Re: It's Called "Hair" After All

1

I don't think one can grow a truly serious bush in eight weeks. But yes, an attempt should have been made, a nod to coverage at least.


Posted by: A White Bear | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 9:43 PM
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2

I can grow back hair thick enough for brushing in six weeks.


Posted by: MH | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 9:46 PM
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3

Ogged, is that you?


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 9:49 PM
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4

If you haven't hit 35 yet, don't assume it won't happen to you.


Posted by: MH | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 10:03 PM
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I don't think one can grow a truly serious bush in eight weeks.

Surely there are hairpieces and/or makeup artists ingenious enough to make them work. This is a market just waiting to happen.


Posted by: Robust McManlyPants | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 10:11 PM
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Yeah! Merkins! Where where they?


Posted by: Stanley | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 10:11 PM
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7

er, "were"


Posted by: Stanley | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 10:12 PM
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8

I swim at pools in the East Bay and my locker room companions strike me as a bunch of hippies. I can confirm that they do not have Brazilians.


Posted by: Megan | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 10:14 PM
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9

Google image searching "merkin" is less interesting that I had hoped, but this one's making me laugh. Because I'm twelve.


Posted by: Stanley | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 10:16 PM
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10

Stanley's right. Given a little forethought, they could have made hair a Merkin institution.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 10:18 PM
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11

On the other hand, maybe the whole cast got together and took a vote about what to do about the pubic hair thing. That'd be even more authentic!


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 10:19 PM
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12

Do they make merkins for gherkins?


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 10:22 PM
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12: We have only lurkin' gherkin 'round these parts. So we may never know.


Posted by: Stanley | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 10:30 PM
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14

I can't tell if you're being sincere, or smirkin'.


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 10:34 PM
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Sincere. It's irkin' the hell out of me.


Posted by: Stanley | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 10:36 PM
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16

A thousand people lurkin' just opted out.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 10:39 PM
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17

I should be workin' but I'm shirkin' workin'.


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 10:39 PM
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18

Yeah, me, too. Just jerkin' around, watching old Star Trek, or "Captain Kirkin'", as I call it.


Posted by: Stanley | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 10:42 PM
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In favor of cooking turducken.


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 10:43 PM
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20

I am gellin' as well!

Oh. Oh, darn.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 10:44 PM
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21

As well as can be expected, anyway.


Posted by: Cryptic ned | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 10:45 PM
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22

Optimally, you would be chillin' like a villain Bob Dylan on penicillin. Alas.


Posted by: Stanley | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 10:45 PM
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23

Suboptimally, you can chill like a civilian


Posted by: heebie-geebie | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 10:50 PM
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24

I'm drinking rye.


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 10:54 PM
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25

So am I.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 10:54 PM
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26

-sigh-


Posted by: Wrongshore | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 10:56 PM
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27

Beer for me. I'm doing taxes.


Posted by: MH | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 10:56 PM
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28

I lied. Actually, I have consumed all the rye in my glass.


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 10:56 PM
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29

I assume that the well-groomed new Hair smells like it looks. More fresh-smelling bathing bathing products than patchouli, pot and body odor.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 10:58 PM
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30

As opposed to just bathing products.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 11:00 PM
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31

For some reason Hair and Footloose have been filed in the same mental drawer; additionally, that particular drawer seems to be right next to the drawer for Grease, and the whole thing's causing me some major cognitive dissonance.


Posted by: Stanley | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 11:03 PM
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32

I'm about to be drinking really cheap wine! Who else is excited?!?


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 11:03 PM
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33

28 -- A firkin? That would be a big damn glass.


Posted by: CharleyCarp | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 11:03 PM
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34

I AM SUPER DUPER EXCITED


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 11:04 PM
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35

YAY!! ME TOO!


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 11:07 PM
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36

I mean, how cheap? They're selling some decent something-something-colony wine around here for like $3.50.


Posted by: Stanley | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 11:08 PM
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37

I don't think one can grow a truly serious bush in eight weeks.

Not with that defeatist attitude, you won't.


Posted by: apostropher | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 11:09 PM
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38

I'm drinking coffee.


Posted by: teofilo | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 11:10 PM
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39

EIGHT WEEKS is not long enough? Come on, it just has to be plausible to the audience.


Posted by: Cryptic ned | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 11:12 PM
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40

Come on, it just has to be plausible hirsuitable to the audience.

Fixed.


Posted by: Stanley | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 11:14 PM
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41

Remember that spray stuff they used to advertise for balding men? That might work at the distances involved here.


Posted by: MH | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 11:14 PM
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42

At this time of night, teo? You'll never sleep soundly like that.


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 11:16 PM
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43

I am always impressed with people who can drink caffeine after 6 without then staying up all night.


Posted by: Parenthetical | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 11:18 PM
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44

42: Yeah, I know. Luckily I don't have to be at work tomorrow until 8:30.


Posted by: teofilo | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 11:19 PM
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45

36: oh, yeah, not that cheap. Trader Joe's. Night Train... well, that's the past.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 11:19 PM
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46

8:30 is about the latest I like to leave home for the train.


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 11:25 PM
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47

I definitely try to be half-asleep and browsing blogs on my phone by 8:30.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 11:27 PM
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48

That must be quite a challenge.


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 11:28 PM
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49

Hey! It looks like I'm gonna be on (local) TV next week! Beard trimmage? One wonders, and it seems vaguely related to the post. I'm leaning: nope.


Posted by: Stanley | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 11:30 PM
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50

Definitely nope.


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 11:31 PM
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51

49: nope.

48: you bet!


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 11:32 PM
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52

Because it's local news, I'm tempted to be all weird-emphatic, "Newz-doooodz. This is my music beard, man!" But my band mates will probably hate me for it. Decisions.


Posted by: Stanley | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 11:35 PM
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53

So what's the context?


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 11:37 PM
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54

Which band?


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 11:39 PM
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55

Sifu, we're playing a kinda big show locally. They're "profiling" us in our practice space, whatever that means.

ben, it's the band you don't like.


Posted by: Stanley | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 11:39 PM
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56

Better to say it's not the band I do like. I don't think I have an opinion on the other one. Oh wait I did listen to some tracks once. I can't remember what I thought.


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 11:40 PM
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57

56: You didn't really like it but offered an honest critique. And then you promised to send me a lot of money, which, by the by, I still haven't received.


Posted by: Stanley | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 11:43 PM
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58

It's in the mail.


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 11:43 PM
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59

55: it's about the band? Good lord no don't shave your facial hair.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 11:43 PM
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60

58-9 have allayed my concerns and we can keep talking about musical theatre now.


Posted by: Stanley | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 11:45 PM
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61

You know what's a super weird musical? Meet Me In St. Louis. I mean, what's the point?


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 04-14-09 11:52 PM
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62

From a NYT article I'm to lazy to link to about some vegan dude who wrote a book:

He chatted with every member of the staff who came near, including a busboy he addressed in Spanish until the young man told him he was actually from Nepal. Mr. Masson began serenading him with the Bhagavad-Gita.

Somebody punch this guy in the face.


Posted by: jms | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 12:24 AM
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63

That sounds like one condescending guy. Also, the article describes him as "hollow-cheeked", as a marker of vibrant health in a 68-year-old.


Posted by: Cryptic ned | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 12:28 AM
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64

Somebody link!


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 12:30 AM
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65

I'm not your puppet, Sifu Tweety.


Posted by: jms | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 12:32 AM
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66

I think I liked Meet Me In St. Louis, but I think maybe I have it confused with Easter Parade? One of them is very sweet and sentimental; in the other one, she gets married to a super old dude, maybe Fred Astaire. But neither are particularly pointful, although if you are looking for pointfulness in a musical you are probably wasting your time.


Posted by: jms | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 12:34 AM
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67

if you are looking for pointfulness in a musical you are probably wasting your time

I do not... can not!.. believe this.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 12:36 AM
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68

Just google part of the quote, gosh.

Of course J.M.S.'s failure to link seems inexplicable, but the precautionalry pronciple dictates that I avoid linking too.


Posted by: Cryptic ned | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 12:37 AM
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69

I can't google. I don't have any arms!


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 12:39 AM
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70

How do you smell?


Posted by: Nakku | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 12:49 AM
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70: I store my armpits in my crotch. Look, pal, it's personal.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 12:51 AM
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72

First you tell me to look, then you say it's personal. Indian giver (of permission to look at one's crotch).


Posted by: Cryptic ned | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 12:58 AM
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73

Cheap wine is intrinsically boring wine. What is this modern obsession with hairlessness? Also, why should any three sentences in one comment have anything to do with each other?


Posted by: Jesurgislac | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 1:39 AM
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74

Cheap wine is intrinsically boring wine.

Not so. It's boring if you're looking for an intellectual or aesthetic experience from it. In its place, e.g. cold in a tumbler, with a cheap lunchtime menu in the Barri Gothic, it can be extremely invigorating.


Posted by: OneFatEnglishman | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 1:44 AM
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75

But does the cast use unisex bathrooms? How could this thread have missed the important question?


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 2:45 AM
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76

||
For the Texans here: Did the resolution reaffirming Texas' sovereignty under 10th Amendment get much play down there?

Gov. Parry: We think it's time to draw the line in the sand and tell Washington that no longer are we going to accept their oppressive hand in the state of Texas. That's what this press conference, that's what these Texans are standing up for. There is a point in time where you stand up and say enough is enough, and I think Americans, and Texans especially have reached that point.
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Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 3:35 AM
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77

nothing that makes you say YIKES can be an intrinsically boring experience


Posted by: tierce de lollardie | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 4:15 AM
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78

76:My dogs & I argue about it all the time.

I mean, what, I don't get a Dallas newspaper, the TV News typically runs with highspeed chases and missing white girls, and I don't like tea.

Thirty years ago I had some feeling for Texas as a place. Now I can't even wrap my mind around DFW as any kind of unified concept.

Secession wasn't really my plan for escaping America.


Posted by: bob mcmanus | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 4:25 AM
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78. Presumably in the case of any state seceding these days the first thing that would happen is that federal troops would be inserted to secure any nuclear installations.

So I wouldn't hold your breath.


Posted by: OneFatEnglishman | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 4:36 AM
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80

||

Fuck Juan Williams!

He just said on Morning Edition/NPR that since Obama has 27% approval among self-identified Republicans, 88% approval among Democrats, and 60% approval among Independents, that he's "highly polarizing." Give me a break. What percentage of the population self identifies as Republican now?

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Posted by: Bostoniangirl | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 6:32 AM
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Thirty years ago I had some feeling for Texas as a place. Now I can't even wrap my mind around DFW as any kind of unified concept.

This makes so much more sense now that I figured out that DFW is not David Foster Wallace.


Posted by: essear | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 6:53 AM
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To the point of the post, how old does Hair have to be before they can set it in different places and eras like they do with Shakespeare productions? We can open up a whole world of period merkins.

On a related note, I woke up this morning with a mean pompadour.


Posted by: Mo MacArbie | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 7:33 AM
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Fuck Juan Williams!

What, all of us? At once? Is this consensual?

I woke up this morning with a mean pompadour.

Make her some good French coffee and she'll stop being mean.


Posted by: Jesurgislac | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 7:55 AM
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Actually—as I'm going to have to hasten to add for some time now that no political statement is implied and is in fact denounced—I'm a tea drinker.


Posted by: Mo MacArbie | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:08 AM
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82.1:Over my dead body.

Importance of Being Ernest? Separate Lives? Duchess of Malfi?

I think I see more value in keepin literature in its context, even at the cost of accessibility. What is universal is how a work of art related to its contemporaeous culture, and that an originalist(?) presentation helps by alienating us from our own culture.

I'm guessing there are two audiences for Hair>/i>, the older nostalgists and the younger tourists/anthopologists/whatever. Neither are served by updating. And Forman was the Devil.


Posted by: bob mcmanus | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:18 AM
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86

76: God, Republicans are such children.


Posted by: JRoth | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:19 AM
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87

Like, Oh, I hear a whiny, pathetic crying - is that a Republican in my house? Oh, no, it's just my 9 month old BABY.

Who, incidentally, could do a better job running the Federal government than most Republicans.


Posted by: JRoth | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:20 AM
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78: Actually bob, I realize that I did not even think of you as one of the Texans here when I asked that. You are simply a citizen of humanity to me, defying place and time (well, other than an unfortunate boomer defensiveness that creeps in on occasion).


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:21 AM
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89

When are we going to start seeing funny pictures from the tea parties? I am impatient!


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:23 AM
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90

Sorry about the typos, mispellings, grammatical errors, html mistakes, stylistic barbarisms, and general pre-literaracy.


Posted by: bob mcmanus | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:26 AM
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I think I see more value in keepin literature in its context, even at the cost of accessibility.

I saw a production of The Relapse a few years ago, a play with as much quick banter back and forth as you like. All the actors under 40 enunciated their lines with the sort of careful awe you'd expect in an amateur production of Hamlet, because it was a "Classic". They killed it dead. I've never seen anything so tiresomely sesquipedalian in my life.


Posted by: OneFatEnglishman | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:31 AM
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Will, (reposted from 80 in the Hair thread):

Fuck Juan Williams!

He just said on Morning Edition/NPR that since Obama has 27% approval among self-identified Republicans, 88% approval among Democrats, and 60% approval among Independents, that he's "highly polarizing." Give me a break. What percentage of the population self identifies as Republican now?

[As an aside, what's the html code for getting indented text in a smaller font? eb uses it all the time. I know that House Style requires it for quotations from books and other off-blog text.]


Posted by: Bostoniangirl | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:33 AM
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93

defying place and time

Oh my god, something something
I'm walking in space
Out there they try to enndddd this beauty
How dare they try to ennnddd this beauty?

I don't much consider myself much of a Texan, but just another Metroprole or sumpin. The Walmarts, Starbucks, and Borders do not have Stetsons and Longhorns.

Texas is a little different, with no state income tax, and lower services, multiple metropolises financed with sales & property taxes, I think there is more independence and less ties to state politics than in other states.


Posted by: bob mcmanus | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:33 AM
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94

and general pre-literaracy

Indeed.


Posted by: bill | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:34 AM
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95

92: crap


Posted by: Bostoniangirl | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:34 AM
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96

86, 87: Exactly. And it shows in the "Obama is polarizing" trope that BG mentions as well. What is infuriating is that there are some pretty interesting developments going on in the national political scene, but the media insist on still covering it as a "he said/she said who's to know which?" manner.

Simplicio: Republicans say that the Defense budget has been cut, Democrats say it hasn't; how could we ever figure out which is right?
Salviati: Here is the budget; see for yourself.
Simplicio: But Republicans say the budget has been cut. Here is a Republican.
Republican: The Defense budget has been cut.
Simplicio: Has Obama delivered on his promise of biparttisanship? Next up, Pirates!!!


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:41 AM
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97

The real problem is that the goddamn defense budget should be cut. There's a hysterical, bedwetting militarist demographic out there, plus a well-fed pro war propaganda machine, plus a lot of military plants in the media, plus an enormous multi-trillion-dollar "defense" establishment, plus a lot of bought Congressmen, plus a Democratic Party committed to matching Republican militarism tit for tat.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:47 AM
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98

"military spokesmen planted in the media"


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:49 AM
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99

97: No kidding. I'd be willing to forgive Obama on a lot of other fronts if he actually came in and slashed the defense budget, but on this as with so much else, he looks indistinguishable from the rest of the corporate/political establishment.


Posted by: apostropher | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:52 AM
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91:I know, I know. We don't want Sophocles performed in the original Greek.

I am just imagining say La Boheme and Hair and Withnail & I and Naked and Rent with all the contingencies and localisms removed soas to be comprehensible to an audience in Mumbai.

So I am pro-furpieces.


Posted by: bob mcmanus | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:54 AM
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Well, I guess I wouldn't mind if they kept making nuclear subs for a couple more years until mom retires.

But then it would be great if they could beat those into nuclear bulldozers at some point.


Posted by: Mo MacArbie | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:56 AM
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97: Yes, good point, but I don't see that as an unrelated problem. If there can't be a straight discussion of easily verifiable facts because the Republican framing gets consideration no matter how provable wrong it is, what chance of a decent discussion on what an appropriate level of military spending is for "the last remaining superpower with an opposition party comprised of whining criminally-minded psychopaths".


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:57 AM
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103

I'm imagining Hair in the Romantic or Victorian eras. Disraeli meets Disraeli Gears.


Posted by: Mo MacArbie | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:58 AM
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99: I'm disappointed, but in the political climate of "stimulus" spending I'm willing to cut him more slack than I would otherwise. And the attempt to at least "rationalize" is a worthy first step (and in itself uncovers many of the structural political problems related to reducing defense spending).


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:59 AM
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on the OP, they should be ashamedof those landing strips in that context. let your furry freak flag fly, people. also, the guy in the NYT article is a fucking tool.


Posted by: alameida | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:02 AM
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Posted by: | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:03 AM
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||
[As an aside, what's the html code for getting indented text in a smaller font? eb uses it all the time. I know that House Style requires it for quotations from books and other off-blog text.]

<blockquote>Quoted test goes here! Remeber that you must insert a blockquote pair after every paragraph as the unfogged comment processor closes all open tags at the end of every paragraph. Also you should remember that using blockquote adds an extra newline, so you should start your paragraphs immediately after a close blockquote without inserting a return.</blockquote><blockquote>Like this!</blockquote>

Which should look like:

Quoted test goes here! Remeber that you must insert a blockquote pair after every paragraph as the unfogged comment processor closes all open tags at the end of every paragraph. Also you should remember that using blockquote adds an extra newline, so you should start your paragraphs immediately after a close blockquote without inserting a return.
Like this!
max
['Pardon the techno-ese.']
|>


Posted by: max | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:07 AM
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108

Or how about setting it in the Paris Commune?


Posted by: Mo MacArbie | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:09 AM
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109

108: Or the veldt?


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:14 AM
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110

Thanks, max. I did use blockquote in 92, but it didn't shrink. I tried it again, and it worked.


Posted by: Bostoniangirl | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:14 AM
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111

111: Not e-Leonardo?


Posted by: oudemia | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:21 AM
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112

We don't want Sophocles performed in the original Greek.

Not exclusively, I suppose, but otherwise, why not?


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:26 AM
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113

112. Seen it. Chiefly it's incomprehensible. Unless you know the play in question very well, you have no idea what's going on, because there's no actual action as such, so even if you're familiar with the plot you're never quite sure where they've got to.

And... Ancient Greek is almost as different from modern Greek as Latin is from Italian, so nobody speaks it. Even if you read it fluently, you're not familiar with hearing it.

And... Tragedy should be heavily reliant on the music, and most of what is claimed to be known about 5th century music is largely speculation.

And... The never ending arguments about pronunciation. Modern Greeks insist on pronouncing it as if it was modern Greek, which is totally wrong headed. OTOH Classical Greek seems to have been tonal, which makes it hard for westerners anyway...

Interesting to try it, but it palled after about 20 minutes.


Posted by: OneFatEnglishman | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:38 AM
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112:Cause nobody knows what it sounded like?

Nah, I not too long ago watched part of production of Bacchae where they did their best. Subtitles were provided.

I just recently learned about the euphemism "uranist" in late 19th century Britain.


Posted by: bob mcmanus | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:42 AM
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Uranist was coined by Edward Carpenter wasn't it? Fascinating bloke - a key link in the chain which connects Walt Whitman to Alan Ginsburg by 4 sexual encounters.


Posted by: OneFatEnglishman | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:45 AM
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italian people also pronounce latin as if it were italian (unsuprisingly, but they are doctrinaire about it) I got into a big argument with an italian guy once who couldn't accept that the "c" in "caesar" wasn't pronounced "ch" as in "cesare", and insisted airily that 1500 years (or whatever) "wasn't a long enough time for such a dramatic change to happen." I was like, what about the entire development of latin into french, spanish, romanian etc.? later I realized that I had overlooked an iron-clad refutation, to wit: something spelled "c-a..." would be pronounced "k" even in modern italian. I'm still annoyed about it now and the argument happened like 9 years ago.


Posted by: alameida | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:46 AM
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Oudemia knows better than I, but there's been a wealth of scholarship on the sound of Ancient Greek and on performance practice. I've seen it done on an amateur level, and it's pretty interesting. Sure, you have to know the play, but the same is true of Noh or opera or several other performance traditions.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:46 AM
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ancient greek wasn't tonal but it did have pitch accents; I think people actually have a reasonably secure understanding of how it sounded but it's rare that anyone applies it and pronounces things that way when studying greek. unlike sanskrit where there are lots of religious indians who still speak it now.


Posted by: alameida | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:49 AM
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"This is the '70s, people! Folks want to see some foliage!"
-Jill Anderson and Tim Siragusa, from the musical How Ghetto Claus Funked Christmas


Posted by: minneapolitan | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:49 AM
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113:Even if you read it fluently, you're not familiar with hearing it.

Subvocalism! Probably hearing modern Greek, but oudemia is hearing something.

113.4:It did sound very different, although I am not sure if it was modern or an attempt at Attic. I thought it was performance style, but come to think of it, the feeling I had was kinda Noh, so maybe it was tonal.


Posted by: bob mcmanus | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:49 AM
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Ancient Greek was tonal? Huh.


Posted by: Bave Dee | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:50 AM
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the music is really the stumbling block, I think.


Posted by: alameida | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:52 AM
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i *think* uranist and uranian were actually coined by some german fellow, but carpenter def used them


Posted by: tierce de lollardie | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:58 AM
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122. Agreed. But agreeing what pronunciation to compromise on isn't easy either.

118. Also, I concede, not tonal like Chinese languages, but (I don't have Greek font) e.g. eimi paroxytone and eimi properispomenon are only distinguished by pitch and mean totally different things.


Posted by: OneFatEnglishman | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:59 AM
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Sanskrit produced great phoneticists, partly for mystical reasons -- the phonemes ("letters") as a group are one of the 75 dharmas. The "Om" that people chant is one of the Sanskrit phonemes, given a religious interpretations.

Many of the Buddhist languages have carefully-don phonemic writing systems, notably Korean. In many cases phonemes that sound similar look similar, e.g. "p" and "b".

Under the Mongols a Tibetan monk devised a skript that could phonetically transcribe most of the languages of the empire (probably Tibetan, Mongol, Turkish, Chinese, and Persian, at least), making all the distinctions that any of them made.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 10:02 AM
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116: This makes me insane, too. Catholic school kids learn to pronounce their Latin that way as well. Modern Greeks pronounce ancient Greek just precisely like their own language (betas are vees, most of the vowels sound like eta -- heh, the British do that one too) and it became a mini-vogue among classics grad students to do this. Drove me mad (the grad students, not the Greeks, who can do as they please, but, I mean, I don't read Chaucer the same way I read the New York Times).
117/18: Yes -- not tonal, but pitch accents. I cannot do it *at all.* -- and wow, Amazon is overcompensating! I just went to look up the title of an acquaintance's book on this (a bland name) and several of the results are gay pr0n with no obvious relation to the search terms.


Posted by: oudemia | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 10:09 AM
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76:For the Texans here: Did the resolution reaffirming Texas' sovereignty under 10th Amendment get much play down there?

Speaking as an 8th generation Texan (or depending on how far you are willing to extend ancestry backwards, nth generation Texan) who likes the land (but never ever the Lege), but who is, sadly, not in Texas (and also sadly not in New Mexico, or California or some place west of the Mississippi), I haven't heard a word of this shit.

(Is that enough conditionals?)

I will say that I have always referred to the Gov. as Rick 'Human Pet Rock' Perry, so this newest ploy seems particularly Perry-esque. He is apparently engaging in it because he's trying to ward off a primary challenge from some other nut who has seccession as his #1 priority. And I must say, if there is something that drooling, brain-damaged, half-witted excuse for a retarded monkey is good at, it's playing Republican internal politics.

My reaction to reading the resolution in question is, 'My fucking God, these idiots are going for Nullification again. Holy fucking shit.'

max
['I guess you would call it low retarded monkey cunning.']


Posted by: max | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 10:10 AM
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My Sanskrit prof knew Brahmins who raised their kid with Sanskrit as his first language. Not a lot of other kids to talk to in that situation.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 10:10 AM
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128: Montaigne writes about how his father would only speak to him in Latin as a kid and hired teachers and caretakers to do the same. It's actually a pretty touching essay, the starting point of which, if I recall, is how he burst into Latin when first informed of his father's death.


Posted by: oudemia | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 10:13 AM
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Multiple persons have raised children with (their idiolect of) Latin as a first language; some of these people, I'm told, have gone on to be classicists and tried to pull rank in disputes by claiming to be native speakers, which is obviously absurd but still neat.


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 10:13 AM
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116, 126: You find variations with church Latin as well. Pronunciation differs in recordings of the same plainchant, typically depending on which country the singers are from.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 10:17 AM
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130: I -- praise to the gods with houses on Olympos -- have never met such creature. Apparently Ben Stein's parents did something like this, though.


Posted by: oudemia | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 10:21 AM
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Until the end of the 19th century, Latin was taught in English schools as if it was pronounced like English. I'm old enough to remember old people who still did ("Payter noster quie ez in seelis, sanctifisseetur nomen tewum." "Arma virumqui cano, Troiay quie priemus ab orice...")

Legal Latin remains.


Posted by: OneFatEnglishman | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 10:25 AM
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That's reasonable.


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 10:45 AM
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The Washington Shakespeare Company did a nude MacBeth last year. The director told the actors (and actresses) not to shave or cut any of their hair from when they were selected through the run of the play.


Posted by: jim | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 10:51 AM
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135: "Goddamn it, the ear tufts were why I chose you as Macduff in the first place."


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 10:57 AM
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I've never seen anything so tiresomely sesquipedalian in my life.

The "new hovertext" card gets played a little too easily around here. Still.


Posted by: Wrongshore | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 11:13 AM
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I think it was a novel set in 1940s England, where somebody asked "Do you want to see the written diagnosis and prescription, or should I have the doctor explain it to you when he's free?" and the answer was "My Latin isn't very good, so I'll have to talk to him." That was a surprise.


Posted by: Cryptic ned | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 11:25 AM
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I don't think I've ever heard a group of people singing, or talking in unison, in Latin, and not had them pronounce "excelsis" as "exchelsis", or "pacem" as "pachem". Maybe individual people can go with more accurate pronunciations, but in groups we all default to the lowest commen denominator.


Posted by: Cryptic ned | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 11:38 AM
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139: That's standard pronunciation in ecclesiastical Latin.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 11:41 AM
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Or how about setting it in the Paris Commune?

Oh yes! The climactic performance of "Eyes, Look Your Last" can be set in front of the Mur des Fédérés at Père Lachaise.


Posted by: pain perdu | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 12:25 PM
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When are we going to start seeing funny pictures from the tea parties? I am impatient!

I passed by our local teabagapalooza on my way back from lunch and two sweet old ladies let me photograph them with their tea-bag bedangled sunglasses. I asked if they were teabaggers and they cheerfully shouted "Yes!"

I saw a woman with a Prison Planet t-shirt carrying a huge "No NWO" sign, a couple running a booth devoted to smashing the Fed and the IMF, Christian Exodus prophets carrying "Public Schools Harm Children" signs, "No Socialism" and "God Will Judge America" signs, League of the South reps, and lots of run-of-the-mill Paultards, goldbugs, bros, fratties, chets, and rednecks.


Posted by: Populuxe | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 12:50 PM
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I was pleased to see the most recent NYT piece describe the teabag thing as faux-grassroots (though unlike Krugman, the reporter called it 'game-day grass' rather than 'AstroTurf'). Nobody I've heard on wickedly liberal NPR has bothered to mention that.

I wrapped up my taxes before due date this year, but I'm so conditioned by years of frantic last-minute rush that I can't shake the anxious feeling that OMG I have to do my taxes.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 1:01 PM
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My right-wing neighbors are attending the local event (C., if you're still eavesdropping on my comments here, Hi!). One of them had a teabag suspended from her zipper pull. I have to give her credit for moral courage, because PDBS is not the kind of place where one would necessarily feel comfortable advertising one's right-wing convictions. OTOH, I hope she doesn't earnestly believe that her taxes will go up under the Obama plan, because even an elementary grasp of the facts would show that the opposite is the case.


Posted by: KR | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 1:18 PM
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The DC area teabaggers are getting rained on. Drizzled may be more like it, but it's a sign of something. Maybe God's switched sides now that he doesn't have to worry about Dick Cheney.


Posted by: togolosh | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 1:26 PM
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I like John Cole's observation:
"You know what really irritates me about the tea parties? The basic fact that if right now, it were President John McCain and not President Obama, and nothing else had changed, these tea parties wouldn't exist. You know it, I know it, and even the teabaggers know it. It is just such transparent bullshit that it is offensive. The most these guys ever did during the last lost eight years was put a limp Porkbusters logo on their website, but now that we have President Malcom X George McGovern Shabazz, they are freaking out like there is no tomorrow. So absurd."


Posted by: apostropher | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 1:32 PM
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I asked if they were teabaggers and they cheerfully shouted "Yes!"

Oops, guess they didn't get the memo in time:

Unfortunately, it took today's tea party protesters almost two months to get the memo. I mean, an actual memo:

The term "teabagging" has strong sexual connotations. Be wary of anyone with a camera asking you if you are a "teabagger" or if you enjoy "teabagging" or similar leading questions - they are trying to make a fool of you.
The one-page flyer was written by one Ross Kaminsky--a FreedomWorks blogger and contributor to the conservative magazine Human Events--who describes himself as a professional derivative trader and a Heartland Institute fellow.

Posted by: Sir Kraab | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 1:32 PM
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142: Ah, you lucky dog. I wanted to go and watch, but I've taken so much time off in the current pay period that I didn't want to add a few more hours in the middle of a normal workday. (But considering the weather, maybe I wouldn't have gone anyways.) I imagine it was hilarious.


Posted by: Cyrus | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 1:45 PM
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"Be wary of anyone with a camera asking you if you are a "teabagger" or if you enjoy "teabagging" or similar leading questions - they are trying to make a fool of you."

Oh, thanks, Krabb. Now I feel like a heel.

I actually did work for ACORN for about week once and I still have my badge. I was awfully tempted to wear it to the teabaggering today.


Posted by: Populuxe | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 1:58 PM
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"It's Hard to Talk When You're Teabagging"


Posted by: lemmy caution | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 2:31 PM
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Sod American musicals. Listen to this.


Posted by: Jesurgislac | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 2:57 PM
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151 made me cry, but I'm easy. And I generally hate that kind of music.


Posted by: bob mcmanus | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 4:08 PM
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The fact that people who ten years ago would have found brazilians weird now find unshaven pubic hair icky is weird and kind of creepy to me.


Posted by: David Weman | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 4:40 PM
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Which people?


Posted by: Cryptic ned | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 4:41 PM
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152: 151 made me want to shout with glee and chuckle with evil delight, but I think it's kinda sweet that it made you cry.

154: No people I want to know.


Posted by: Jesurgislac | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 4:54 PM
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154: I dunno. Comments I've read in articles, blog comments, etc. It seems like a common attitude, maybe it isn't. If not icky, offputting and definitely weird.


Posted by: David Weman | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 4:59 PM
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There was a PETA ad awhile ago making some kind of comparison between yukky fur coats and yukky bushy personal areas, I think.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 5:19 PM
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PETA stink.


Posted by: Jesurgislac | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 5:23 PM
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151: Before you dismiss American musicals, you should see Urinetown. It's as if Rodgers and Hammerstein somehow had Malthus's baby.


Posted by: MH | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 5:27 PM
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157: You're kidding me. What a bunch of idiots.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 5:44 PM
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157: Maybe they were just suggesting an economical and animal-friendly way to make a sweater? Weave-your-own could catch on, it just needs the Brooklyn classes and NYT Style section article to get it going.


Posted by: Po-Mo Polymath | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 6:09 PM
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||

Interactive map of job loss since 2007. Pretty scary.

/McManus

|>


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 6:20 PM
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||

I was seriously amused by the road crews that so sweetly set out large signs advising motorists to share the road with bicyclists during road construction. Of course, they put them square in the middle of the bike lanes. Gee, thanks, I feel much safer that because of the sign I'll now have to move into traffic.

|>


Posted by: Parenthetical | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 6:37 PM
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156: This had been my sense of the contemporary attitude as well. Maybe I'm wrong. I'm trying desperately not to be curious about just what the norm is these days.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 6:51 PM
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This is going to end with another round of emailing genitalia pics to neb, isn't it?


Posted by: Not Prince Hamlet | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 6:53 PM
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165: You go first.


Posted by: Walt Someguy | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 6:57 PM
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My camera's in the shop.


Posted by: Not Prince Hamlet | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 6:59 PM
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Actually, only the wide-angle lens, but I don't want to make anyone feel bad.


Posted by: Not Prince Hamlet | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 7:00 PM
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The last one went nowhere. bunch of deadbeats.


Posted by: Cryptic ned | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 7:01 PM
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146

Speaking of which, what has happened to the antiwar protestors?


Posted by: James B. Shearer | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 7:06 PM
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They went away about four or five years ago. It's called learned helplessness.


Posted by: Cryptic ned | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 7:07 PM
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I just read a bunch of history back to the SPanish American war, and I'm not sure that once the federal government and military decide to go to war neither Congress nor the public can do more than delay. And AFAIK, since WWII they really haven't even delayed anything much.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 7:41 PM
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165: This is going to end with another round of emailing genitalia pics to neb, isn't it?

Why? He's too chicken to post 'em.

max
['Bad data type!']


Posted by: max | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 7:41 PM
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Speaking of which, what has happened to the antiwar protestors?

There are a half-dozen regular protests near me. It's the diehard folks, mostly (meaning generally not me) but they're still out there. Come join us sometime.

An old lady was handing out flyers at the train station on the sixth (!) anniversary of the war's start and I looked at her and said wryly, "From your mouth to God's ears."

Bah, now I'm depressed.

(I was trying to figure out why sending a donation to an anti-hunger group makes me feel better, but donating to Fisher House or the like just makes upsets me. The senselessness, yes, but I think it's really the greater sense of personal responsibility. I feel at fault in a terrible, shameful way I don't about hunger.)


Posted by: Witt | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 7:54 PM
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It upsets me enough to destroy my English skills, even.


Posted by: Witt | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 7:55 PM
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170, 171, 174: I believe James is suggesting that "the" antiwar protesters are, or were, the equivalent of the teabaggers in some way.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:04 PM
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176: You spent actual time figuring out what James' point was? I feel for you.


Posted by: Walt Someguy | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:08 PM
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176: Yes, I believe you are correct.

I, on the other hand, was suggesting that since he is now unemployed, and since he may have feelings about his tax dollars being used to pay for ongoing war and associated costs, he might want to join a peace vigil.

Welcome anytime, Shearer. And I mean that sincerely.


Posted by: Witt | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:12 PM
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i confess i was told today i look like a Mexican
my superior mimicry skills! i mean, such a surprise, i thought i look typical Asian, maybe he thought i look a bit like a Native American hence Mexican, well, at least not like Chinese
couldn't wait for Friday to confess


Posted by: read | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:15 PM
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Ogged, is that you?


Posted by: Cryptic ned | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:17 PM
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i thought MH is a new ogged now
i immediately recalled ogged too, but then who told me that, a Ganan, i'm not sure he knows many Mexicans
my sisters are all offline tonight
i wonder why itunes need to update their software so frequently, everytime i charge my phone its downloading something, inconvenient


Posted by: read | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:22 PM
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Speaking of which, what has happened to the antiwar protestors?

James, false equivalence is one of the important tools of the Stupid Right, and it is rightly regarded among decent people as loathsome when more intelligent people, like you, resort to it.

But if you'd care to develop this - if you'd care to actually explain why you think the teabaggers are roughly equivalent to the anti-war crowd (specifically on the issue of political hypocrisy) then I'm certainly prepared to spend a bit of time on the rebuttal.

Otherwise, if you're just bullshitting and blowing smoke, well, don't be too shocked when people find you contemptible.


Posted by: politicalfootball | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:23 PM
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'


Posted by: read | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:24 PM
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I said I could grow back hair if I wanted. Not that I did.


Posted by: MH | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:26 PM
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Ganan

Do you mean from Ghana? Usually in American English we say Ghanaian.

(Don't assume there was too much thought behind what he said. In my experience "Mexican" is the default category for people who have no other way to express "foreign-ness.")


Posted by: Witt | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:28 PM
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who needs to change his/her handle is maybe you, MH
coz everytime i see it, it reminds me of my ex, not very pleasant memories, may i suggest HM, please?


Posted by: read | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:29 PM
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Ghanain, yes


Posted by: read | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:29 PM
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Ghanaian


Posted by: read | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:31 PM
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186: No can do. HM reminds me of Swedish clothing.


Posted by: MH | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:33 PM
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What's wrong with Swedish clothing?


Posted by: teofilo | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:38 PM
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182: No, pf, don't go in there!


Posted by: Walt Someguy | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:38 PM
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Posted by: | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:41 PM
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182

But if you'd care to develop this - if you'd care to actually explain why you think the teabaggers are roughly equivalent to the anti-war crowd (specifically on the issue of political hypocrisy) then I'm certainly prepared to spend a bit of time on the rebuttal.

Seems like you hear less about anti-war protests now that we have a Democratic President. And what about the efforts in Congress to cut off funding? Were they insincere?


Posted by: James B. Shearer | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:41 PM
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Why would HM remind you of Swedish clothing?


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:44 PM
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i looked up, all looks nice, but i'll perhaps will associate MH=Swedish clothing automatically now, with the googled images
so, no direct reminding anymore hopefully


Posted by: read | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:45 PM
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-'ll


Posted by: read | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:47 PM
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Ah, I see.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:47 PM
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Are Tim Horton's really as good as they say? Can a non-Canadian verify?


Posted by: Walt Someguy | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:48 PM
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Now I won't be able to see the letters H and M without thinking of read's ex wearing Swedish clothing. And accompanied by Handel's Messiah, maybe.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:50 PM
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193:Were they insincere?

Apparently we have this thing, see, called a political compromise where we are leaving soonish. If we do not leave soonish I would fully expect a renewed attack by giant goddamn puppets. I would also expect some serious noise and screaming should the people we tortured not be (at a minimum) put on POW-equivalent status.

max
['You will certainly be hearing it from me.']


Posted by: max | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:52 PM
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Shearer, Democrats and liberals are mostly criticizing Obama on civil liberties, where he has done things well worth criticizing. (See Glenn Greenwald). Democrats and liberals are also criticizing him on the bailout, and to a lesser degree on the stimulus, where he has also done things worth criticizing.

As far as the Iraq War goes, he hasn't seemed to have taken many initiatives one way or another during the THREE WHOLE MONTHS that he's been in office. No one expects him to solve all of his inherited problems immediately.

The reality is quite different than what you are insinuating. Obama is getting a lot of heat from liberals and Democrats. Many of us were doubtful about him a whole year ago.

But no matter how ignorant and wrong you are, you'll continue your fake-Socratic, smugly superior questioning.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:53 PM
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HM violates high fashion's intellectual property rights. If Wobegon had an HM store I'd go right out and buy something from them.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:57 PM
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198: No. They're completely generic. I've been to TH's in both Canada and the US and they are just totally regular mass-produced donuts and mediocre coffee.


Posted by: oudemia | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:59 PM
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When I was in Toronto a couple of months ago I desperately wanted to go to a Tim Horton's. My Canadian friends explained that it wasn't particularly good, just very Canadian.


Posted by: Bave Dee | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 8:59 PM
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We established on the other thread that everything Swedish now sucks, including H&M, since the Swedes' fateful decision to turn away from toplessness after the mid-1980s. Fuck Sweeden.


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:00 PM
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They have Tim Horton's in the US? Where?


Posted by: teofilo | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:02 PM
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Swedish Pop Will Destroy Civilization.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:02 PM
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There are Tim Horton's in Maine. Maybe a few other places.


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:03 PM
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I am shocked that you people are saying this about Tim Horton's.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:04 PM
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Presumably places near the Canadian border, which would explain why I've never seen one.


Posted by: teofilo | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:04 PM
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Emerson gets it. The focus on non-topless, bad-pop-creating Sweden is what has doomed the contemporary left.


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:05 PM
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I've been to TH in upstate NY (near the Canadian border), but also in southern RI, barely above (well, really, east of) the CT border.


Posted by: oudemia | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:09 PM
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Wendy's and Tim Horton's merged (iirc), and there are Timmy's in OH now. Their coffee is decent, and I like their donuts.


Posted by: Cala | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:12 PM
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A Canadian friend of mine went to a Tim Hortons (note the lack of apostrophe, you savages) in Ohio and complained that it was "really bad", so apparently there is some level of quality it normally rises to.


Posted by: Josh | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:13 PM
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213: So you can get a baked potato topped with chili and a donut on the side?


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:14 PM
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Perhaps Tim Hortons will franchise a burrito shop in NM just for Teo.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:16 PM
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I've never noticed a difference between Canadian and USian THs. Maybe the ones in Ontario are really bad, too.


Posted by: oudemia | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:16 PM
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Is Canada or Sweden the more disappointing false idol for the US left? Despite Weman's shocking revelation about the disappearance of topless Swedish women, I'd have to say Canada is worse -- it turns out that a competent socialist state in North America just produces a more boring, more white version of Michigan with better health care.


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:18 PM
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216: Now why would they do that?


Posted by: teofilo | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:21 PM
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Portland's Dunkin Donuts was unionized by the IWW during the early 70s.

Googling for a link, I found that the Mall of America Starbucks was unionized by the IWW just recently.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:21 PM
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Donuts go with everything, Teo, you know that.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:22 PM
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The McDonalds in central Madrid is better than your average McDonalds. It's also better than all Spanish food.

The group Flyleaf is Christian rock, but sound as much unlike Abba as possible. (They sound more like Soundgarten.) I had listened to their songs twenty times before I realized they were all about God, God, God.


Posted by: Walt Someguy | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:22 PM
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Also, there's no toplessness in Canada, apart from Montreal strip clubs and that one beach in Vancouver.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:22 PM
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Sex with bears, Halford. Sex with bears.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:23 PM
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215: Sort of; you might have both chains sharing a building.


Posted by: Cala | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:24 PM
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224: Worst advice I ever got.


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:25 PM
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Donuts go with everything, Teo, you know that.

Sure, but where do the burritos come in?


Posted by: teofilo | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:28 PM
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There was a segment on the local news this evening about one of the "Tea Parties". They interviewed a woman, asking what she was protesting about; among her complaints was the fact that her farm subsidy had been cut. I'm not kidding.


Posted by: zadfrack | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:29 PM
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Actually, I've never been in an H & M. There's a couple around here and I have friends that rave about it ("It's like Ikea, for your ass"), but I never get around to it.


Posted by: MH | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:32 PM
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It's like Ikea, for your ass

This was actually the premise for my assemble-yourself-at-home wooden sex toy business. Unfortunately, it failed after the first year.


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:34 PM
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||
Oh hallelujah, Apocamon is available online again!
|>


Posted by: Josh | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:35 PM
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it turns out that a competent socialist state in North America just produces a more boring, more white version of Michigan with better health care.

(Almost) nobody in Canada thinks of Canada as a socialist state, whether competent or not; that really does seem like an American lefty projection.

Just got back from my home and native land, btw, where there was a story in the local paper about a man who disappeared 13 years ago, and the police assume murder but are now offering a reward for more information and etc. The missing (and presumed murdered) man is described in the newspaper as an "unemployed construction labourer" who was "not a troublemaker" and who was "intelligent and polite." The American Mr. MC was somewhat struck by this description, and said something like, "Wow, that's so Canadian." I think I know what he means, but I can't quite put my finger on why I agree.


Posted by: Mary Catherine | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:35 PM
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228: I suspected that many of them had no idea what they were protesting. America is embarrassing herself.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:36 PM
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i was told today i look like a Mexican

There are probably Mexicans of Mongolian descent -- maybe that's what they meant.


Posted by: CharleyCarp | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:37 PM
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What are you trying to say about my ass?


Posted by: Walt Someguy | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:38 PM
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230: If your company was "Dowels for Dolls", I have a splinter-related complaint.


Posted by: MH | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:40 PM
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It just meant that he probably didn't come to an untimely end because of his rudeness, as is so often the case in that particular culture, but for some unjustified reason.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:42 PM
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218: What's wrong with Sweden?


Posted by: foolishmortal | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:43 PM
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232: MC, to the observer down here in the US, it seems as though assumptions following from socioeconomic class (missing construction labo(u)rer = troublemaker, dumb and crass) are much stronger than they are in Canada, and Canadians are much more careful to attend to any unwarranted assumptions they may harbo(u)r.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:44 PM
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I knew a man once whose Taiwanese wife was often addressed in Spanish when they traveled in Mexico. There's enough variation within the Native Mexican, Chinese, and Mongolian peoples that they overlap, even though on the average they aren't the same.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:44 PM
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238: I'm focused on the lack of toplessness, Emerson's anger stems from their role in the production of crappy pop and Christian music, and I'm going to go out on a limb and say that Dsquared hates the Wallenbergs. Plus, they've "jumped the shark." The backlash starts here.


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:49 PM
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True story: someone asked my blonde-haired blue-eyed German-accented wife if she was Japanese. People can be dopes.


Posted by: CharleyCarp | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:51 PM
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It's because she's so subservient, which is the stereotype of Japanese women. Was she on her knees tying your shoes for you at the time?


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:53 PM
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Someone on the west coast of Canada once asked me whether Baltimore was on the Great Lakes, near Chicago.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:54 PM
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Also, no sex with bears, though Halford disagrees. (Here's a hint, Bob: bears need a real man to satisfy them).


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:54 PM
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241: That one metal guy killed some dude once, though, and Gustavus Adolphus fucking rules.


Posted by: foolishmortal | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:57 PM
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The Swedes have granted asylum to a Uyghur man formerly imprisoned at Guantanamo, something our bold new American leaders are apparently afraid to do.


Posted by: CharleyCarp | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:58 PM
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241: Don't forget the Sveriges Riksbank Prize in Economic Sciences in Memory of Alfred Nobel.


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:58 PM
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Doesn't Sweden still have ludicrous liquor taxes, even by regional standards?


Posted by: MH | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 9:59 PM
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245 is insensitive to trans people. And, I read a study that said that size actually doesn't matter that much to bears, it's more about romance.


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 10:02 PM
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241: Gustavus Adolphus fucking rules.

Gustavus totally fuckin' rules, fucking hardcore.

max
['However, he is still a Swede. So he is only hardcore in that awful Swedish sense.']


Posted by: max | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 10:06 PM
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That one metal guy killed some dude once

Wrong! That was Varg Vikernes, who is in the NORWEIGAN black metal scene. Our movement is pro-Norway.


Posted by: Robert Halford | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 10:06 PM
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Subservient? I think it's a wrong stereotype, they are really powerful in their households, they decide the spending, family budjet etc and if divorce they are entitled to the half of their husbands' retirement money which is very fair.
Well, good night, all


Posted by: Read | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 10:07 PM
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Stereotypes are often completely false.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 10:10 PM
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It's reality that's false.


Posted by: Walt Someguy | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 10:20 PM
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It's also better than all Spanish food.

Campesino.


Posted by: | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 10:21 PM
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Reality isn't false, just extremely improbable.


Posted by: MH | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 10:21 PM
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257: Like a tornado going through a junkyard reconstructing a Boeing 747.


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 10:28 PM
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I saw that happen back when I worked in a Kansas junkyard. The difficulty is that the FAA won't accept even a perfectly built jet if you don't have any paperwork for it.


Posted by: MH | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 10:36 PM
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Actually, it was a 727. Sorry for the exaggeration.


Posted by: MH | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 10:37 PM
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There's a sense in which the populist vote is up for grabs right now. But it's also not that big yet -- Obama is genuinely popular. If things keep going south for a while, then we'll see.


Posted by: PGD | Link to this comment | 04-15-09 10:53 PM
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Lilya 4-Ever will turn you off Swedes.


Posted by: Wrongshore | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 12:29 AM
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It's also better than all Spanish food.

Either a provocateur or a hopeless lunatic.


Posted by: OneFatEnglishman | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 1:02 AM
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re: 263

Quite.

In the past few years we've done (slightly) more traveling than before, and have visited France, Spain and Italy and eaten in restaurants in all three.

The quality of food in Spain was clearly the highest. We didn't order anything fancy, or eat in expensive places, but almost everything we had was pretty good.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 1:14 AM
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I'm going to go out on a limb and say that Dsquared hates the Wallenbergs

Not true! Very very rich Swedes are almost always extremely nice.


Posted by: dsquared | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 1:16 AM
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264. True enough. Mind, I've seen Brit and American tourists in Spain stymied by ordering the wrong stuff before now. Clue: don't order a paella unless you're on the mediterranean coast. Even if you are, don't order it if you're at an overpriced hotel cafe in the middle of the Ramblas in Barcelona.

It isn't hard.


Posted by: OneFatEnglishman | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 1:30 AM
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re: 266

Yeah, actually, paella was the one thing we ordered that wasn't great. It was perfectly fine, but I've made it better at home.

But the seafood was just absurdly good -- this was in Granada, which isn't on the coast but obviously the province in which it's located has lots of fishing close by. Also, best olives I've ever had.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 1:45 AM
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Well made paella is delicious.

Re: Tim Hortons. I like their coffee just fine for basic coffee, a little less bitter than Dunkin Donuts' (which I also like). I don't love their doughnuyts, but I think that their food is very nice for a road stop. You can get a nice ham sandwich or some soup on a real plate. Much better than Burger King.


Posted by: Bostoniangirl | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 4:53 AM
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budget
i was to watch Lylia forever, then didn't, good
and paella, i've learned recently the word, yet to try
my favourite Swedish group was the Cardigans, from 10 yrs ago, time is so really fast flying
Swedish pop melodies are great, always so very catchy, their folksongs must be great melodical
i didn't look up yet one


Posted by: read | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 5:01 AM
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Well made paella is indeed delicious. So is well made pizza, but that doesn't mean I'd advise people to go to Pizza Hut, or whatever the American equivalent is called.

The problem with eating paella in Spain is that it's the only Spanish dish a lot of tourists have heard of, so mass caterers trading in an ignorant market can and do get away with murder.


Posted by: OneFatEnglishman | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 5:14 AM
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Pizza Hut is an American chain which was, I think, exported to the UK. I've had it in both the U.S. and the U.K., and I think that the U.S. version is less bad. The sauce in England tastes weird, but Pizza Express is fine. I also find the English habit of putting sweet corn on pizza disgusting.


Posted by: Bostoniangirl | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 5:31 AM
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I also find the English habit of putting sweet corn on pizza disgusting.

So do I, but then I find sweet corn in any context except rolled in butter on the cob disgusting. I also deprecate pineapple on pizza. At the lower end of the market in Britain you now get weird crossover products like doner kebab pizza and chicken tikka pizza.

Don't.


Posted by: OneFatEnglishman | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 5:43 AM
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Yeah yuck.

But rolled in butter on the cob, corn is pretty delicious. I don't even need the butter.


Posted by: Bostoniangirl | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 5:47 AM
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At the lower end of the market in Britain you now get weird crossover products like doner kebab pizza and chicken tikka pizza.


Don't.

Unless, of course, it's deep-fried haggis with curry sauce. Which is delicious. I'm not being ironic, or kidding, it really is tasty [almost certainly artery-clogging in the extreme, mind].


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 5:50 AM
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If Pizza Hut in the UK is even worse than Pizza Hut US, I shudder to imagine.


Posted by: redfoxtailshrub | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 5:50 AM
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275. It is (based on American experience 15 years ago), but there are worse still, believe me. Also the low end KFC knock-offs beggar belief.


Posted by: OneFatEnglishman | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 5:52 AM
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The fact that people who ten years ago would have found brazilians weird now find unshaven pubic hair icky is weird and kind of creepy to me.

I have previously proposed a plausible theory on the origins of the trend.


Posted by: KR | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 6:00 AM
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I was in Spain long enough (five weeks) that I feel confident that I just don't like the food. It's not like I ordered paella for 38 consecutive days. I know other people who've had similar experiences. When I was there, I made ex-pats from Latin America who had been living there for a year who never learned to like the food. Other than the smelly cheeses, it's got to be the blandest fucking food in the world. I leave the connection with American stereotypes of British food to the reader.


Posted by: Walt Someguy | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 6:04 AM
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re: 276

Yeah, all the 'Missouri Fried Chicken' type places you get in West London are truly dire.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 6:05 AM
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I leave the connection with American stereotypes of British food to the reader.

You really have no idea lazy shite like that makes me. Bears no connection, frankly, to anything that's been reality for the best part of, well, decades.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 6:09 AM
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Heh. Annoyed enough to leave the word 'angry' out of the preceding comment.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 6:15 AM
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Sorry. Having it explained to me that I just didn't order the right thing made me grouchy.


Posted by: Walt Someguy | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 6:19 AM
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re: 282

Different cuisines suit different people. My overwhelming memory of Spain is of really good quality produce cooked well. Nothing extraordinarily elaborate, but the seafood was stellar, for example.

Rome was the big disappointment for me. I had a couple of really nice meals there, but, overall, the good was pretty disappointing. Nothing actively awful, just a lot of not especially good food.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 6:23 AM
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I found Rome a disappointment too. The one thing I liked was the little lunchcounter places where you could get a beer and a panini.


Posted by: Walt Someguy | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 6:27 AM
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Yeah, the coffee in Rome was good. I had great octopus in a place that looked really unpromising -- touristy, plastic patio furniture, etc., but generally, not brilliant. That said, I liked the place, just as a city.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 6:41 AM
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||

The Obama administration is getting serious about building SUPERTRAINS!

|>


Posted by: pain perdu | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 8:18 AM
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285: I've had great squid, but I've never had even good octopus. How was it prepared?


Posted by: MH | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 8:26 AM
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my pizza local -- which is a microchain of two or three east london outlets called "pizza man" -- has a bewildering array of non-canon menu items, such as "russian" (features lots of kinds of meat and "ninja dust", which is beef mince i think), "frenchman" (features sweet corn and garlic!) and others i have repressed

it is actually pretty good in a kind of rough-and-ready just-round-the-corner way (and very inexpensive)


Posted by: tierce de lollardie | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 8:29 AM
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re: 287

I've had it done loads of ways, but in this case it was sliced and served as a salad with some sort of light citrusy dressing. I don't know how it had been cooked, but the texture was just perfect.

Little baby octopuses are nice whole in salads, but this was clearly a big one -- tentacles about 1cm thick.


Posted by: nattarGcM ttaM | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 8:41 AM
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Octopus Galician style - small pieces grilled with oil and paprika - is nice, for bigger ones.


Posted by: OneFatEnglishman | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 8:51 AM
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I think I know what he means, but I can't quite put my finger on why I agree.

Because insisting that one is intelligent and polite and nice is the Canadian national trait? (Not being nice, but reminding everyone that one did the nice thing.)


Posted by: Cala | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 8:54 AM
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I'll have to give Octopus another try. I do know that I'll never eat it sushi style again.


Posted by: MH | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 9:01 AM
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Not being nice, but reminding everyone that one did the nice thing.

That's a bizarre take on it.


Posted by: hoser | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 9:03 AM
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I have previously proposed a plausible theory on the origins of the trend.

if you're promiscuous shaving helps hygienically, so it's not surprising it's popular in porn.

There are references to shaving and perfuming genitalia in Greek plays from 500 BC.


Posted by: PGD | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 9:09 AM
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286: that's awesome. But this drives me crazy:

With the successful completion of the original phases of the Northeast Corridor (NEC) Transportation Project offering Amtrak's 150 mph train service, known as "Acela," between Washington, New York, and Boston, efforts have expanded beyond the NEC.

The Acela was not successful, not high-speed, and does not go 150 MPH. I don't trust any of this stuff until they can actually make the one rail line in the U.S. that is supposed to be high-speed actually go faster than 80 MPH.


Posted by: PGD | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 9:12 AM
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294: Wouldn't that mean you'd need a new actor for every showing of the play?


Posted by: MH | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 9:13 AM
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I don't trust any of this stuff until they can actually make the one rail line in the U.S. that is supposed to be high-speed actually go faster than 80 MPH.

Hear hear.


Posted by: Bave Dee | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 9:15 AM
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During the Crusades the Muslims were disgusted at the Franks' hairy personal areas. Franks who started to assimilate to the local ways started to shave themselves. Fact.

"What about the Jews?", you may ask. To this I can only say that further study is required.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 9:17 AM
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284:

I've been to Paris
And it ain't that pretty at all
I've been to Rome
Guess what?
I'd like to go back to Paris someday and visit the Louvre Museum
Get a good running start and hurl myself at the wall
Going to hurl myself against the wall
'Cause I'd rather feel bad than feel nothing at all
And it ain't that pretty at all
Ain't that pretty at all


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 9:20 AM
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80 MPH sounds pretty fast to me. The train from Pittsburgh to Philadelphia takes about a third longer than driving there.


Posted by: Cryptic ned | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 9:20 AM
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There are references to shaving and perfuming genitalia in Greek plays from 500 BC.

Which plays? Such things would, I think, violate "tragic decorum." Comedy I am sure -- but mostly to make "fag" jokes, as in haha Cleanthes plucks his pubes.


Posted by: oudemia | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 9:21 AM
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if you're promiscuous shaving helps hygienically, so it's not surprising it's popular in porn.

I thought that it was more that if everything is shorn, everything is easier to see.


Posted by: Cala | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 9:22 AM
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300: It goes fast sometimes! But then it has to slow down and wait for the freight trains to pass, and sometimes it rains and then all the trains go slow.


Posted by: Cala | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 9:24 AM
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The train to from Pitt to Philly is ridiculously slow. We had some friends who said "Lets all take the train and meet in Philly." One was coming from New York, the other from D.C. and it never occured to them that we could not be in Philly by lunch.


Posted by: MH | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 9:25 AM
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Hey, Tom Friedman, . Suck on this. (General Growth Properties finally declares bankruptcy.)


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 9:25 AM
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296: He said "references to," not the actual acts of shaving and perfuming while on stage.


Posted by: Cyrus | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 9:29 AM
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Swedish pop melodies are great, always so very catchy, their folksongs must be great melodical

Smetana's "Vltava" is based on a Swedish folk song, "Ack, Värmland du sköna". I don't know how Czechs feel about this.

I also find the English habit of putting sweet corn on pizza disgusting.

Must be one of those strange customs of peculiar island nations. The Japanese do it too.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 9:32 AM
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301: I think it figures in the Lysistrata, as one of the things women do for their husbands that presumably they won't do any more as part of their sex strike. I'm sure you're right that there are any pube shaving scenes in the major tragedies.

302: There's that. BUt also, crab lice. Apparently a big problem for promiscuous hairy hippies in the 60s.

303: Yeah, I'm whining too much. I rarely if ever get north of NYC these days, that's where it goes fastest. It averages only 80 MPH at most between DC and NY, faster in stretches I'm sure but still...frustrating.

304: Amtrak service outside the coasts is crazy...slow, and trains get in at the weirdest times.


Posted by: PGD | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 9:36 AM
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AREN'T any pube shaving scenes.


Posted by: PGD | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 9:37 AM
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Lord Sandwich, best known for putting a slice of beef between two slices of toast, is recorded as saying that no man who has enjoyed an intrigue with a Turkish lady can ever feel the the same way again about Englishwomen, or words to that effect. I assume he was referring to depilation. Me, I remain unconvinced.


Posted by: OneFatEnglishman | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 9:38 AM
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310: but have you ever enjoyed an intrigue with a Turkish lady?


Posted by: PGD | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 9:41 AM
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I rarely if ever get north of NYC these days, that's where it goes fastest

Some routes, maybe. Montpelier to Penn Station takes almost nine hours. You can drive it in less than half the time.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 9:44 AM
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306: I enjoy ambiguous sentences.


Posted by: MH | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 9:46 AM
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308:304: Amtrak service outside the coasts is crazy...slow, and trains get in at the weirdest times.

The problem with the rails is a) they ain't the straightest things out there and b) they aren't federally owned, so everything runs through CSX and the like, which are all about the cost cutting. If we had the equivalent of an interstate highway system for rail, we'd have a hell of a lot faster rail (and a lot less fuel wasted on trucking cargo).

I assume he was referring to depilation. Me, I remain unconvinced.

I vote for shaved vaginas and whatever hair seems reasonable on the pubes. Thank you for your support.

max
['Yes, I walk the walk, thank you.']


Posted by: max | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 9:48 AM
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Hey, has H-G been around since yesterday? Any news?


Posted by: JRoth | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 9:49 AM
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311. Alas no. I dated one once, but nothing came of it.


Posted by: OneFatEnglishman | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 9:49 AM
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shaved vaginas

Tricky maneuver, but I think hair in there is uncommon.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 9:51 AM
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316 to 315.


Posted by: Cryptic ned | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 9:51 AM
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308: It's mentioned in the Lysistrata, but not as something they won't do anymore. When the women are showing up from the various parts of Greece, two of the Athenian ladies start checking out the Boetian and one looks down her dress and says something like, "Oh! She's pulled the weeds!" probably expressing surprise that someone from the sticks would bother.


Posted by: oudemia | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 9:53 AM
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interesting.


Posted by: Cryptic ned | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 10:05 AM
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"Dildos were apparently one of Miletus' exports."


Posted by: | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 10:09 AM
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Tricky maneuver, but I think hair in there is uncommon.

Except for women who masturbate a lot.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 10:13 AM
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320: The Greek is more complicated. It says "she's well tended, having pulled up the pennyroyal."


Posted by: oudemia | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 10:15 AM
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Shaving is as I understand it, bad for hygiene.


Posted by: David Weman | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 10:24 AM
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Hey, I just saw a wild boar!


Posted by: David Weman | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 10:26 AM
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325. Nah, it was one of these guys.


Posted by: OneFatEnglishman | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 10:30 AM
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I like kebab pizza, and I'm not ashamed to say it.


Posted by: David Weman | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 10:34 AM
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323: But the one I linked contains even more information than that, saying the pennyroyal/pubic hair was trimmed OR BURNED into certain shapes, not necessarily removed. It's just in one of the 10,000 footnotes.

Kebab pizza sounds good. Never heard of such a thing.


Posted by: Cryptic ned | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 10:41 AM
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The problem with kebab pizza isn't that there's anything inherently wrong with the combination - there's not - but that anyplace likely to offer it is unlikely to do it well.

I actually knew of corn on pizza as a Japanese thing. Now I know who gave them the bad idea.

My German FIL disdains corn in all forms, which I find bizarre.


Posted by: JRoth | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 10:44 AM
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In Brazil they put ketchup and mustard on their pizza. I was thoroughly disgusted until I caved and tried it, and it's actually not bad. Different, but not bad.


Posted by: Brock Landers | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 10:46 AM
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While I'm blabbing about food, I'll tell you that I'm enjoying some great leftovers from a really wonderful, tiny Korean place run by just this one woman. It's way the hell out in the boonies*, but it's fantastic. She makes her own chili sauce and kimchis (note plural), but then uses packaged ramen (as a starting point) for noodle soup. Great stuff.

* although didn't MH once say that he reverse-commutes in a southerly direction? It's in Cecil.


Posted by: JRoth | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 10:47 AM
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When I was a kid, my mother used to put sweet pickle relish on frozen pizzas. I haven't had it in decades, but I liked it back then.


Posted by: apostropher | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 10:49 AM
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The dark side of Chinese cuisine: in 1983 canned corn was used on sweet French bread buns in Taiwan. Bamboo sprout + mayo was another big treat. There was also a deepfried pastry called a youtiao (= "grease stick") which people ate for breakfast.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 10:49 AM
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In Ukraine they put mayonnaise on their pizza. It's not very good.


Posted by: Bave Dee | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 10:49 AM
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329: But is the ketchup any good?

I believe I've already registered my complaint against German ketchup, which bears only a passing resemblance to Heinz. Which would be fine, except that everyone assures me that they only have it for the tourists. WTF? If you're catering to Americans, cater, please.


Posted by: JRoth | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 10:49 AM
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324: Shaving is as I understand it, bad for hygiene.

This is shaping up to be a great argument. Better than whether ketchup and mustard on pizza is thoroughly disgusting or not. The answer on that one seems clear.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 10:50 AM
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333's failed closed tag nicely conveys the horror of grease stick, which people ate for breakfast.


Posted by: JRoth | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 10:51 AM
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Shaving pizza, bad.

Ketchup and mustard on the mons veneris, also bad.


Posted by: Cryptic ned | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 10:52 AM
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It's interesting that the euphemism for pubes is Pennyroyal rather than a plant that looks more like hair. I wonder if it's connected to the fact that Pennyroyal is an abortifacient.


Posted by: togolosh | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 10:52 AM
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Also: What makes shaving bad for hygiene? Is it the little cuts that inevitably accompany a close shave?


Posted by: togolosh | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 10:53 AM
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The cuts are supposed to be little?

Shit.


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 10:59 AM
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Little cuts all over your pubic area are adorable.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 11:00 AM
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I know I've read it increases the risk of fungal infections.


Posted by: David Weman | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 11:00 AM
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331: Wasn't me. I have one of the most typical Pittsburgh commutes, Squirrel Hill to Oakland.


Posted by: MH | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 11:02 AM
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Little cuts on the mons veneris,
Little cuts made with razor blades.


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 11:02 AM
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339. Maybe. But pennyroyal would be pretty familiar. Also, it's short, dense and luxuriant.


Posted by: OneFatEnglishman | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 11:03 AM
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"The main theme of Vltava, Smetana admitted, was an adaption of the Swedish folk‐song Ack,
Värmeland, but this tune is itself an adaption of the old renaissance Italian song La Mantovana,
which interestingly enough forms the basis of the old Romanian folk song Oi Scha, which is the
basis the Israeli National anthem Hatikvah."

I did not know that.

You could make a pretty good mixtape just of versions of Ack Värmeland du sköna.


Posted by: David Weman | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 11:03 AM
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This suggests a heretofore unthought-of interpretation of Nirvana's "Pennyroyal Tea".


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 11:06 AM
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344: Huh. I was also convinced you lived on the South Side.


Posted by: JRoth | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 11:19 AM
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Hey, not to nudge any of the front pagers, but I have a potential Ask The Mineshaft, if anyone wants it.

I was going to use the pause/play symbols, but to what end?


Posted by: JRoth | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 11:20 AM
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Better you should pause, and play cymbals.


Posted by: OneFatEnglishman | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 11:22 AM
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Confoundingly, I do not recall MH being around much if at all in the past, and had thought him to be a new(ish?) commenter.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 11:29 AM
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328: Oooh! I didn't see the footnote. I was like, yeah, ok, it says the same thing. Yep -- they singed hair off. The Romans did too. A good friend of mine from grad school just has a book out now on Roman women's cosmetic arts. Crazy!


Posted by: | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 11:32 AM
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Oops. Twas I.


Posted by: oudemia | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 11:33 AM
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352: In a failed effort to finish a paper, I gave up Unfogged for Lent. But, I hadn't been here for more than a few months before that.


Posted by: MH | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 11:34 AM
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All of Lent you gave up Unfogged, and still the paper you never finished?


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 11:38 AM
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You can email me your question, if you like.


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 11:38 AM
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JRoth, do send the Ask the Mineshaft to neb. Not to be all me, me, me, but I could use a distraction. My eldest cat seems to be in the process of moving on to the great mousing farm in the sky, and I'm in attendance, as calm as can be, sure, calm as can be.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 11:44 AM
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And you can email him pictures of your genitalia, if you love.


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 11:46 AM
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Actually the c0ck@unfogged.com address hasn't been set up yet.


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 11:46 AM
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356: People keeping wanting new/revised analyses.


Posted by: MH | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 11:48 AM
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358: Oh, dear, parsi. I'm sorry.


Posted by: oudemia | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 11:52 AM
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363

361 to 359/360.


Posted by: Cyrus | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 11:56 AM
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Anything can be put on pizza, because it is opson. I'd make the analogy to shaving the pubes and other ?luxuries?, except that it's a banned analogy and anyway has been done at length.


Posted by: clew | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 11:57 AM
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358 - I'm sorry to hear that. The day we put one of ours down a couple years ago was sad indeed.


Posted by: fedward | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 11:58 AM
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Sorry to hear it, parsimon.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 11:58 AM
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||
Revealed! A writer too churlish and contrarian to write for Slate.
|>


Posted by: pain perdu | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 12:00 PM
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I don't know, Slate pretty much reached the contrarian singularity with this one.


Posted by: Cryptic ned | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 12:02 PM
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363: Thanks. Calm. She weighs 3.8 lbs. for crying out loud. 20 years old. She's a trooper, for sure. I'm just going to hang out with her for a while.

Carry on, carry on!


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 12:03 PM
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Poor creature. Good luck!


Posted by: Cryptic ned | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 12:04 PM
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358. Sorry to here that. Very old?


Posted by: OneFatEnglishman | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 12:04 PM
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371 crossed with 369. Sorry to seem crass.


Posted by: OneFatEnglishman | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 12:07 PM
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If you need a distraction parsimon, copy this link (www.myspace.com/exgirlfriendsclub) into your browser and watch the video for "Lightning Bolt." I went out with that guy, if you can believe it (it was horrible, horrible). It's been cracking me up all day; I hope it cheers you up some.


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 12:09 PM
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Now isn't the time to lord your fast internet connection over parsimon.


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 12:12 PM
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Oh. Sorry.


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 12:13 PM
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373: Wow, JM. You said you liked 'em skinny and you really meant it!


Posted by: oudemia | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 12:22 PM
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Sorry about your kitty, Parsi.


Posted by: togolosh | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 12:24 PM
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Now isn't the time to lord your fast internet connection over parsimon.

Harrumph. At least parsimon doesn't have a corporate net nanny that blocks access to Myspace.


Posted by: pain perdu | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 12:25 PM
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The video is just a rock band performing live, with the singer occasionally punching the air and falling down and otherwise acting drunk.


Posted by: Cryptic ned | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 12:27 PM
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Ack Värmeland du sköna:

Jussi Björling
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kXPPMYyJl-g
Esther & Abi Ofarim 1969
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-adUYvCvBTM
Zarah Leander 1965 (Not prime ZL, but fun)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jpDfZ_oq-oY&feature=related
Stan Getz 1951 (as Dear Old Stockholm)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o2qnZ3cW7bw&feature=related
Stan Getz and Chet Baker 1983
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ksQBfJ968TA


Posted by: David Weman | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 12:27 PM
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Johan på Snippen

I'll listen to the songs in 380 later.


Posted by: Cryptic ned | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 12:30 PM
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375: 's'alright. It's just that the vet this morning asked if I wanted to let her go now, while she was there, or bring her home, and that kind of knocked me over. Home, yes. She's being a trooper, had a little tuna water and a small piece of cheese, and she's confused, but she's mostly just sleeping. She's a grand kitty who has been with me a long time.

I really don't want to obsess over this, so if someone could put up a new post, it would be great.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 12:33 PM
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JRoth isn't working with me.


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 12:35 PM
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Bastard.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 12:38 PM
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363: Thanks. Calm. She weighs 3.8 lbs. for crying out loud. 20 years old. She's a trooper, for sure. I'm just going to hang out with her for a while.

Yeah, it really really sucks when they get that skinny. I'm sorry.

max
['SUCK!']


Posted by: max | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 12:38 PM
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I'm sorry about your kitty, Parsimon.


Posted by: Mary Catherine | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 12:44 PM
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383: Hey! I had work to do (which, in light of the ATM, is kind of funny).


Posted by: JRoth | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 12:51 PM
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380: Awesome. I did a quick look on YouTube for "La Mantovana" but only came up with an improvisation for harpsichord and an arrangement for chitarrone.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 12:59 PM
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Hey, I just saw a wild boar!


Posted by: David Weman | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 1:02 PM
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Sorry about your cat, Parsimon. If you want to be cheered up, watch the clip jesurislac posted:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9lp0IWv8QZY


Posted by: David Weman | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 1:10 PM
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Maybe it was a unicorn, David. Wild boars are rare on the internet.


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 1:18 PM
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Re folk music, we briefly visited my 94-year old great-uncle this easter and admired his keyharp that he had built himself. He thought building it was the fun part.


Posted by: David Weman | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 1:26 PM
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Won't anyone validate my opinion that the rock band in question is really, truly awful?


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 1:49 PM
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That's what your thing for skinny dudes gets you, JM.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 1:52 PM
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He wasn't in a band when I dated him! He would've liked to be, but he couldn't sing. Apparently the other musicians assured him that that didn't matter.


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 1:58 PM
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I found his occasional british accent funny. It thought Green Day were the last to do that, but maybe it's the hot new trend.


Posted by: David Weman | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 1:59 PM
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At first I thought it was a young elk!


Posted by: David Weman | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 2:03 PM
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325, 389, 397


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 2:26 PM
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Indeed.


Posted by: David Weman | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 2:47 PM
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JP Stormcrow, are you saying you posted 325, 389 and 397?


Posted by: | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 2:57 PM
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Where was this wild boar? Are you blogging off in the Swedish bush country somewhere?


Posted by: John Emerson | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 3:00 PM
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401.last: And thus, we're back on topic.


Posted by: Cyrus | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 3:08 PM
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It's called "hogging". Short for hog-blogging.

Seriously, I do not understand this boar thing. What is that bus? Is that like a series of buses with a series of famous quotes on them, like the Starbucks cups? Is it a series of buses with non-sequiturs on them? If so, why are they attributed? Who is David Weman anyway, besides a blogger? And #400 was me.


Posted by: Cryptic ned | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 3:12 PM
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Hogging.


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 3:15 PM
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393: Those noises were a crime against music. Horrible crap.


Posted by: togolosh | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 3:26 PM
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Jackmormon: It's only funny to see somebody suck if you have reason to wish them ill.


Posted by: Es-tonea-pesta | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 3:30 PM
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Sorry about your cat, parsimon.


Posted by: bob mcmanus | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 4:33 PM
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i: i am becks style on MEAD ffs
ii: this is the dark ages nor are we out of it
iii: best kind thoughts re parsimon's cat, insert korrekt anglo-saxon emoticon HERE
iv: naturally we aced the beer festival pub quiz


Posted by: tierce de lollardie | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 5:07 PM
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Did you like it? Was it really sweet?


Posted by: David Weman | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 5:10 PM
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Good mead isn't really sweet.


Posted by: nosflow | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 5:15 PM
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this was very bad mead then because we are HARDCORE SAXON MASSIVE

(it is quite sweet: basically it is honey with a very late-acting SOMETHING to follow, it didn't really kick in till i was tryin to get off the bus in one piece)

(first time it was served in tiny shot glasses: when we were drinking our winnings it came in BIG SPIRITS GLASSES)


Posted by: tierce de lollardie | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 5:32 PM
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ps CAPS LCOK FOR THE WIN


Posted by: tierce de lollardie | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 5:32 PM
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401: You're never far from a forest in Sweden.


Posted by: David Weman | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 5:52 PM
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nice youtube clips, DW, thanks, really great scenery, a little bit resembling Siberia, do your trees bloom like here, all trees bloom, which is really like wonderment, i recalled now another thing i like here
our trees if bloom so very unnoticeably, i wonder whether tree flowers take that much heat/energy or cause the tree to loose it so they can grow only in the warmer climates
or why people don't use tree flowers for flower arrangements or maybe they use i just don't know
i talk about real trees, not just bushes
i think i've learned the melody so well that can recognize now the song


Posted by: read | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 6:51 PM
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405.---THANK YOU.
406.---Can't you wish him ill by proxy? I promise he deserves it.


Posted by: Jackmormon | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 7:23 PM
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tierce should keep commenting.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 7:26 PM
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There are many kinds of HARDCORE SAXON MASSIVE mead, some of which is sweet. Don't you worry, tierce.


Posted by: Sifu Tweety | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 7:27 PM
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Where was this wild boar? Are you blogging off in the Swedish bush country somewhere?

I am Curious: Brown and Hairy.


Posted by: Jesus McQueen | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 7:33 PM
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403: What is that bus?


Posted by: JP Stormcrow | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 7:49 PM
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Read, of course none of those versions were a lot like Swedish folk music.

Here's some good examples.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jHjYFcpHPtk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54qakRcV0GY


Posted by: David Weman | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 7:51 PM
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tierce is totally cute upthread! Which is saying something, since otherwise his refusal of capital letters has pained me, and I've struggled to overcome this prejudice of mine.


Posted by: parsimon | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 8:09 PM
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||

PassOVER! Time for a beer.

|>


Posted by: teofilo | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 8:24 PM
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Jackmormon: I just watched the link, and can assure you that the band sucks. The guy is good looking, though, and poses well. I can see sleeping with him.


Posted by: rob helpy-chalk | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 8:28 PM
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422: W00t! A beer and a baguette?


Posted by: oudemia | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 8:30 PM
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420 i liked the jazz version very much and the old lady's singing was very powerful, she stresses so great rrrs, Swedish sounds a very strongly stressed language


Posted by: read | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 8:36 PM
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No baguettes on hand, unfortunately. Not a lot of chometz of any description.


Posted by: teofilo | Link to this comment | 04-16-09 8:38 PM
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oops! oof

(feels like no harm done, not quite sure how there)


Posted by: tierce de lollardie | Link to this comment | 04-17-09 2:31 AM
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tierce is a boy? somehow the delicate uncapitalization made me feel that he was feminine.


Posted by: alameida | Link to this comment | 04-17-09 7:49 AM
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tierce is whatever you want me to be

i am in fact feelin very delicate indeed today -- mead, it's all abt the aftermath


Posted by: tierce de lollardie | Link to this comment | 04-17-09 8:43 AM
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tierce is whatever you want me to be

i am in fact feelin very delicate indeed today -- mead, it's all abt the aftermath


Posted by: tierce de lollardie | Link to this comment | 04-17-09 8:43 AM
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