn't realize there was an Oklahoma route now; I'm guessing it was added within the past 10 years.


Posted by: eb | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:25 PM
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150: I suppose I could get a tension curtain rod and measure the window and get the correct size curtain. But I'm only here for one month and I want whatever requires the least installation.


Posted by: eb | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:27 PM
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eb, I was going to ask if there was such a place as a Home Depot near you, but Minivet gets it right. Plastic sheeting, duct tape, and a couple of posters trash-picked or purchased from one of those furnish-your-dorm-room places near a university. This is only for a month, right?


Posted by: Witt | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:27 PM
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151: wouldn't surprise me if it was marginal. Hard to imagine they've added more. Wyoming got dropped in 1997, according to Wikipedia.

152: have you considered torching the house next door?


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:28 PM
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spraypaint the window black!


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:29 PM
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I don't think posters let in enough light.


Posted by: eb | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:30 PM
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Wait, I thought Alaska *did* have Amtrak service. I vaguely remember this whole thing about whistle-stop or some variant thereof. You know, where the train doesn't stop unless you stand by the tracks and flag it down.

(Google to the rescue: Amtrak is the contractor for Alaska Railroad.)


Posted by: Witt | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:31 PM
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Duct tape up a sheet? Classic, yet understated.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:33 PM
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Thanks, JP Stormcrow!

We don't really have the option to wait until the snow is over: we're on my honey's university spring break schedule. And since he's working like a demon, all he wants to do is sleep, sit somewhere pretty, and smell fresh air. Me, I just want not to spend too much money...


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:35 PM
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I've been across North Dakota on the train. All I remember is the austere landscape, plentiful waterfowl, and the cops meeting the train in Minot in the middle of the night to haul away the guy who'd gotten drunk with his girlfriend and pushed her down the stairs of the observation car.

I don't know if I enjoy cross-country skiing.

Now's the time to find out! I can recommend here and here in the Northeast Kingdom. Alternatively, you could go stay at my old house, but there's not much to do around there.

eb, there's a translucent white contact-paper type of thing you should be able to find at a Home Depot or some such.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:35 PM
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Also, it's really easy to get a gauzy curtain of a size that you know is at least a little too big, and then hang it up using a tension rod. It won't matter if it bunches up a little -- the gauze is lightweight and designed to do that. No need to worry about the right size. Plus, it will definitely let in enough light.


Posted by: Witt | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:36 PM
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161 gets it right.

The curtain can be three times as wide as the window, just as long as it can be bunched up to cover it. The thrift store probably has hundreds of pounds of curtains that they never hope to sell to anyone, so just go there.

And tension rods cost about seven dollars.


Posted by: Cryptic Ned | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:37 PM
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Least installation: tension rod, sheet. Or tension rod, curtain. Most curtain panels (and windows) are a pretty standard size.

Or you could just *hammer* a sheet above the window. But that's actually more installation than a tension rod, except for the going-to-home-depot part.


Posted by: bitchphd | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:37 PM
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The b&b at your old place is comparatively *really* cheap, Jesus. Is the place super-drafty and uncomfortable, or is it just in the middle of nowhere?


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:38 PM
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I've been across North Dakota on the train

So have I. You don't remember much because it goes across the top of the state where there is nothing around even by ND standards.


Posted by: CJB | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:39 PM
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Home Depot it is, I think. I wonder if I can do this without measuring tape.


Posted by: eb | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:40 PM
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On the other hand, I do have a flat sheet I'm not using... I'll figure something out.


Posted by: eb | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:41 PM
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Is the place super-drafty and uncomfortable, or is it just in the middle of nowhere?

The latter; it's a pretty cozy place. The surrounding area is pretty, but doesn't offer much in the way of attractions. Cryptic Ned used to live not far away, IIRC, so maybe he'd know what there is to do around there.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:44 PM
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157: Actually I think they just mentioned Alaska Railroad as being the provider in Alaska, the contractor part applies to some commuter lines. The Alaska Railroad does have one of the best routes in the world. In the past to get to or from Whittier by car (and on to the car ferries from there), you would drive on to flatbed cars to go through the rail-only tunnel. Not too long ago a one-lane road was added, but the different car directions and trains all have to alternate going through.


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:46 PM
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Pretty is FINE. As long as we can forage for food somewhere around, and look at trees, that's all we're going to need.


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:47 PM
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I'm a little frightened by the wallpaper, though.


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:49 PM
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The latter; it's a pretty cozy place. The surrounding area is pretty, but doesn't offer much in the way of attractions. Cryptic Ned used to live not far away, IIRC, so maybe he'd know what there is to do around there.

(checks place out)

Sorry, never been that far into that particular wilderness.

I guess Nicholson/Tunkhannock, PA aren't that far away. Or Binghamton. Never been closer than that.

Tunkhannock is a great town to spend most of a day if you happen to be driving on route 6.


Posted by: Cryptic Ned | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:50 PM
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171: Yeah, the decor depresses me. I hate the thought that people with bad taste live in that house.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:55 PM
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I wonder if I can do this without measuring tape.

Yes. If memory serves, standard window size is something like 40-something inches. 42? Anyway, just eyeball/estimate it: you know about how long a foot is, yes? So count how many feet, ish, the window is, and that gives you a number.

Then you'll go to home depot and find out that curtains come in standard widths. One of which is probably about the number you've got. Buy that one, or, if you're super paranoid about not having an inch at the edge, buy the next size up. If length is the concern, get a floor-length drape; it'll look just fine covering not only the window but the area beneath it.

Keep in mind that if you're using a tension rod, you don't want an especially heavy curtain. Shirt weight or lighter; no thick drapes.


Posted by: bitchphd | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 4:59 PM
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JM, I think you've convinced me that I need to plan an "away" weekend for me and Mr. B.

That and the fact that PK's on a playdate, and when I asked Mr. B. what he wanted to do with our free afternoon, he first opted for "pay bills" and then ended up cleaning house and going for a haircut.


Posted by: bitchphd | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:02 PM
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I took a sheet of paper from a notebook and used that like a measuring stick. It's a big window - which is why I didn't want to guess by standard sizes - and it's nearly 60 inches across. That makes a tension rod a bit more difficult.


Posted by: eb | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:03 PM
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Yes, that is a very big window.

Duct tape and sheet, then!


Posted by: Cryptic Ned | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:04 PM
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Shower rod.


Posted by: bitchphd | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:16 PM
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Ballet barre.


Posted by: Witt | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:17 PM
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Non foodie food question. I was intrigued by the discussion of seaweed and wondered if anybody could recommend some super easy recipes with seaweed in them. I don't like spending time in my kitchen, because its poorly insulated and very cold. Unless the oven is on at around 400, it's just not at all pleasant. I don't like doing dishes, so I try to limit the number of pots and pans that I use. So, basically, when I say super-easy, I mean *super* easy.


Posted by: Bostoniangirl | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:18 PM
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Miso soup!


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:22 PM
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No one wants to help eb overcome his natural shyness and get in touch with his inner exhibitionist?


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:22 PM
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180: just buy the stuff (see rfts' link way upthread) and eat it. It's delicious roasted.

Me, I get my iodine from bacon salt.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:24 PM
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The building next door isn't being squatted in by the Swedish Bikini Team, ogged.


Posted by: Cryptic Ned | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:25 PM
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180: Miso soup. Mix miso paste in stock (you can find the stock base, dashi, in powdered or flake form), toss in seaweed and cubed tofu, you're done. Takes a minute or two.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:25 PM
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Curse your brevity, JM.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:26 PM
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Mmm, miso soup.


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:27 PM
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I am probably going to go with a shower rod, at least on the first attempt. I checked out my sheet and it looks like it will cover the window to the extent that I'd like it to. Anyway, I have to go now, if I want to do this tonight.


Posted by: eb | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:28 PM
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Do you use firm tofu in miso?


Posted by: Bostoniangirl | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:33 PM
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Funny, the degree of privacy various people go for with window coverings. My roommate cannot stand having anybody able to look inside -- sheer or gauzy curtains are not enough: people might see your outline! The result is the heaviest opaque covering over any window under his direct control (often meaning a blanket hung over a plain rod). Darkness rules.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:34 PM
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Yeah, I like natural light and don't generally like curtains or blinds closed. Mr. B.'s a big freak who insists on putting down the blinds in the bathroom, despite the fact that the back yard (onto which the windows look) is surrounded by a six foot fence and 30 foot trees. Drives me crazy.


Posted by: bitchphd | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:41 PM
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189: Anything but the really soft kind.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:41 PM
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189: anything from medium to firm is fine. Press the water out of it before cutting it up for best results (always)


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:43 PM
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Shaping up as a male/female divide. I almost always keep the blinds closed when I'm home. And I have blinds and a shade in the bedroom, but that's to keep the light from waking me in the morning.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:43 PM
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Shaping up as a male/female divide

You can taste the excitement.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:45 PM
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Oh, a little mirin is good in miso soup too. Above JM leaves that out.


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:45 PM
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Shaping up as a male/female divide.

What, based on Parsimon's gender-unknown roommate, me, my husband, and you? Even *I* wouldn't make sex-based generalizations on such thin evidence, Ogged the Troll.


Posted by: bitchphd | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:46 PM
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194: Opposite here. I always figure if someone doesn't want to see, they don't have to look. I usually don't bother with blinds.


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:46 PM
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Oh, Parsimon's roommate is a "him." Still.


Posted by: bitchphd | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:47 PM
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I hate direct light getting into a room when I am in it. I don't want it to be dark, but the sunlight has to be filtered by something. Otherwise it makes everything look dusty and disorganized, and I get depressed.

The blinds in my room have been at the exact same setting for every single second that I've lived there. It's one of the reasons I thought I'd enjoy living there. Curtains are not as good.


Posted by: Cryptic Ned | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:50 PM
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Shaping up as a male/female divide.

Nope. I get pretty surly about obstructions to natural light, and I really hate having indoor lights on in the daytime. That said, we don't have as much natural light up here as you Californians do.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:50 PM
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Everyone wants to see, soup, it's whether you'll let them.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:50 PM
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female divide

I love those.


Posted by: apostropher | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:51 PM
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202: But why would I care?


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:52 PM
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What, based on Parsimon's gender-unknown roommate, me, my husband, and you?

Also every woman I've lived with, but Jesus and soup seem to be playing for Team Vagina on this one, so nevermind. And I did say "shaping up," which implies that one is waiting for more evidence, Miss Inflammamatory.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:53 PM
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Shaping up implies that there's something that's big enough to start to take on a shape, Mr. Bater.


Posted by: bitchphd | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:55 PM
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Nah, you can add my wife and a bunch of exes to the column for women who like the windows covered (to various degrees)


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:55 PM
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200 is so depressing I can't stop laughing.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:55 PM
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my wife

You're married??? I don't know why this surprises me so much, but it does.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:56 PM
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I keep my venetian blinds closed when I'm naked, 'cuz otherwise the puppet show loses all it's mystery.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:57 PM
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204 gets it exactly right. Who gives a shit?

I mean, if you live on the ground floor of a major thoroughfare, or directly across from someone's office or apartment or something, then sure; it's polite not to parade around naked in front of an open window. But short of that, b.f.d.


Posted by: bitchphd | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:57 PM
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It's well established that much of the Unfoggetariat has no conception of personal dignity, so it's hardly worth arguing over whether one should take care to close (or to have) blinds. Let peace reign.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 5:59 PM
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209: we're neither of us particularly traditionalist fwiw.


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:00 PM
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200 to 211.

My reason has nothing at all to do with privacy, now that I think of it. I've been fine with open windows that don't let direct sunlight in. Then my fiancee visits and wonders why I went to the trouble to put two curtains up but the other one is sitting on the floor instead of being over the third window.


Posted by: Cryptic Ned | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:01 PM
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213: so he shouldn't consider you off-limits?


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:04 PM
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It's because I have so much personal dignity that I don't cringe in terror at the thought of someone seeing me.


Posted by: bitchphd | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:05 PM
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I fear not for myself, but for them. Aieee! The serpent! No, god-fearing folk, 'tis merely my salute to the morning.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:06 PM
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If people are snoopy enough to look in other people's windows, they deserve to be terrified by the sight of a naked Tweety.


Posted by: bitchphd | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:08 PM
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for more evidence
i can't sleep if the room is completely dark, i need some light coming into
once i've been in the hotel room, in Sapporo ircc which did not have windows, so with the closed doors it felt like you are in coffin, so had to sleep with the door slightly open, it was completely safe
the blinds are up all the time and i like to wake up with the morning sun


Posted by: read | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:09 PM
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A hotel room with no windows?

You're sure you weren't in jail, yeah?


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:10 PM
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what a unlucky word you say
why it should be jail, it was a cheap hotel room
everything was standard, only there was no windows


Posted by: read | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:14 PM
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-s or were


Posted by: read | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:14 PM
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the sunlight has to be filtered by something. Otherwise it makes everything look dusty and disorganized

I suspect you may need a vacuum cleaner.


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:15 PM
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221: I don't know that I've ever been to a hotel that had windowless rooms.

I'll leave it as an exercise for the read(er) to imagine where I might have experienced windowless rooms.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:17 PM
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And man, you all should SEE some of the wallpaper in all of these goddamn b&Bs I've been looking at. Roses and tchochkes, everywhere. Do they think that shit is restful? C'mon!


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:18 PM
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Yeah, Ned, you need to clean your apartment and let the sun shine in!

But no, no male/female divide I've ever noticed. And it has nothing to do with personal dignity, unless someone wants to make a fight over the public/private divide.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:22 PM
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if you go to Sapporo may be you'll find
i went there to attend the meeting and it was late to go back to the town i lived so entered the first hotel i saw and was offered that room
it was the first day of the White illumination festival
i wandered around to see all lights in the Oodori koen, that's why i got late to the train


Posted by: read | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:24 PM
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223/226: It's not just my apartment dammit, it's every room everywhere. Direct sunlight makes me want to go to sleep. It's particularly bad in a classroom.

So, the apartment is set up to comply with my preference for filtered light.


Posted by: Cryptic Ned | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:27 PM
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225: Years ago, I updated a Fodor's guide to inns and b&bs, and found that that look was nearly universal. The horror. The horror.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:29 PM
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Roses and tchochkes, everywhere. Do they think that shit is restful? C'mon!

So true. I'm coveting a stay at this place. It's a yurt!


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:30 PM
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might have experienced windowless rooms.
you were in jail?! i don't believe it though there is a russian proverb that noone is insured against jail or something else i forgot what was it
but that was pre-revolutionary Russia


Posted by: read | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:35 PM
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Yurts can be lovely.

The hotel-room-without-a-window phenomenon is odd indeed. My first awareness of them came courtesy of Albany.


Posted by: Witt | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:36 PM
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looks nice, the yurt


Posted by: read | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:37 PM
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I don't like busy wallpaper, but it wasn't until I worked with sign language interpreters that I realized how pervasive it is in hotels. Carpeting, too. We had to put down a tablecloth (on the floor around the interpreter's chair) at one point to ease the eyestrain.


Posted by: Witt | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:39 PM
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You would say that.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:39 PM
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The Hudson River area is spectacular in summer and early fall.

This is true. Also, taking the train upstate from NYC can be quite pleasant (unless you get one of those grungy, dingy trains) because the train route follows the Hudson. However, if by "trees" you mean "greenery," now is not the time to go, as others have already noted.


Posted by: Mary Catherine | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:41 PM
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My first BBS was called "The Frog's Yurt". The relevance should be obvious.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:42 PM
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235 to 234, it seems. Ogged's got your number, Witt.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:43 PM
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237: Hefts Yogurt?


Posted by: LizardBreath | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:48 PM
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Aww, Tweety, are you grumpy that Blume pwned you in the other thread? It's okay. We still think you're clever. (Except read, who apparently doesn't distinguish between a prison term and the slightly less rare night in local jail.)

I rode in the back of a police van a while back. There was a hunk of hair dangling from a cleat on the ceiling. Somewhat unexpected.


Posted by: Witt | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:49 PM
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ogged, do it. The Point Reyes place looks great. Blinds are up, of course, and plants. But what a smile.

A friend of mine lives on an island off the coast of B.C. in a house that's similar: open, lots of exposed wood, cathedral ceiling. He seems to have a lot of friends who like to stop by.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:49 PM
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The link in 230 indicates an elastic definition of "yurt." The building pictured doesn't look very portable.

The Wikipedia entry on "yurt" includes a great photo by Prokudin-Gorskii.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:49 PM
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yurt is turkic word i believe we call it ger
237 i did not get, what is BBS and why frog is relevant


Posted by: read | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:50 PM
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ogged, do it

I would, if there were any weekend days available over the next two months. Alas.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:50 PM
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Vacation time! Life is short.


Posted by: Witt | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:51 PM
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Frogs are always relevant, read. And in today's world of water pollution, ranaria will be more and more crucial in maintaining our supply of frogs.


Posted by: Cryptic Ned | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 6:54 PM
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244: Why the next two months? Book ahead. Presumably more expensive then.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 7:02 PM
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I need more instant gratification than that, man. I'm also digging the glass-walled treehouse in the woods.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 7:04 PM
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O-man, those yurt renters use Comic Sans typeface and have an overly eager center-align tendency. Would you really trust them to lay out your surroundings for a relaxing weekend?


Posted by: Stanley | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 7:07 PM
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I've always wanted to stay at one of those all-treehouse joints.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 7:08 PM
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My friend's place in BC. Damn, it's beautiful. He's crammed it full of arts & crafts furniture and bookshelves of arcana, doing the island wizard thing.

(/real estate lust)


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 7:11 PM
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Ah, that's nice.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 7:12 PM
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i had two patients-inmates
one was a high profile person, a former general, some even considered him a political prisoner
another one was a woman who stole millions of dollars from the state bank by fraud and bribes, she had nephritis so had to be hospitalized, our equivalent of FBI undercover agent also was in the next to her ward and they asked me to ask leading questions to clarify where she kept those millions, as if btw, they put a recorder in the room
i refused of course and always did her daily examination in our examination room not in her ward, it was very scarce yrs in the early 90ies and as much as i hated her i couldn't bring myself to do that, she was so corrupt person even tried to bribe me by pair of pumps!!! as if she is very grateful to me for the treatment, really disgusting
by now i suppose she is out of jail and consumes those millions somewhere
well, enough of my memories
good night


Posted by: read | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 7:13 PM
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Were they nice pumps?


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 7:15 PM
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The glass-walled treehouse is looking a little too modular and inorganic to me.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 7:15 PM
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I bet it's cold, too.


Posted by: ogged | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 7:18 PM
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Wait hold on though. How can a treehouse be inorganic? Are you claiming those are fake trees?


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 7:19 PM
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Tweety, you can make a treehouse out of a stripped-out Chevy van. Can't find any links now.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 7:24 PM
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if by "trees" you mean "greenery," now is not the time to go, as others have already noted.

Haterz.

It would be around Mar. 20th. Surely there would be some buds, a daffodill or two, maybe a crocus?


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 7:30 PM
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In upstate New York? Surely by "a daffodill" you mean "lots of snow"?


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 7:32 PM
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258: they didn't, though.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 7:33 PM
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Maybe a snowdrop, JM.


Posted by: Witt | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 7:34 PM
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I bet the reason hotels and b&bs has hideous wallpaper is to hide stains or something.


Posted by: bitchphd | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 7:36 PM
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261: The all-treehouse joint? I've never heard of these.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 7:36 PM
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JM, maybe if you want springlike greenery around March 20th, you'd want to head south instead of north.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 7:39 PM
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For instance the average date of blooming for the cherry trees down in DC is only April 4th (and they are an early bloomer). ...sorry.


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 7:49 PM
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Isn't late March springtime? Fucking Northern climes. Also, the trains don't seem very convenient heading South.


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 7:50 PM
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I should note, returning to the original topic of the thread, that I use only the finest salt from the convenient pouch that accompanies every package of Superpretzels® I buy. The pretzels themselves, I throw away.


Posted by: Stanley | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 7:51 PM
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No wonder I never leave the city. What with my Botantical Garden membership, I'm only fifteen minutes away from Desert and, in the room over, Temperate.


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 7:52 PM
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Because real carbonara is also not cream-based. If you were Italian, you would know this.

Arguments over the authenticity of carbonara recipes are pretty pointless, because it is hardly a venerable Italian dish.

Ulteriori voci, le più plausibili, dicono che sia stato inventato durante la seconda guerra mondiale per utilizzare la pancetta e le uova comprate al mercato nero dal personale Americano. Questa ipotesi è del resto avvalorata dal fatto che non esiste alcuna testimonianza letteraria dell'esistenza di questo piatto prima del 1944, e che a Roma esso era sconosciuto prima della seconda guerra mondiale.

Posted by: Knecht Ruprecht | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 7:53 PM
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Botantical Garden membership, I'm only fifteen minutes away from Desert and, in the room over, Temperate.

And with your Boquantical Garden membership, you are just as far away from Plenty and, in the room over, Dissolute.


Posted by: ben w-lfs-n | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 7:53 PM
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Without a citation for the blockquote, Knecht, it may as well be your own composition.


Posted by: ben w-lfs-n | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 7:54 PM
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267: Embrace it. Give up on the greenery and go out to Montauk for some refreshing ocean air. Reduced rates that time of year as well.


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 7:54 PM
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I had been thinking about taking the Moby-Dick tour at some point.


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 7:56 PM
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Here you go, w-lfs-n. Because we all know that Wikipedia is an infallible authority.


Posted by: Knecht Ruprecht | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 7:56 PM
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It's a bit colder than usual for this time of year in the mid-Atlantic area (it's been in the 20s off and on lately in Baltimore/DC area). But if you were looking at a day's travel anyway, you could get further south than here. I almost always travel north from here myself, but some of the southern east coasters might have an idea.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 7:57 PM
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Isn't late March springtime?

March 20 is the vernal equinox, aka the first barely-plausible day on which you can claim it's spring.


Posted by: Witt | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 7:58 PM
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271: Groan.


Posted by: Merganser | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 7:59 PM
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Arguments over the authenticity of carbonara recipes are pretty pointless, because it is hardly a venerable Italian dish. the point of a recipe is whether or not it tastes good.


Posted by: bitchphd | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 7:59 PM
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I have never been further South than Arlington, VA. I wouldn't have the faintest idea of where to go or what to do.


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 8:01 PM
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But, 279, the dispute isn't whether recipe x tastes good or not, it's whether recipe x is for carbonara.


Posted by: ben w-lfs-n | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 8:01 PM
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274: In fact if you are willing to put up with the likely windy, somewhat cold weather, that is not a bad time to go out and see Sag Harbor, Montauk etc. without the crowds. (But willingness to stand out in the chill is a must.)


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 8:03 PM
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JM maybe you should go to New Orleans.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 8:04 PM
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I have never been further South than Arlington, VA. I wouldn't have the faintest idea of where to go or what to do.

Press on to Richmond, J-Mo, and Will will put to rest the mystery of what to do.


Posted by: Knecht Ruprecht | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 8:05 PM
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At this rate, I'm going to stay in the Cactus Room until the attendants come for me.


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 8:07 PM
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Pars, have you been to the Hornby Festival? A real hoot.


Posted by: Napi | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 8:07 PM
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280: Join me in my ignorance!

273 may be right: embrace it and go for the cold windy beach thing, wind whipping your hair, evenings by the fire. Maybe? I think the woodsy areas up north really will be muddy, grey, and dismal, or downright still in snow.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 8:07 PM
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280: The Gulf coast? The So. Carolina coast? Appalachia?


Posted by: bitchphd | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 8:08 PM
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Shower rod + dark blue flat sheet I never use = privacy.

Now I can spy on the condemned house without being seen.


Posted by: eb | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 8:09 PM
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289: might I recommend a webcam?


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 8:10 PM
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Awesome, EB. Glad it worked out.


Posted by: bitchphd | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 8:12 PM
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286: I haven't. I was there for a couple of weeks just before July 4th, just before the tourist season starts. Weather was still fantastic, and it was just the locals, which from what I understand is kind of a good thing.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 8:19 PM
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The result is the heaviest opaque covering over any window under his direct control (often meaning a blanket hung over a plain rod). Darkness rules.

That's insane. The more unobstructed light the better. Filtered light depresses me/makes me sleepy. I have big windows in nearly every room and I almost never close the curtains or lower the blinds. Jesus, I'm claustrophobic enough as it is. Of course, I live high above Our Fair City, so it isn't as if anyone's gonna see me naked and if they do--well, that's their treat.


Posted by: Populuxe | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 8:19 PM
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286/etc. Hornby is beautiful. That whole part of the continent, really.


Posted by: | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 8:20 PM
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253: interesting!


Posted by: Cryptic Ned | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 8:21 PM
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parsimon: well, it's really changed over time with the tourists. There are more out of the way places though, not so far away. I've spent days and days on the north island & mainland coast or the smaller gulf islands etc., hardly seeing a soul.


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 8:23 PM
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Who wrote 294? Hornby is stunning, yep. A little isolated.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 8:25 PM
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Reading this thread, I seem to have unusual views towards light. I like direct natural light, but I like to be able to block it if I want to for some reason. I don't like reflections of the inside of the room at night, so I close the curtains/blinds when I'm awake at night. If I can get direct sunlight in the morning I open the curtains/blinds slightly just before going to bed.

The exception was when I lived in a big apartment building right across from another big apartment building in grad school. I didn't like to open the blinds on whichever window I sat in front of because I'd find myself looking out at a wall of windows.

(Also, first floors, which I hate, are another exception. I almost always leave the windows covered in those places. Every first floor room I've ever had has left me feeling trapped.)


Posted by: eb | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 8:25 PM
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297: Whups, that was me.

If you grow up in that part of the world, Hornby seems pretty well populated as these things go. Maybe not like Saltspring, but still pretty busy. BC is just kind of like that though. I have trouble conveying it to people here. Take a place bigger than Texas, with a population less than Houston. Put almost all the people in one place, and most of what's left in another place... both on the southern border. As a result, if you head north at all, just a little, it just opens right up.


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 8:30 PM
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296: There are more out of the way places, but it becomes increasingly difficult to make a living. It's not the tourists per se, it's people from the big island or the mainland buying up property on the smaller islands and rendering housing unavailable. It sucks: I have friends on Hornby who have been leaving in increasing numbers in recent years.

But yeah, if you can manage it, you can move to whatever-that-island-is that's off the grid. Live in a yurt.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 8:31 PM
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I should add to 300: that sounds mostly negative. Truth is, sure, a local population of 700 or 800 is, shall we say, perfectly serviceable, not horribly isolated.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 8:42 PM
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Soup, it all depends on what floats your boat. Hornby is nice for the benefits of civilization it offers, and those black sand dollars at Tribune Bay. Obviously, there are many more remote places a person can be, if remote is the point of the exercise.

Pars, where do the Hornby people go? Quadra? Cortez? Further into the wild? Or simply to Parksville, Powell River. Courtenay, or Nanaimo?

(I've noted before that my folks have a house north of Qualicum, and Hornby dominates the view. That makes me part of the problem in the same way that, by definition, everything I like is a thing that white people like.)


Posted by: | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 8:42 PM
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a few Hornby pictures here just for reference.


Posted by: | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 8:49 PM
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Late March. Charleston or Savannah are starting to be nice then. I really like the Montauk or Mystic ideas.


Posted by: md 20/400 | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 9:00 PM
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Your own personal growth
Some growth to hear your prayers
Some growth who cares
Your own personal growth
Some growth to hear your prayers
Some growth who's there.


Posted by: redfoxtailshrub | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 9:00 PM
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Ah, John Cash.


Posted by: md 20/400 | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 9:03 PM
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The Hornby people go to Nanaimo, Courtenay; or Saltspring; or back down to Victoria or Vancouver where they may well have come up from; or farther away. Not to the smaller islands that I know of, because they're leaving Hornby because they can't make a living any more. A community like that needs to keep children and elders in the loop, and the school enrollment is dropping; the infrastructure has had some problems in the last few years, ferry rates increasing, the underwater electrical cables broke down a year or two ago and left a lot of people crowding around community woodstoves for a couple of weeks in the middle of winter, and the coop gave away its freezer food to the needy. You get the idea.

It's not an emergency situation all of a sudden, just a slow crawl.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 9:03 PM
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307 sounds right to me --- I haven't been there for ages but the writings been on the wall for a while. The economics are difficult, and as pars says the schools are key.

I wasn't disagreeing with any of it, just noting that Hornby was one of the more active places, so not what I would thing of as isolated, is all.


Posted by: soup biscuit | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 9:08 PM
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309

305: Jesus this mole has been itching. I should really get it checked out.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 9:08 PM
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303: Napi, you're killing me. I spent a day on Helliwell. And that's Big Trib, not Little Tribune Bay (snert, teasing ya. Big Trib's for tourists; Little Trib's for optional nudity. I'll see if I can find a pic).


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 9:11 PM
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Pseud slippage by proxy @ 310?


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 9:13 PM
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I thought there'd been some pseud slippage already there.

If not, can someone redact, please?


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 9:19 PM
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Ah, so here: Hornby pics, Little Trib, etc.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 9:21 PM
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309: That's a little personal, don't you think?


Posted by: redfoxtailshrub | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 9:22 PM
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314: little personal, big growth. It all comes out in the wash rapture.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 9:24 PM
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ISO big growth who knows how to use it. Itching a plus.


Posted by: redfoxtailshrub | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 9:26 PM
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What should the growth know how to use?


Posted by: Cryptic Ned | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 9:27 PM
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Its big growthy girthy size, obviously!


Posted by: redfoxtailshrub | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 9:29 PM
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He's got growth / he knows how to use it
He never begs / just suffers dramatic weight loss and is eventually shocked by the results of a tragically delayed MRI

MAN, I love that song. ZZ Top could rock.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 9:33 PM
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319 reminds me... anyone heard from Brock lately?


Posted by: Josh | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 9:36 PM
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It's pretty thin already, I wouldn't sweat the slippage.

Pars, I've been to both Tribs over the 27 years we've had a place out there. I burn pretty easy, though, so tend to go the more modest route. That and, you know, cold water.


Posted by: Carp | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 9:45 PM
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Carp you should really go to Burning Man one of these times.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 9:49 PM
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Yeah, I was wondering about Brock too.


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 9:50 PM
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321: I was teasing. I've actually not been to Big Trib. Little Trib was about a 10 minute walk from my friend's house anyway. I burn easily as well. You know that in the local scene, the Big Trib/Little Trib thing is like a town vs. gown thing.

Oh wait, you went to a Rainbow Gathering?! Nevermind Sifu, he things everybody should go to Burning Man and fry to a crisp.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 10:03 PM
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I certainly recommend sunblock.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 10:08 PM
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Tweety, if you ever want to go to PDF here in Delaware, let me know. There's a Spring and a Fall event.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 03- 1-08 10:29 PM
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Sifu, the 1981 version probably would've tried it. Except for not liking the desert much. The 2008 version thinks renting a movie at the grocery store, rather than at the blockbuster, is out on the cutting edge.

Speaking of which, I'd entertain nominations for movies made in this century that are worse than Heath Ledger's Casanova. If any.


Posted by: Napi | Link to this comment | 03- 2-08 12:00 AM
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Sifu: Thank you, thank you!


Posted by: David Weman | Link to this comment | 03- 2-08 3:45 AM
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the, a
254 i don't know i did not look
295 thanks
309 yes, you definitely should that mole have checked, i work on melanoma cells those are really fast growing, knock knock on wood
314 personal is bad? is this Unfogged policy? i did not know, i'll take note


Posted by: read | Link to this comment | 03- 2-08 6:34 AM
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read 309 was a joke, don't you worry about me.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 03- 2-08 6:46 AM
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So was 314. It was all just punning on "Personal Growth".


Posted by: redfoxtailshrub | Link to this comment | 03- 2-08 6:58 AM
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or shrinkage, as the case may be.


Posted by: Nápi | Link to this comment | 03- 2-08 12:43 PM
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